There are some forms of quackery that I’ve never been able to understand, quackery that is so bizarre, so without a reasonable scientific rationale, and so potentially harmful that it boggles my mind that anyone would think it is a good idea. One of these is something called the Miracle Mineral Solution (MMS), something I first took notice of nearly six years ago. MMS, of course, turns out to be a form of bleach. Specifically, it is, in essence, industrial strength bleach, 28% sodium chlorite in distilled water. It is frequently diluted in acidic juices, such as orange juice, resulting in the formation of chlorine dioxide, which is, as the FDA characterized it, “a potent bleach used for stripping textiles and industrial water treatment.” According to its proponents, MMS can cure almost anything: cancer, AIDS, and just about any other serious disease you can imagine. Never mind that there is no biological plausibility and no evidence, either preclinical or clinical, that MMS can do what its proponents claim it can do. True, bleach can kill bacteria or cancer cells in a dish at a high enough concentration, but that doesn’t mean it’s a useful antibiotic or chemotherapeutic agent. Feeding autistic children bleach or, even worse, subjecting them to bleach enemas, is horrifying.
I haven’t written about MMS in a while. The last time I did was in 2016, when I discussed a joint investigation between ABC’s 20/20 and the southern California affiliate ABC7 looking at MMS, Jim Humble, founder of the Genesis II Church (which teaches that MMS is the treatment for everything that ails you), and Kerri Rivera, an “autism biomed” advocate who rose to infamy back in 2012 as a prime advocate of bleaching away autism. It was a form of autism quackery that had had its bizarre day and then faded into the obscurity of only the most bizarre underground places of the “autism biomed” movement. Or so I thought.
Unfortunately, I thought wrong:
A father in Indianapolis last week accused his wife of feeding their child bleach to help cure her autism – something his wife had read about in a Facebook group.
Police arrested the 28-year-old mother on Saturday after she allegedly put drops of hydrochloric acid and water-purifying solution in her young daughter’s drinks. The potentially dangerous chemical combination, which becomes an industrial bleach, is marketed as Miracle Mineral Solution or Master Mineral Solution, which its advocates claim will cure a number of diseases, including autism, cancer, AIDS and hepatitis.
I must admit that the hydrochloric acid (HCl) is a new and scary twist on this particularly quackery. In the past, MMS advocates advocated using a weak acid in the form of a citrus juice like lemon or orange juice. Depending on the strength of the HCl solution used to “activate” the MMS by releasing the chlorine dioxide bleach, there is great potential for disaster there.
To the best of my knowledge, advocacy of using MMS, either orally or by enema or both first bubbled up from the underground autism “biomed” quackery movement in 2012. As I mentioned before, at that year’s edition of the yearly antivaccine autism quackfest Autism One, Kerri Rivera gave a talk touting how she supposedly “recovered” 38 autistic children in 20 months. At the time, Rivera was running a clinic in Puerto Vallarta, Mexico that she called AutismO2 Clinica Hyperbarica. Surprisingly, the protocol is still there. I say “surprisingly,” because in 2015, facing legal action from the Illinois Attorney General, she signed an assurance of voluntary compliance under which she was barred in Illinois from (a) selling chlorine dioxide or similar substances to Illinois residents and (b) presenting at future Illinois conferences concerning the use of such substances to treat autism. Apparently, though, she is still operating in Mexico.
It’s a long time since I discussed this, I thought I’d go over Rivera’s protocols. There are slideshows on Rivera’s website, albeit in Spanish. Much of them parrot the same sort of nonsense that antivaxers like to parrot, for instance, a model in which “toxins,” diet, genetics, and antibiotics “load the gun.” There’s also a bit about “biofilms there” too. There’s a mention of chelation therapy. Indeed, it’s pretty standard issue chelation therapy quackery. As you may recall, chelation therapy is a quack therapy used in autism that presumes that autism is due to “heavy metal toxicity.” Chelating agents bind to heavy metals and facilitate their excretion in the urine. Unfortunately, among the heavy metals removed are calcium and magnesium, and lowering levels of those two metals too much can result in cardiac arrhythmias and death. This is not a theoretical danger.
Then there’s the MMS protocol. Here, for instance, is the protocol I discussed in 2012:
10-15 drops MMS enabled and 500 mL water
In the colon for 12 – 30 minutes
Use pipette and syringe
Is applied 2 or 3 times per week
It goes beyond that, though. I also noted that proponents of MMS not only give MMS to autistic children orally, but bathes them in it and gives them enemas with it. Rivera advocated continually upping the dose. She even discussed the potential adverse reactions. I discussed a video in which she discussed how autistic children might get diarrhea from the MMS, but how that was OK as long as it was “detox diarrhea.” She even likened the reaction she expected to a Herxheimer reaction, which is sometimes seen after the initiation of antibacterials for tick borne relapsing fever. It was first described as a reaction to the treatment of syphilis with penicillin and is also seen after treatment of other diseases caused by spirochetes, such as Lyme disease and leptospirosis. Basically, this reaction is due to the release of endotoxin-like products by microorganisms as they die off during antibiotic treatment. Rivera also discussed what she referred to as the “72-2” protocol, which involves giving MMS every two hours for 72 hours. She also recommended “fever therapy” and argued that it’s a good thing that MMS can cause fevers because it’s “waking up the immune system” which realizes that there’s “autism in the house.” She also exulted about how she “loves the enemas” so much for autism.
Surprisingly, her original MMS handout is still available on the Autism One website. I strongly suspect that the Autism One web people simply forgot to get rid of it, which is why I made sure to download a copy immediately as soon as I noticed that it was still there. There’s some hilarious stuff there. (At least, it would be hilarious if not for the vile quackery the claims support.) For instance, there is this:
• Autism is made up of pathogens
– Virus
– Bacteria
– Parasites
– Candida
– Heavy Metals
– Inflammation
– Food allergies• MMS kills pathogens and neutralizes heavy metals, as well as reduces inflammation.
No, autism is not “made up of pathogens.” Nor is it caused by heavy metals. Even if it were, feeding autistic children bleach and giving them bleach enemas would not eliminate those heavy metals. I do have to admit to some amusement, though, at Rivera’s choice of closing quote:
“Miracles happen every day. Not just in remote country villages or at holy sites halfway across the globe, but here, in our own lives.” – Deepak Chopra.
Yes, that seems appropriate.
Just how nasty this is can be appreciated if you read my discussion of a mother subjecting her child to Kerri’s MMS protocol. During her child’s treatment, she took photos of what came out of her child’s colon. At the time, I likened her “journey” to that of patients undergoing “liver flush” quackery, who claim to be “flushing out” gallstones that are in reality a product of the treatment, not gallstones. In this case, the mother is claiming to flush out “worms. Indeed, the very first example of this can be found in an entry called Worm. Here’s where the gross pictures begin. Now take a look at that link and the picture contained therein. It’s basically a stringy bit of something that looks a little bit like a worm. Jojo’s mom asked her buddies on the MMS Facebook group, all of whom were “pretty sure” it was a worm. It’s not. Any surgeon or doctor who deals with GI problems will recognize it as a bit of mucus, possibly with a bit of colon mucosa (the lining of the colon). We see this sort of thing all the time, and it’s definitely not a worm.
Over the month of April and into May, Jojo’s mother treated her blog readers to regular photos of things like this. For instance, in this post, she spread a bunch of nasty stuff out and photographed it. Kerri Rivera, we are told, informed her that this stuff is “worm INTESTINES. The outer skin is already digested and the inside (intestines etc) disintegrates like this.” No, it was just more mucus mixed with colonic mucosa. Disturbingly to me as a surgeon, it looked to me like a fairly decent-sized chunk of colonic mucosa with mucus. I couldn’t say for sure how large it was because Jojo’s mom was, unfortunately, not kind enough to provide a ruler next to it. We were also treated to more pictures of mucus and sloughed colon mucosa, which Rivera characterizes once again as ” the intestines of the worm, the outer ‘skin’ having already been digested.”
Unfortunately, the Indiana mother described in news reports earlier this week is not alone in subjecting her autistic child to bleach. For instance, last August, there was this news report:
The woman, from Cheshire, has been reported to police for her activity in a secret Facebook group for parents that claims autism is caused by parasites that can be cleansed using the potentially lethal treatment.
However, autism campaigner Emma Dalmayne who infiltrated the group, says the images actually show children’s bowel lining that has been burned away by the bleach.
The treatment being administered is CD (Chloride Dioxide) or MMS (Miracle Mineral Solution), which is administered orally or via an enema.
Dalmayne reported some truly horrible things:
No parents will admit to doing this to their children publicly. This treatment is not illegal at the moment but we need to get rid of it,’ said the mother-of-six.
‘The most extreme case I have seen to date is a six-year-old boy who had to have his bowel removed and a colostomy bag fitted after his parents gave him these enemas.
‘What you see in these images is the bowel lining of these victims.’
One British mum, an NHS finance worker, wrote that her son had began to suffer diarrhoea.
Another woman suggests kids should be given 16 doses of the chemical chlorine dioxide each day for between three and six months.
In private messages to our investigator, a mum described how she has turned to chlorine dioxide in desperation.
She explained how her two-year-old “cried really hard” when he was given his first enemas using a water bottle but how things are getting “better and better”.
Trying to convince herself she was doing the right thing, she wrote: “Some mean people said it’s bleach and harmful for kids. But it’s helped so many!”
No. It. Hasn’t. At least these news stories reported correctly what all the nasty stuff these mothers of autistic children were inducing their children to excreted from their rectums: Mucus, colonic lining, and poop. They also show images of skin burns from MMS.
so where is all this MMS quackery originating from? I mentioned Jim Humble, who is the founder of the Genesis II Church. Yes, indeed, there’s religion in this quackery, and Genesis II touts it for autism, breast cancer, malaria, and many other diseases. Humble himself claims that he is from another galaxy. Not surprisingly, Humble’s “archbishop” Mark Grenon claimed immunity due to his being an archbishop and Genesis II being a church.
Actually, it’s more like a cult. In reality, it’s a bleach cult, as this Irish report shows, with its expose on quack Dr. Andreas Kalcker. Interestingly, a chemical analysis of MMS undertaken by the reporters doing this segment found that MMS was 90@ sodium chlorite and 10% chlorine dioxide, both of which are toxic.
Elsewhere in Ireland:
An appeal by a Kildare man against his conviction for the manufacture and supply of an industrial bleach product as illegal medicine has been struck out after he failed to show up in court.
The Circuit Court in Naas struck out the appeal by Patrick Merlehan, who was convicted on 27 October 2016 at Naas District Court of the manufacture and supply of Miracle Mineral Solution, on the Irish market, and was fined a total of €4,000.
Merlehan was fined a total of €4,000 for the manufacture and supply of the unauthorised medicinal product.
And:
Merlehan had offered an autism activist, Fiona O’Leary, MMS as a claimed cure for her child’s autism. Ms O’Leary gave evidence in the 2016 case.
Good going, Fiona!
I’ll end as I began. Jim Humble and Kerri Rivera are quacks of the vilest sort, selling ineffective and potentially dangerous bleach, all the while attacking their critics as vigorously as I mentioned about other quacks yesterday. They’ve also created what advocates call the “CD community” (for chlorine dioxide), where parents swap stories of their experiences with MMS. I keep asking this question: Will the autism “biomed” underground ever renounce using bleach to treat autism? The answer, sadly, appears to be no.
263 replies on “Parents are still feeding their children bleach to “cure” their autism”
It would be nice if some hacktivists would get into these idiots facebook pages and pass this evidence of child abuse to the appropriate CPS/LE. Would seem to be an open and shut case since the perpetrator is uploading photographic evidence and confessions onto the web.
Being currently involved in investigations into the supply chain of some of these products etc, there are limits to what I can say. It’s not just Humble and his crew. There are other people without direct links that manufacture and supply MMS products under a number of different websites and product names. There seems to be at least one large international distribution network with links to the UK, Australia, Germany, France, the Philippines, Thailand, Hong Kong and Turkey. There may be others. There is also the case of Stanley Nowak and the “Aerobic Oxygen” product – facing multiple charges in Canada. Nowak was supplying Humble’s acolyte Daniel Louis Smith – https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/seller-miracle-mineral-solution-convicted-marketing-toxic-chemical-miracle-cure
What’s with the “stabbed to death” bit in one of the quotes?
It’s an unrelated headline that Orac accidentally included in his copy-paste from that article. When I went to the link whence that quote was taken, I got a different headline, “Boy who raped woman on his birthday and left her for dead is jailed for 11 years”, in the same spot.
Clearly the bleach has side effects
It’s fixed now.
Ah – that makes sense. I was just a bit more confused than my usual state!
Actually some people – like Mr. Handley – have said publicly they do this thing to their children. See also the comments. http://www.ageofautism.com/2015/01/whos-afraid-of-autism-recovery.html
It’s just sad that parents are misled into doing this to their children.
How can something that is so clearly harmful and dangerous not considered child abuse?
Because it’s “abuse” when done to a child who is neurotypical / able-bodied, but it’s “therapy” if the child is neurodivergent / disabled. According to people who do horrible things like MMS, “neurodivergent / disabled children aren’t really human until they’re cured of their disease.”
(I’m an autistic adult btw.)
This is the saddest thing about the whole exercise.
Chris preston,
There is a whole story to that, one which I’ve been researching on and off for years but I’m not done yet. That said, I did witness a number of individuals, in real-life, in the literature, books, etc… not consider us, autistic as human; thus, everything and the kitchen sink is allowed.
Alain
Shay, it certainly meets the criteria for physical and most likely emotional abuse herein UK-ia.
If anyone in my old CAMH service had come across this sort of treatment of any bairn referred to us we would have been straight on to our local child protection team.
As a mom whose kid started out life with a frightening illness, it brings me to tears that parents are duped into causing serious harm to their children in the name of a “cure”. (Here comes my newborn-in-pain-wailing PTSD …)
Using a dangerous concentrated chemical (in supposedly harmless dilutions, which still cause tissue damage and illness) is also the M.O. of hydrogen peroxide users (H202, doncha know, is good for what ails you too). The other hazard is leaving bottles of the concentrated stuff around the house, where small children can get into it and be poisoned more quickly.
“I discussed a video in which she discussed how autistic children might get diarrhea from the MMS, but how that was OK as long as it was “detox diarrhea.”
One marvels at the mental gyrations which allow parents to dismiss symptoms of toxicity in this manner (similar to the way alt cancer cure enthusiasts who disdain chemotherapy, dismiss vomiting and diarrhea secondary to ingestion of quack remedies like “oleander tea).
These are the same people who rail about “toxins” in vaccines and everyday products and foods.
Another argument for mandatory critical thinking courses in schools.
I’m eagerly awaiting your article where you find some group of parents advocating bleeding, purgatives, emetics, antimony, arsenic, and mercury. After all, they worked (???) 200 years ago. It’s bad enough with chelation therapy which to the uninitiated who believes the mercury link makes some sense (note. doesn’t work and has killed at least two kids); but how brain dead can people be? I guess using bleach answers the question. They should be prosecuted for child abuse!
Actually except for bleeding all of those things do work for some medical conditions. They don’t work well, and they have horrid side effects.
Bleach enemas on the other hand, have no good effects.
Regular repeated phlebotomy (bleeding) is actually an effective treatment for polycythemia vera, porphyria cutanea tarda and hemochromatosis. A single phlebotomy can dramatically relieve acute pulmonary edema due to heart failure. I suspect that’s why bleeding continued to be used for so many years because of this unusual but dramatic response.
@ Christine
Arsenic was used against syphilis; but please tell me what mercury and antimony were used for that conferred any benefit? And bleeding is used for hemochromatosis and polycythemia, both rare. Purgatives (laxatives) are, of course, used for constipation; but not in the quantities used 200 years ago. Emetics are used to induce vomiting if someone has ingested a poison. However, the point I was making is that all of them were used in excessive amounts for every imaginable condition. Some don’t work at all, and are poisonous, mercury and antimony, and the others were all given at doses much higher than even imaginable today, causing harm. So, yep, on rare occasions one of the above, except purgatives that are often used (but, again, not at the doses used 200 years ago), but alone, not altogether, may be used.
I love it when someone like you tries to come up with exceptions to the rule. When you do it, at least, specify what your exceptions are.
@Joel It was not my intention to mislead.
Mercury was the standard treatment for syphilis for a very long time. It was applied to the lesions, and effectively killed the bacteria and suppressed the lesions. It was unsafe to take internally, and had to be used with caution even then. Arsenic for syphilis was actually a fairly late advance. Perhaps you have heard the old adage: One night with Venus, a lifetime with Mercury?
Antimony was recommended as a treatment for leishmaniasis and schistosomiasis (parasites) in the 14th century and is still in use today in some regions.
Emetics treat pneumonia, and laxatives treat worms. These are all real treatments, as effective as anything available at the time.
I think they should use it on themselves, so they can experience the benefits first hand.
If there are people who I want to give a taste of their own medicine, it’s people who do this to children.
Ditto, ditto.
This being the US, Grenon’s gambit will probably work, unfortunately. What the Genesis II people are doing may be stupid, but it is not as blatantly illegal as the <a href=”
gt;Ethiopian Zion Coptic Church, which was being used as a front for smuggling marijuana. (“Square Grouper” is the euphemistic term for bales of marijuana that are thrown overboard when a smuggling boat’s crew realizes the Coast Guard are about to search their vessel.)
And anti-vaxxers label those who support vaccines as “CHILD ABUSERS”! Rivera was allowed to present at AutismOne.
( -btw- is she still located in Mexico?)
What I can’t fathom is that if pieces of the intestinal mucosa are being burned out and expelled, wouldn’t there be blood accompanying them which should frighten at least some of the saner parents enough to stop this horror?
For g-d’s sake, I have an animal with IBD that sometimes produces a little blood and I found that scary enough to speak to an expert.- and that was small amounts of blood without intestinal mucosa..
I’m guessing that there probably was blood, but that the MMS believers washed it off, along with the stool. Blood would look bad; it would look as though they were doing damage. So photographing the stuff strained from their child’s poop with blood in it wouldn’t make it look as though MMS were safe. But I don’t know for sure.
As for Kerri Rivera, she didn’t present at Autism One just once. She presented at least three times that I’m aware of. She was kind of a yearly feature for a while.
My SIL was big into this, maybe still is. When I said it was bleach and a bad idea, she earnestly informed that yes, some critics claim it is just bleach but it really is different. I said the chemicals don’t really care what you think, they don’t change their behaviour just to suit random claims. This is the same person that is violently against chlorination and fluoridation of water supplies. I would have thought that the mental contortions would be too tiresome and painful to maintain but apparently, no.
She doesn’t ask my opinion about her treatments anymore.
Got to love the hypocrisy. Vilify chemicals of all sorts in the vaccines, the aluminum, the formaldehyde, but praise these other chemicals, the EDTA and the Chlorine dioxide. Can anybody pick the toxin out of this line up?
I don’t look for them but have accidentally found several MMS groups on Facebook which I tried reporting for violation of TOS.
None were taken down.
I am always angry at all the cruel and dangerous autism quackery out there.
There is no “cure” for autism – it’s mainly due to differences in the structure of the brain and there s no way in hell that any of their hateful crap will of can do anything about it. Neither can anyone or anything else.
I and the rest of us with autism spectrum conditions (I will not use “disorder” to label the spectrum”.) who are capable of expressing ourselves in this matter don’t want to be “cured”. We are not a disease. We are not an infection or a cancer or anything else in that line, and we are far from being the living dead these despicable people consider us to be. We are human beings, a different kind of human being I’ll agree, but whatever our place on the spectrum, we demand to be treated with the same decency, the same respect, as any other kind of human being.
Squirting industrial bleach into our colons isn’t the way to do that.
If any of these monstrous people want me to administer bleach enemas to them 16 times a day I will be more than happy to oblige. After all, it cures so many things that it ought to benefit neurotypicals almost as much as it does us.
Dave, you are not even a different type of human being. You are plain old Homo Sapien like the rest of us. You just happen to have a brain that interprets the world in a more obviously different manner then most. Better??? Worse??? Nope. Just different.
Too many people look for any reason to be mindlessly cruel. I eagerly await a genetic test to weed out those that have Neanderthal and Denisovian genes.
And the site stripped my sarcasm tag from the last sentence. For those that are unsure, YES I WAS BEING SARCASTIC.
Anon. P, thank you for your viewpoint. You and I are both right about what kind of human I am, depending on the angle of view. After all, a Negrillo, an Olympic pole vaulter, or a lyric poet are all Homo sapiens, but they are also different kinds of humans from most others, whether by genes, abilities, education, and so many other variables.
As for genes, the Homo sapiens genome includes genes from Homo neandertalensis, Homo denisovensis, and Homo heidelbergensis, leading to the inevitable conclusion that our ancestors were a lot of Homo-sexuals.
Having had a genetic analysis and discovered that I have a higher than average Neanderthal gene makeup, I am glad to see your clarification.
Remember, it’s not sciencey unless it’s a “protocol.”
“Remember, it’s not sciencey unless it’s a “protocol.””
And you must follow it on your “healing journey”.
Whilst you become more spiritual, documenting your progress by journaling
( Holy crap, guys, we can write a woo tome)
you are indeed a child of the universe! the elemental stuff of your being was forged in the dying hearts of stars and after traveling unimaginable interstellar distances and insurmountable odds has come together to produce your uniqueness. as you ingest your daily bio-photons, you are imbued with more star stuff. in this way, we are all part of the amazing quantum entanglement of universal love!
Tim Leary beat you to it (leading to his excommunication from the Neo-American Church; my own was merely routine).
To UK Homeopathy Regulation, I live in Thailand now. If someone is involved in the this MMS scam in Thailand, a world of hurt can come down on them if you get the King’s sister involved.
As the stepfather to a 5 month old now, I would go ballistic if someone tried to use this on her. Me going ballistic is not a nice thing, even if it is only verbal. Let’s not talk about physical.
Sarcasm alert: I can cure any disease or condition with chlorine dioxin. The only issue is that the host always dies. Very uncouth of them.
Next time use square brackets: [/s]
I’m guessing that Orac has no plans to attend the “Spirit of Health” Scamboree in Berlin in May… organised by Jim Humble’s German acolytes, also offering Stan Burzynski as a speaker.
It is a commendably ecumenical event — I suspect that ArchBish Humble wants to rally other Alt-Med grifters around himself so he can promote himself to Pope — and there will also be Urine Therapists in attendance (better health through drinking piss), and Jeff Bradstreet’s old mate, Marco Ruggiero.
I strongly suspect the urine therapists of taking he piss.
If the traditional medical system could prevent or cure autism, why would MMS even be a topic?
The failed traditional medical system creates autism and MMS usage shows how desperate parents are to help their injured child.
Safety studies of aluminum in vaccines lack immunotoxicity analysis of this immunological adjuvant: Ignorance or deception?
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1117242
“Aluminum immunotoxicity followed by neurotoxicity in autism
Many vaccines contain casein or casamino acids of bovine milk origin and are thus contaminated with all bovine milk proteins.3,24 One such protein is the bovine folate receptor (FR) protein.25 Such aluminum adjuvanted, bovine FR protein contaminated vaccines can cause IgE mediated sensitization to the FR protein (aluminum adjuvant induced Th2 response1).4,6,10 Since FR concentration in bovine milk is low, the patient can still consume bovine milk without developing an allergic reaction.25,26 It has been shown that consuming milk when sensitized (via an oral immunotherapy protocol, for example) will result in the synthesis of IgG4 antibodies specific to milk proteins.8 In this case, bovine milk consumption causes FR specific IgG4 synthesis. These IgG4 antibodies cross-react with human folate receptors. Human and bovine FR proteins have 90% amino acid sequence homology.27 IgG4 specific to FR is the main antibody involved in binding/blocking folate receptors in the choroid plexus, blocking folate uptake to the brain.27 This results in cerebral folate deficiency and autism.28 Folate deficiency in turn, results in aluminum accumulation in the brain and aluminum induced neurotoxicity.29–31 The source of the aluminum could of course be the diet, pollutant inhalation and aluminum adjuvanted vaccines. Mold et al.32 have demonstrated such aluminum accumulation in human autistic brain tissue”
Where do you people get off? Those of us on the spectrum are not “injured” and we don’t need “curing”. Shove your condescending arrogance where the sun don’t shine, Vinu.
I’m glad you wrote that, Rich.
So many of the anti-vaxxers I read discuss children as though they were “broken”
I’d ask them: “What are they SUPPOSED to be anyway?”
A little copy of yourself? Some other form of perfection that exists IN YOUR MIND? A vehicle for your wants and needs? Someone to brag about to other Kaffeklatsch moms?
Of course, parents of neurotypical kids may be just as clueless but they don’t subject their children to bizarre medical procedures ( but probably endless after school tutoring and music classes).
Someone at AoA discusses ( mostly on twitter. @ kimrossi1111) how she adores teaching average kids ( non- ASD)…. Never once talking about how she could adapt her classes ( martial arts) for children like her own.
SERIOUSLY. Hasn’t she seen how other sports have been taught to people with ASDs or other conditions?
Children have different skills and abilities. If parents only look at what is their own preconceived notions, they’ll stay as lost as they are now..
I’m lucky because my own skills matched what my parents valued HOWEVER my cousin was pushed towards a clerical career because her mother, my aunt, didn’t want to pay for university for ” a girl who would probably get married anyway” ( this was in the 1960s not 1920s -btw-) She could have done much more – and did- on her own but it was never easy for her,
If you are on the spectrum and are not suffering in any way, that’s fantastic and I wish you continued good health.
If you are suffering in any way, sorry to hear that.
Many people on the spectrum are certainly not normal. If your body is making folate receptor alpha antibodies (FRAA) which are blocking folate uptake to your brain and affecting your health due to cerebral folate deficiency (CFD), that is injury and needs to be cured. CFD is not normal, otherwise it won’t be called a deficiency.
A milk-free diet downregulates folate receptor autoimmunity in cerebral folate deficiency syndrome
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2715943/
Folinic acid improves verbal communication in children with autism and language impairment: a randomized double-blind placebo-controlled trial
https://www.nature.com/articles/mp2016168
Are these doctors who have found methods to treat and partly cure ASD/CFD, quacks who are unnecessarily treating normal uninjured individuals?
What’s your excuse?
So Frye and Rossigol have moved onto folic supplements as their latest grift. Good to know, I suppose.
Folinic acid is different from folic acid. Vaccine-induced folate receptor alpha antibodies (FRAA) block the folic acid/folate uptake path, so an alternate route using folinic acid is necessitated.
Are you replying to anyone in particular?
look fuck!ng id10t, are you trying to be a professional id10t or that kind of thing come naturally to you?
Ever asked an autistic outside of the usual 3 or 4 who want to be cured (the autism investigated id10t and the few others publishing blogs which I respect more) if they want to get cured?
Alain
And yet even they don’t give a shit about you and your moronic whoring for attention.
∗blink∗
One might also note that neither of the “citations” (which are not called out in numerical or alphabetic order, or formatted consistently) demonstrates this flight of fancy.
No “flight of fancy” required. The Pandemrix vaccine was contaminated with H1N1 virus nucleoproteins which caused narcolepsy.
CNS tissue contaminated vaccines caused “neuroparalytic accident”.
http://jnnp.bmj.com/content/75/suppl_1/i22.full.pdf
If you derive casein from cow’s milk, the other milk proteins are not going to magically disappear. The vaccine industry/FDA have no history of assessing safety, specifying or controlling non-target proteins in vaccines. Why don’t you post specifications that control non-target protein quantities, cite research on their derivation and compliance reports of vaccines meeting those requirements?
After 50 years of sickening people with residual protein contaminated vaccines, they are “beginning to look at residual proteins”:
Dr. Vibha Jawa, a director with Merck commented on the article below (see comments section):
“We are beginning to look at residual proteins and contaminant with vaccines
Depending on animal protein a degree of homology with human self can be evaluated using algorithm to understand the extent of tolerance.
Additionally in vitro human immune cell assays can be run to understand thersholds of these proteins and their adjuvant effects”
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/305628626_Evaluating_Immunogenicity_Risk_Due_to_Host_Cell_Protein_Impurities_in_Antibody-Based_Biotherapeutics
Evidence that Food Proteins in Vaccines Cause the Development of Food Allergies and Its Implications for Vaccine Policy
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034553
“O’Brien et al. [13] measured 7.4 mcg/ml of ovalbumin in
influenza vaccines in 1967. Goldis et al. [14] measured as much
as 38.3 mcg/ml in influenza vaccines as recently as 2008.”
That’s progress? Nothing is controlled. It’s a free for all.
I checked your cites. One was written by you. As for the others, they don’t say what they claim you say.
The second last sentence of the Researchgate article’s abstract.
As I wrote before, you got nothing. You developed a hypothesis, and instead of testing it properly, you looked for evidence to support it.
I asked you to read the comments, not the main article. The comment is about residual proteins in vaccines. The article is about residual protein in mAb therapeutics.
An by the way, immunogenicity of therapeutic proteins is well known.
https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2007/103976s5102lbl.pdf
“A total of 23/99 (23%) Rituxan-treated patients with GPA and MPA tested positive for HACA by
18 months.”
https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2012/103705s5367s5388lbl.pdf
HACA is anti-human anti-chimeric antibody.
Have you suffered a head injury, Non Sequitur Boy?
@ TBruce
Yep, bleeding is used for some rare conditions and occasionally for congestive heart failure; but NOT the quantity of blood removed 200 years ago and not in combination with the other things I mentioned. And today, only for a few specific conditions. On his last day, George Washington was bled of approximately HALF of his blood.
They even use leeches for microsurgery. So what?
A few years ago, at an event commemorating an 18th century battle, a historical site featured a display of medical instruments and procedures used by military surgeons of the era: it included leeches ( in bowl of water), various pointed metal implements, salves and concoctions which would be forbidden today ( poisonous or useless). Quite frightening looking collection.
I was asked to give a presentation on American Civil War nursing for a Nurse’s Week luncheon a few years ago. I thought it best to warn everybody before showing the slides.
A great book on medical history is David Wooton’s Bad Medicine. the catchy subtitle is Doctors Doing Harm Since Hippocrates. (Guardian review.)
Wooton’s thesis, one of them anyway, seems to be that doctors began to be useful around 1900. Before that, they probably were a danger to one’s health in most cases. The leeches were probably harmless.
@ Christine Rose:
Yep, mercury was the treatment for syphilis; but it didn’t work. Killing lesions did nothing to treat the underlying disease. However, the whigs worn by judges, etc. in the UK stem from that time when those who used mercury as a “cure” for various conditions, lost their hair and their teeth. Arsenic, actually a derivative, for syphilis was actually developed by Paul Erlich in early 1900s and it did sometimes “work” but with serious side-effects. Since leishmaniasis was NOT a disease of American colonies and early American republic and antimony is highly toxic, its use in Western history was worthless.
As for emetics for pneumonia and laxatives for worms, “as effective as anything available at the time,” that is, NOT effective. You seem to miss my point, none of the treatments used, except laxatives and not in doses prescribed, had any effect other than weakening people.
I often think of some poor farmer coming down with, perhaps the flu in the late 18th Century, early 19th Century. He sends his son on horseback to fetch local doctorin nearby town who arrives in his buggy several hours later. The doctor examines the patient, bleeds him, gives him purgatives and emetics, and mercury. When the doctor returns the following day the patient has died. The doctor is distraught. The family consoles him, saying they know he did EVERYTHING possible. The doctor replies, if only I had gotten here sooner.
Or, perhaps, the doctor returns the following day and the patient is better. The family thanks him effusively, gives him a couple of chickens for his fee and off he goes.
Of course, we know that many people survive a plethora of conditions, so, as the old saying goes, if you have a cold and take some medicine, it goes over in a week. If you do nothing, it goes over in seven days. However, the above treatments more than likely weakened people who might have survived, thus, worsening things.
The fact that some may have been found in very limited circumstances to work does NOT change what I wrote anymore than they found that Thalidomide is now sometimes used for some cancers and leprosy. I listed treatments that were given as combinations with the only evidence that similar to the farmer above.
The point is that we now know that mercury in levels above what we get from the environment daily, which includes the trace amounts still in some flu vaccines, is a toxic substance. We know that arsenic is a toxic substance. The same for antimony. We also know that bleeding, except for very specific conditions and not literally draining ones blood, is not a smart thing to do. So, how do people who unless completely brain dead come to believe that chlorine bleach could be anything but extremely harmful?
I will try once more, though I doubt you will understand, I was pointing out what was called the Age of Heroic Medicine, when high levels of combinations of harmful treatments were practiced with abandon, based on NO science, just experiences as described above. Whether you choose to accept my equating it with the use of bleach to treatment for ASD or not, I think it a good analogy.
One might also note the etymology of ‘heroin’ in this context.
While I’m reprising old material, I suppose I might as well toss in the rectification of names.
Weekend woo reading list ideas for those starving for new RI material:
Ben Lynch is busy promoting his book “Dirty Genes”, a revolutionary tome in the expanding and profitable field of popular epigenetics. Ben (an N.D.) gives you “recipes” and supplement suggestions as to how you can clean up/tone down/re-jigger your bad genes and get at the Root Cause of disease, rather than just massage it like real physicians do. Ben also has a “Dirty Genes 2018 Summit”, in which you fork over $197 for various educational modules (my favorite involves breathing techniques to help clean those dirty genes). His co-conspirators, I mean collaborators include antivaxers David Berger and Paul Thomas (Lynch unsurprisingly has antivax credentials as well). Head on over to Amazon or Barnes and Noble, and get your copy now!
https://www.drbenlynch.com/course/dirty-genes-summit/
By the time you’re done with Ben’s book and on your way to total genetic copaceticity, you’ll need a healthy snack. Mark Hyman, the Functional Medicine dude is prepared to help. His latest book “What The Heck Should I Eat?” is scheduled for release February 27. Among other advice, Mark tells us that oatmeal is a bad way to start the day, and that milk doesn’t build bones. Be sure to catch Mark’s other insights on the Dr. Oz show.
Oh Dangerous One:
are breathing techniques to clean “dirty genes” somewhat like the frequently advertised air duct cleaning?
re “milk doesn’t build bones” :
according to Null, milk products weaken bones, causing osteoporosis : only broccoli and other greens build bone.
He sells “Green Stuff”.-btw-.
Okay, I’ll bite–what’s wrong with oatmeal? Too many GMOs?
Forgot to mention that Ben Lynch (N.ot a D.octor) has a supplement company offering products good for an amazing range of ills (he says root causes of disease (other than dirty genes) stem from lack of a healthy social outlet and inlet, whatever that means). Shop with confidence for such products as Amazing Grass Elixir Brain Blend and Allergy Research Lymph Beef Natural Glandular, which are also excellent for Wallet Bloat Syndrome.
https://healthygoods.com/natural-treatment-products.html?gclid=Cj0KCQiA5aTUBRC2ARIsAPoPJk9dAC0meraAKbU2gVaNVaC4KYKAiBUU2v_TEU-dFe1fTjPB0fLgSbsaAp2mEALw_wcB
I have some proof of the dangerous amount of mercury in vaccines is.
I have a proven thimerosal allergy, but have never had an untoward reaction to any vaccine given at any time. Usually they don’t even hurt.
Could we possibly get some of these Bleachers to have a great big drink of their own stuff ?
Let me clarify some of the assumptions going on in the comments. My 1st son got really sick after being vaccinated when was 1 year old, which left me hating vaccinations, of course the scare got worse after spending nights on end down the rabbit hole of the internet. I saw the link to autism but was reassured by my sweet little boy who slowly recovered and few months later then years the scare was gone as he was thriving as he was growing into a clever, healthy and happy boy.
3 years later, my second son was born. Question: do vaccinate or not to vaccinate?
I didnt. Not one single jab.
He never got sick, almost never cried, a truly healthy and happy boy, except around 18 months I started noticing a total lack of social skills, a complete passive behavior towards people or things around him. Immersed in his little world.
Forward to 3 years when is diagnosed autistic.
This is real evidence!! Autism is not caused by: vaccinations, plastic, aluminium, environmental toxins, mum’s unhealthy diet, dairy or gluten (I was dairy and gluten free) ect because I was aware of all those years before even being pregnant.
Do I try to “cure” my child? No. Do I want my child to be able to function in today’s society? Yes, but not to the extend as to change who he truly is.
Okay, I do keep myself open to autism discussions on many fronts but I would never ever go to such extremes.
Firstly I never by into marketing, trends or “cults” because
-I detach myself from my needs and wants, as someone pointed above, when deciding for the well being of a child, the parent has to let go of their expectations on their child and try to discover and become aware of their strengths and their weaknesses.
-I accept my child for who they are and dont look at them through questioning eyes but get to their level, and literally play, yes I take my time to play with my child because is the only way to know him better.
Of course, the help of a nutritionist, chiropractor or any other alternative medicine can help to some extend but what parents forget is to love and show unconditional love to their child, no matter how hard it is. And applies to any child, autistic or not.
So have you gone back and vaccinated your second child? And no, CAM cannot help. Things that help are considered real medicine, not quackery.
Please thank your responsible neighbors who protect your children for maintaining your community’s immunity to some nasty diseases by vaccinating their families.
In the mean time, now that you have found out autism is genetic, please participate in this study that may actually have some medical answers for your autistic child:
https://sparkforautism.org/
” autism is genetic”
Every disease has a genetic component. Autism and allergy are no exception. A majority of autism patients test positive for folate receptor alpha antibodies (FRAA).
These FRAA bind stronger to cow’s milk folate receptor proteins than human folate receptor proteins. If you can be born with such FRAA due to genetics, then you can also expect people to be born with natural antibody protection against all vaccine preventable diseases. So genes cause predisposition. They cannot cause all cases of autism being observed.
I get my medical science from those who are trained in the field, not engineers:
https://sparkforautism.org/discover/
“I get my medical science from those who are trained in the field, not engineers:”
I did too. When my son was diagnosed with multiple life-threatening food allergies, asthma and doctors were clueless about cause or cure, the engineer had to step in to find the root cause. If doctors had found the root cause and cure for allergies, asthma, autism and autoimmune diseases, etc., engineers would mind their own business.
So what? My son had seizures as an infant (way before there was an HepB vaccine) and later was diagnosed obstructive hypertrophic cardiomyopathy, along with the autism.
Stuff happens, and correlation is not causation. The fact that you do not understand that is why you shall be ignored, again:
Trollin’ Trollin’ Trollin’
Trollin’ Trollin’ Trollin’
Trollin’ Trollin’ Trollin’
Trollin’ Trollin’ Trollin’
Rawhide!
Trollin’ Trollin’ Trollin’
Though the threads are swollen
Keep them comments trollin’,
Rawhide!
Cherry pick!
(Head em’ up!)
Move goalposts!
(Move ’em on!)
More insults!
(Head em’ up!)
Rawhide!
Make stuff up!
(Paste ’em in!)
Change topics!
(Cut em’ out!)
Whine some more!
Paste ’em in,
Rawhide!
Keep trollin’, trollin’, trollin’
Though they’re disaprovin’
Keep them comments trollin”,
Rawhide!
Don’t try to understand ’em
Just rope, laugh, and ignore ’em
Soon we’ll be discussin’ right without ’em
“correlation is not causation”
Yep, that is why epidemiological studies are useless to make claims about causation or non-causation. Taylor et al. are not only wrong, they can only claim “Vaccines are not associated with autism” due to epidemiology based studies. But you take that and declare that vaccines don’t CAUSE autism. There is of course ZERO evidence to back up that claim.
You need mechanistic evidence. I have provided mechanistic evidence for vaccines inducing, allergies, asthma, autism and autoimmune diseases.
https://mttmblog.wordpress.com/vaccine-safety/
If things are not correlated, how can you claim causation? Correlation may not be enough for causation, but it’s unclear how you claim causation without it.
It’s pretty strong evidence against the claim.
“If things are not correlated”
Things are not correlated because the epidemiological studies are broken.
To claim that, you actually need to point to flaws in the studies.
“To claim that, you actually need to point to flaws in the studies.”
That is exactly what my article does … but you need to read it …
Epidemiological studies that ignore mechanism of disease causation are flawed and mechanistic evidence demonstrates that vaccines cause autism
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1117106
Dorit, what I think Vinu has missed that seizures and a genetic heart disorder that caused abnormal heart muscle growth to almost block the aortic valve (the reason for open heart surgery) are a wee bit more serious than allergies and asthma.
I do not discount allergies and asthma, because I have both… and my strong immune system has tried to kill me with asthma at least once. But that is something that is extremely common. Plus it changes as one ages. I no longer get a swollen face when the alder trees throw out their evil pollen (it was so bad I could barely see through swollen eyelids).
His is trying to blind us with his “engineersplain.” I have become tired of this tactic, especially since in my former life I was an aerospace engineer. At least I learned that there was much I did not know… Vinu has failed in that regard.
“my strong immune system has tried to kill me with asthma at least once. ”
Your strong immune system was MISPROGRAMMED by an alder pollen contaminated vaccine to WRONGLY recognize alder pollen exposure as a helminth infection of the lungs.
“I no longer get a swollen face when the alder trees throw out their evil pollen”
Well known phenomena with helminth infections. Your immune system scales back the reaction to avoid damaging the body. You are likely in a high IgG4/IgE ratio state for alder pollen. You are now more at risk for eosinophilic asthma. Eosinophils are an important part of defending against established helminth infections.
“At least I learned that there was much I did not know”
You don’t know much, I don’t know much. The vaccine makers, vaccinologists, regulators and doctors don’t know much. So going around claiming vaccines are safe, is insanity.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21739679
“Despite their success, one of the great iro-nies of vaccinology is that the vast majority of vaccines have been developed empirically, with little or no understanding of the immunological mechanisms by which they induce protective immunity. However, the failure to develop vaccines against global pandemics such as infection with human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) despite decades of effort has underscored the need to understand the immunological mechanisms by which vaccines confer protective immunity.”
Vinu, you are a clueless engineer idiot:
Trollin’ Trollin’ Trollin’
Trollin’ Trollin’ Trollin’
Trollin’ Trollin’ Trollin’
Trollin’ Trollin’ Trollin’
Rawhide!
Trollin’ Trollin’ Trollin’
Though the threads are swollen
Keep them comments trollin’,
Rawhide!
No I cannot thanks them as they dont speak english, let me elaborate
I live in London, United Kingdom where 37% of the population are immigrants of which the majority are from countries with the lowest vaccination rate in Europe, so “my neighbors” are the ones not vaccinated who blindly vaccinate their children, the irony…
Therefore, you supposing that everyone in “my community” is vaccinated is faulty. Dont know where you live but if I look around me, more than half of the people I meet were not born here so comparing the risk to not vaccinate against a failed community and the risk of adverse effects as experienced by older brother, is a no brainer.
While autism might be genetic in some cases, I think is more a metabolic disorder, an increase on oxidative damage with autoimmune responses, which could also happen in the womb, this is just my humble opinion
You minght want to know, this is the latest research:
https://molecularautism.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13229-017-0183-3
The link you provide is for USA only, the bubble that everyone uses to generate conclusions, I encourage everyone to always keep an open mind to other people’s circumstances and their rights.
motherofcubs,
Sorry to hear about your son’s atypical behavior. If you don’t mind me asking, were you vaccinated? Vaccine-induced antibodies in the mother can affect fetal brain development.
Details with numerous relevant references:
Epidemiological studies that ignore mechanism of disease causation are flawed and mechanistic evidence demonstrates that vaccines cause autism
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1117106
Safety studies of aluminum in vaccines lack immunotoxicity analysis of this immunological adjuvant: Ignorance or deception?
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1117242
Note that the speaker is attributing to antibodies from vaccines magic properties that the many antibodies mothers make in response to other challenges don’t have.
His references, which include a self-article, are also not on point (again).
And what are those “magic properties”?
Dorit,
Autism-specific maternal autoantibodies recognize critical proteins in developing brain
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3731784/
Thyroid dysfunction in children with autism spectrum disorder is associated with folate receptor α autoimmune disorder.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/28199771
The articles above identify numerous maternal autism related (MAR) antibodies involved in ASD, including FRAA.
I provide the analysis showing vaccines as a cause:
Strong protein sequence alignment between autoantigens involved in maternal autoantibody related autism and vaccine antigens
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034571
Scientifically, you have three options:
Demonstrate a fundamental flaw in my analysis, providing appropriate citations supporting your claim.
Provide a better alternate explanation/analysis with appropriate citations.
Accept my analysis.
No, I don’t have to disprove your attempt to say that two studies not related to vaccines show that vaccinating mothers causes autism. You actually have to provide proof that it does. Taking unrelated studies and hypothesizing they’re connected to vaccines because you think so does not actually show anything.
MAR antibodies don’t appear by magic. What caused them? I provided my explanation. Scientifically, you have only the three options I listed. You don’t have to disprove me. But you HAVE to explain the observations.
No, again. I do not have to disprove your hypothesis. You have to prove it. And no. I don’t have to explain why vaccines don’t cause something you think they cause but have no evidence of, and in fact, are trying to challenge existing evidence with.
Forget vaccines. Forget me. Why are you refusing to answer the question? What caused MAR antibodies?
I don’t have to explain what caused anything. You made a specific claim. It’s unsupported (and not particularly plausible).
As much as you’d like to shift the burden of proof, it’s yours.
“I don’t have to explain what caused anything.”
Then you are not a scientist.
“It’s unsupported (and not particularly plausible).”
You cannot make claims without providing evidence.
http://www.rutherfordjournal.org/article020108.html
“It is reasonable to believe that the best available explanation of any fact is true.
F is a fact.
Hypothesis H explains F.
No available competing hypothesis explains F as well as H does.
Therefore, it is reasonable to believe that H is true
This scheme is valid and instances of it might well be sound. Inferences of this kind are employed in the common affairs of life, in detective stories, and in the sciences.”
You are a low-rent Cisco flunky, if they haven’t already fired you, with a delusionally stupid Grand AI script under your belt, jackass.
No I was not vaccinated because I was not living in your generalized bubble so you can quit supposing that vaccines have anything to do with creating autism.
People affected by autism have some metabolic differences with autoimmune responses in my opinion.
But here is the latest research:
“Scientists said their research found a link between ASD and damage to proteins in blood plasma.
They found the most reliable of the tests they developed was examining protein in blood plasma, which found children with ASD had higher levels of the oxidation marker dityrosine (DT) and certain sugar-modified compounds called advanced glycation end products (AGEs).”
Here is some light reading for you:
https://molecularautism.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13229-017-0183-3
“No I was not vaccinated”
Thanks. If you don’t mind me asking again, did you receive acid blocker treatments before having your affected child? Did the child receive such treatments?
I had a look at that study.
Very weak tea.
Not only are people vaccinated against influenza unprotected and go on to develop an influenza infection, they do a better job of SPREADING the infection … 6.3 times better! Heard of herd immunity?
“Self-reported vaccination for the current season was associated with a trend (P < 0.10) toward higher viral shedding in fine-aerosol samples; vaccination with both the current and previous year’s seasonal vaccines, however, was significantly associated with greater fine-aerosol shedding in unadjusted and adjusted models (P < 0.01). In adjusted models, we observed 6.3 (95% CI 1.9–21.5) times more aerosol shedding among cases with vaccination in the current and previous season compared with having no vaccination in those two seasons.”
http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2018/01/17/1716561115
This result makes a lot of sense. People develop IgE mediated allergy against the influenza virus upon vaccination. Each subsequent vaccination is an influenza allergy booster shot. That is a well documented fact.
When you have influenza virus allergy and are infected, you have more mast cell degranulation, more histamine, more mucus, more sneezing, more viral shedding.
In serious cases, you have slow rolling anaphylaxis and death. As you can read in the news reports, this is classified as “cytokine storm” or “sepsis shock”.
My predictions are unfortunately coming true …
Short sighted influenza control policy based on poorly designed vaccines will sicken more people
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1112421
Dr. Markus Maeurer is Professor of Clinical Immunology, Head of the Division Therapeutic Immunology at
LabMed, Karolinska Institutet and Senior Physician at the Center for allogeneic stem
cell transplantation, CAST.
He recommended my article below on ResearchGate:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/316785758_Strong_protein_sequence_alignment_between_autoantigens_involved_in_maternal_autoantibody_related_autism_and_vaccine_antigens
Dr. Upadhyay’s comment on the article above:
http://www.nii.res.in/research/parmod-k-upadhyay
“The observations made in this paper can easily be verified and the author has a point to make.
The vaccine manufacturing companies and regulatory agencies should provide an explanation.”
PDF: https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034571
@ vinu arumugham
You write: ““correlation is not causation” Yep, that is why epidemiological studies are useless to make claims about causation or non-causation.”
Correct, by itself correlation does not equal causation, at least bivariate correlation. However, it is the design of the study, not the statistic that decides. Bivariate correlation can be simply algebraically transformed into a simple regression analysis. Partial and semi-partial correlations can be algebraically transformed into multivariate regression analysis. Regression analyses do imply “causality.” And epidemiologists don’t base “policy” or “causation” on one study. However, antivaccinationists jump on one study, regardless of design strength, regardless of other studies that contradict, if the one study confirms their already fixed belief. If one found, even with simple bivariate correlation, the same patterns in numerous studies done by different researchers on different populations in different cultures, etc., together with other factors, e.g. biological plausibility, one could draw causal inferences.
I suggest you actually study some epidemiology. Try Rothman and Greenland’s “Modern Epidemiology”, 3rd Edition. You might actually learn something if you are willing to put in the effort.
It was epidemiological studies that led to smoking and cancer and heart disease. Do you think epidemiological evidence wrong?
A well written discussion.
Maybe after Vinu finishes reading that book, he can explain why the Swedish flu vax study he cited has better methodology than the ones used in Taylor et al.
Of course the real answer is just that it gave him something to gripe about.
@ vinu arumugham
You write: “If the traditional medical system could prevent or cure autism, why would MMS even be a topic? The failed traditional medical system creates autism and MMS usage shows how desperate parents are to help their injured child.”
That isn’t even logical or passes for common sense. Can’t prevent or cure, so MMS? People try to explain things and come up with both valid and invalid hypotheses. Do you really believe that any human affliction that can’t be prevented or cured must have been caused by our medical system? How about Huntington’s Chorea, Brain Cancers, etc.?
As for your article on aluminum. First, aluminum is one of the most ubiquitous substances on the planet. On a daily basis we get it through the air we breath, water we drink, food we eat, and minor skin abrasions. Infants get aluminum through breast milk, and higher amounts in formula. And you cite a couple of studies; but there are probably thousands. I did a quick search of PubMed using “Aluminum AND muscle and found a number of studies. Yes, aluminum can cause a localized inflammatory response; but so can a wood splinter. If you study immunology, that is exactly what the immune system is supposed to do, so what?
You cite from another paper: ““Despite their success, one of the great ironies of vaccinology is that the vast majority of vaccines have been developed empirically, with little or no understanding of the immunological mechanisms by which they induce protective immunity.” Absolutely true. Smallpox vaccine that has save 100s of millions of lives was developed in 1790s, measles vaccine in 1960s just as we were learning about the immune system. However, what you fail to grasp is that we now know a lot about how the immune system functions, especially how naive B-cells and T-cells learn to recognize specific parts of microbe’s cognate antigens, called epitopes. So, yes, many older vaccines were developed before we knew how they worked, except that they exponentially reduced deaths, disabilities, and suffering; but not we know how they worked. Aspirin was used long before we understood prostaglandins. And quinine long before we understood how it worked. If medicine only involved interventions where we understood the immune system, since even today we are still learning about it though we have quite a bit of knowledge, we would have NO medicine. Perhaps, that is what you would prefer?
And one more thing. Despite what you and other choose to believe, there is NOT an epidemic of autism. For instance, the number of cases of Autism Spectrum Disorders increased when in 1994 Asperger’s was added. There are cases where professionals in their 60s and 70s who previously were thought eccentric received a diagnosis of Asperger’s. There is clear evidence in studies done long before Kanner’s 1943 article that give descriptions of behaviors that would clearly be labeled autism today. And Kanner admitted in a speech in 1971 that he had significantly undercounted cases by refusing to see children who were not white from upper middle class educated professional families. Other studies have found that as diagnoses of autism spectrum disorders increase, diagnoses of mental retardation decrease. In addition, the Federal government began grants to schools for ASD and “objective” instruments that can “easily” be given, that don’t need a PhD psychologist or Board Certified Psychiatrist.
And it is not Autism that allegedly is increasing; but Autism Spectrum Disorders. One last example: In the latter part of the 1800s leukemia was found to be a type of “cancer” and added which increased the number of cases of cancer (it had previous been thought to be an “infectious” disease). So the number of cases of cancer increased because new categories were added.
I could go on; but I doubt anything will change your mind given the illogic of some of your statements and your reliance on a few cherry-picked studies.
“If the traditional medical system could prevent or cure autism, why would MMS even be a topic? The failed traditional medical system creates autism …”
They are two independent statements.
“Despite their success, one of the great ironies of vaccinology is that the vast majority of vaccines have been developed empirically, with little or no understanding of the immunological mechanisms by which they induce protective immunity.”
That is not for old vaccines. Pulendran et al. wrote that in 2011 and they continue “However, the failure to develop vaccines against global pandemics such as infection with human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) despite decades of effort has underscored the need to understand the immunological mechanisms by which vaccines confer protective immunity.” So this is NOW, not 50 years ago.
“Smallpox vaccine that has save 100s of millions of lives was developed in 1790s”
Prof. Desheva’s response to my article covers that nicely:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/318045518_Flawed_assumptions_fuel_autoimmune_disease_The_sorry_state_of_vaccine_safety_science
Prof. Yulia Desheva, a vaccine developer with the Saint Petersburg State University, Russia, commented on my article above:
“Thanks to the author for the detailed and very relevant report. In this regard, I would like to note that live influenza vaccine (LAIV) has been used in the health care practice in Russia since the 1980s. This was preceded by many years of clinical trials, including the study of the same contingents vaccinated for not less than 10 years. Then no development of long-term adverse reactions was reported, including autoimmune, neurodegenerative or oncological diseases. Unfortunately, as quite rightly noted by the author, most modern vaccine preparations do not undergo testing for the development of distant side reactions.
Although in the face of a pandemic threat, the risk of loss from infection may outweigh the risk of adverse reactions, as was the case with smallpox eradication and polio control. Therefore, in the post-pandemic period, when the direct threat of infection recedes, the main task is a comprehensive study of the real immune mechanisms of vaccination including all pros and cons.”
PDF: https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034760
Dr.Harrison,
“First, aluminum is one of the most ubiquitous substances on the planet. On a daily basis we get it through the air we breath, water we drink, food we eat, and minor skin abrasions. Infants get aluminum through breast milk, and higher amounts in formula.”
I expect such absurd reasoning from a layperson, not a medical professional.
If ingestion were the same as injection as you claim, why don’t you squirt the aluminum adjuvanted DTap vaccine into the child’s mouth? Why administer it as an intramuscular injection?
May be you should read my aluminum article before commenting …?
The reason the vaccines we currently used are injected and not ingested has nothing to do with the adjuvant. It is because the antigens – the active ingredient – would not survive going through the stomach without being encapsulated, and they’re not currently (and to get to oral vaccines manufacturers would have to go through clinical trials). That means the vaccine would not generate an immune response.
It’s not about the adjuvant, so your comment is a little strange.
While route matters, overstating the importance of the route is an error. There’s nothing magic about injection that makes the aluminum salts different from the body’s point of view, though bioavailability can be different – which can affect how we consider the amount, but the amounts in vaccines are still tiny.
In an aluminum adjuvanted vaccine, the antigens in the vaccine are adsorbed on the surface of aluminum adjuvant particles. By multiple mechanisms, this induces a stronger immune response against the antigens.
When the antigen is a target antigen, say hepatitis B surface antigen, the adjuvant produces immunoprotection against hepatitis B.
When the antigen is a non-target antigen, say casein, the adjuvant produces immunotoxicity against casein, also known as milk allergy.
This mechanism does not apply to ingested aluminum at all. Any antigen adsorbed on INGESTED aluminum would not survive stomach acid as you point out.
Immunologically, injected and ingested aluminum salts are completely different in function.
Pharmacokinetics of injected and ingested aluminum may be comparable but irrelevant here. Because we are discussing the immunotoxicity of an immunological adjuvant, not its pharmacokinetics.
Thiis collection of words literally has no semantic content. Mutatis mutandis the “pharmacokinetics” words salad. Can’t you just go to AoA or someplace where you can pretend that your ego is being stroked rather than the other way around?
The Yan study on infectious flu particles concludes with: “If confirmed, this observation, together with recent literature suggesting reduced protection with annual vaccination, would have implications for influenza vaccination recommendations and policies.”
I guess you don’t understand what “if confirmed” means? So, I’ll explain. No matter how well a study is done it is impossible to control for all variables that may affect the results, which is why replications are necessary. Second, “recent literature suggesting reduced protection with annual vaccinations,” relates to a few published studies; but there are many more studies that have NOT found reduced protection. Of course, your bias it to go with the few studies that confirm what you choose to believe. Actually this is a topic that has peaked my interest so I have collected 38 peer reviewed articles and am reading through them. And I have e-mailed colleagues asking if they know of any others.
In addition, the Yan study just doesn’t make sense to me, unless his subjects mainly got the attenuated flu vaccine; but studies of it have found only short-term infectious particles and little to no infection in those nearby. If Yan is claiming that the killed flu vaccine somehow allows the body to then catch, harbor, and spread a natural version, how does this explain the 100s of studies where those vaccinated, even if they then get the flu, experiencing lower risks of hospitalization and death (vaccine didn’t prevent but reduced seriousness) and studies where the higher the percentage vaccinated, the lower the number of cases, herd immunity?
What the heck, the Yan study found what you believe, so ignore the logic, the biological plausibility, the large number of studies that have found even when flu vaccine has “low effectiveness” that those vaccinated experience less serious reactions, and that even Yan writes: “if confirmed.”
Oh, congratulations on going around the world and finding one immunologist who cites your paper. I can go around the world and find medical doctors who believe in Homeopathy, water with memories (I’ve looked under a microscope at water and couldn’t see a hippocampus, nor neocortex, maybe I need an electron microscope), and numerous other unscientific things. So, you found ONE. Wow! I’m impressed.
I found that you are an Engineer in San Jose, California. Though many would automatically dismiss anything you say due to you not being in a medical profession, I assume that anyone intelligent enough to obtain one difficult credential could, on their own, by extensive reading, attending seminars, etc. develop knowledge in another field. However, nothing you have written demonstrates more than a cherry picking of articles with a deficient understanding of microbiology, immunology, epidemiology, biostatistcs, the history of infectious diseases, and the current state of infectious diseases in the world (many but a plane flight away from the US). And I don’t require what someone writes to be in a top rated peer-reviewed journal. The only advantage to being in such is more people see it and more chance for reviews/critiques. However, I did a Google search and PubMed of your name and except for the immunologist in India, your papers haven’t received much if any attention.
You really are ARROGANT to assume that Dorit Reiss or anyone else has to disprove your claims as if your are the gold standard!
Dr.Harrison,
“If Yan is claiming that the killed flu vaccine somehow allows the body to then catch, harbor, and spread a natural version, how does this explain the 100s of studies where those vaccinated, even if they then get the flu, experiencing lower risks of hospitalization and death (vaccine didn’t prevent but reduced seriousness) and studies where the higher the percentage vaccinated, the lower the number of cases, herd immunity?”
This is all easily explained if you account for the fact that the “killed” flu vaccine causes the development of IgE mediated influenza allergy. We also know that influenza vaccine efficacy can vary widely from 10-70%. Intensity of the IgE mediated influenza allergy of course varies from person to person. Protein sequence homology between past several years of vaccines vs. infecting wild strain will determine infection and allergy intensity. If you are infected (due to low vaccine efficacy) and you have influenza allergy, it makes perfect sense that you produce more mucus, sneeze more and spread the infection more efficiently, than if you were unvaccinated and suffer the infection alone without influenza allergy.
The discordant results from different studies are not suprising given the efficacy/infection/allergy intensity spectra.
Your answer does not explain why the vaccinated have less hospitalizations and death.
“Your answer does not explain why the vaccinated have less hospitalizations and death.”
When the vaccine works, what’s the difficulty explaining that?
“In fact, large-scale studies found that vaccines do not cause the allergies.”
Citations please.
Here are a few.
Grüber C1, Warner J, Hill D, Bauchau V; EPAAC Study Group. Early atopic disease and early childhood immunization–is there a link? Allergy. 2008 Nov;63(11):1464-72. http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1398-9995.2008.01696.x/full
Bernsen RM, Koes BW, de Jongste JC, van der Wouden JC. Haemophilus influenzae type b vaccination and reported atopic disorders in 8-12-year-old children. Pediatr Pulmonol. 2006 May;41(5):463-9. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16547964
Bernsen RM and van der Wouden JC. Measles, mumps and rubella infections and atopic disorders in MMR-unvaccinated and MMR-vaccinated children. Pediatr Allergy Immunol. 2008 Sep;19(6):544-51. doi: 10.1111/j.1399-3038.2007.00684.x. Epub 2008 Feb 7.
H. R. Anderson, J. D. Poloniecki, D. P. Strachan, R. Beasley, B. Bjorksten, & M. I. Asher. (2001). Immunization and symptoms of atopic disease in children: Results from the international study of asthma and allergies in childhood. American Journal of Public Health, 91(7), 1126-1129.
Most recently: Marquis A, Borte M, Diez U, Richter M, Herbarth O. Vaccination prevents allergic disorders in children.
Some, though not all, are reviewed here: P. A. Offit & C. J. Hackett. (2003). Addressing parents’ concerns: Do vaccines cause allergic or autoimmune diseases? Pediatrics, 111(3), 653-660.
“In fact, large-scale studies found that vaccines do not cause the allergies.”
As Dr. Harrison pointed out, epidemiological studies cannot prove causation or non-causation. You have only provided epidemiological studies.
Here is proof from a simple study that vaccines do in fact boost food allergies:
https://wao.confex.com/wao/2015symp/webprogram/Paper9336.html
And before you complain about the n=2, n=2 is what makes the study so powerful.
When you build prototypes for a new product, you don’t build a thousand, you might build two.
If they fail, you know your product is badly broken. The n=2 study proves that vaccines are badly broken.
You only need large n when you have to prove the vaccine is safe. n=2 is more than enough to prove that the vaccine is broken.
People aren’t prototypes. They’re long built.
And yes, your study with an n of 2 cannot show anything. On the other hand, when large epidemiological studies find no correlation, that’s powerful evidence against causation claims.
As much as you would like to believe otherwise, the evidence shows you wrong.
“People aren’t prototypes.”
Vaccinated people are protoypes in this case.
How do you explain the results in this study?
“Marquis A, Borte M, Diez U, Richter M, Herbarth O. Vaccination prevents allergic disorders in children.”
Is there a full article? They studied a sloppy “any other allergic symptoms”?
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1446713/pdf/11441744.pdf
This is so old they are using whole cell pertussis vaccines. Irrelevant for allergies occurring now.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18266826
“For rubella there was a negative association with eczema and food allergy in the unvaccinated group: adjusted OR (95% CI): 0.57 (0.38-0.85) and 0.23 (0.07-0.76), respectively.”
Unvaccinated status reduces eczema, food allergy.
They did not like the result.
So they write: “The negative association with rubella may be an artefact.”
They don’t even hide their bias.
The IOM looked at all the studies from 1950 to 2011 and concluded that vaccines do indeed cause food allergies.
Shit, man, n = 1 proves that you are badly broken.
Why, yes, Research Boy.
It’s a “Meeting abstract”, not a full article.
Is there a full article?
I notice you left out the very next sentence of that abstract where you accused the researchers of bias.
“Conclusions found elsewhere that childhood vaccinations do not cause atopy.”
Thanks for pointing out that there is also confirmation bias.
That comment is not proof of Confirmation Bias. As you have done here multiple times before, you have twisted the evidence to support your hypothesis, instead of testing it properly.
One more thing: You write: “cerebral folate deficiency (CFD), that is injury and needs to be cured. CFD is not normal, otherwise it won’t be called a deficiency.”
Though NOT “Cured”, studies have found that if diagnosed at an early age, “Treatment of the condition with folinic acid for prolonged periods can result in significant improvement of clinical symptoms and a return of 5-methyltetrahydrofolate levels in the CSF to normal.” (Gordon, 2008. Cerebral folate deficiency. Developmental Medicine & Child Neurology; 51: 180-182), The same paper also gives one possible cause: “One possible mechanism for autoantibody production can be that exposure to soluble folate receptors from milk elicits an immune response.” And the consensus is it is a genetic disorder (Genetics Home Reference “Cerebral folate transport deficiency.” It is quite possible that genetics related to various ASD have mutated genes on the same chromosome, etc.
As for “injury”, if genetic, could be either a random mutation, or possible epigenetic, so how do we cure this? As for being called a “deficiency”, depends. Most measures find a mean or median, then calculate normal ranges. Being outside the normal range for many measures has little to NO effect. In this case, it does; but, as mentioned above, this can be countered by early intervention.
You write: “that is why epidemiological studies are useless to make claims about causation or non-causation. Taylor et al. are not only wrong, they can only claim “Vaccines are not associated with autism” due to epidemiology based studies. But you take that and declare that vaccines don’t CAUSE autism. There is of course ZERO evidence to back up that claim. You need mechanistic evidence.”
First and foremost, you don’t understand one basic principle of ALL research, one can’t prove a negative. Quite simply, one can reject the Null Hypothesis; but never prove it. I can do numerous studies of gravity on planet Earth; but can NEVER claim that somewhere some weird interaction of “cosmic forces” results in some small space where gravity doesn’t apply. Carl Sagan’s book “The Demon Haunted World,” begin with an example of a man claiming a dragon in his garage. Researchers arrive using several instruments but find nothing. Proof of no dragon? Nope! Because the dragon might come and go at various intervals, quite simply they weren’t there long enough. Or, perhaps, as with quantum physics, their presence or the presence of the instruments changed things and so on.
The Institute of Medicine has published a number of books reviewing different aspects of vaccine safety. Each book involves a comprehensive review of the literature, not just a few articles. And Taylor’s article is just one of many reviewing various aspects of vaccine safety.
You really don’t understand the basics of causal inference. Try Chapter in Rothman and Greenland’s book “Modern Epidemiology (3rd edition) or book I consider absolute best:
Mervyn Susser (1973). Causal Thinking in the Health Sciences: Concepts and Strategies in Epidemiology. Available at many university libraries and used copies on Amazon marketplace.
Any research project poses a null hypothesis, either rejected or not; but NEVER proved. Try to understand that.
As for “But you take that and declare that vaccines don’t CAUSE autism. There is of course ZERO evidence to back up that claim. You need mechanistic evidence.” The overwhelming body of research says there is NO evidence of an association. Only someone who doesn’t understand science would then claim that this translates to “vaccines don’t CAUSE autism,” however, at some point when an overwhelming body of evidence finds NO association, this indicates an extremely strong basis for rejecting an association. Science seldom speaks in absolutes; but people like you do. As for mechanistic evidence, again, despite your claims, both the Institute of Medicine and numerous papers don’t agree with you. As Rothman and Greenland discuss in their book, Biological Plausibility can explain many things that turn out to not be correct.
Again, given no indication of any expertise in relevant subjects, and your propensity to use terms and phrases that clearly indicate a lack of understanding of how science works and how one uses causal inference, the only conclusion is that you suffer from delusions of grandeur, that is, that you are smarter than the vast majority of scientists. Get help!
While the study of electronic engineering requires intelligence and a lot of work, it is an applied science. And it is a physical science which allows for a degree of control that almost NO medical or other related science can obtain. Thus, as far as I have found, NO training in causal inference, various research designs, etc.
Dr. Harrison,
Thank you for your detailed responses and references.
The IOM 2012 report on vaccine adverse events has this section:
https://iom.nationalacademies.org/Reports/2011/Adverse-Effects-of-Vaccines-Evidence-and-Causality.aspx
Document Pg. 65 (pdf pg. 94 ):
“Adverse events on our list thought to be due to IgE-mediated
hypersensitivity reactions
Antigens in the vaccines that the committee is charged with reviewing do
not typically elicit an immediate hypersensitivity reaction (e.g.,
hepatitis B surface antigen, toxoids, gelatin, ovalbumin, casamino acids).
However, as will be discussed in subsequent chapters, the
above-mentioned antigens do occasionally induce IgE-mediated
sensitization in some individuals and subsequent hypersensitivity
reactions, including anaphylaxis.”
Could you please let us know what you understand from it?
“Only someone who doesn’t understand science would then claim that this translates to “vaccines don’t CAUSE autism,” ”
https://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/autism.html
“Vaccines Do Not Cause Autism”
Thanks for confirming what many people suspected: the CDC does not understand science.
How about the CDC understand science but distill down the language to be understandable by peoples like you?
Thanks for proving his point.
Al
“Vaccines Don’t Cause Autism”
https://www.sabin.org/updates/blog/vaccines-dont-cause-autism-0
Looks like plenty of competition for scientific ignorance …
From the link in your comment:
The only “scientific ignorance” here is from you.
<
blockquote>First and foremost, you don’t understand one basic principle of ALL research, one can’t prove a negative./blockquote>
This canard drives me bats. By the other side of the same token, as it were, one can’t prove a positive, either.
Dr.Harrison,
“delusions of grandeur”
Dr. Polly Matzinger of the NIH/NIAID proposed the “danger model” which is an important part of our understanding of immunology today.
Dr. Matzinger’s comments here tell you why vaccine science is broken.
https://list.nih.gov/cgi-bin/wa.exe?A2=ind1606&L=immuni-l&D=0&P=36477
Dr. Joseph Cantor is an Assistant Professor of Medicine with the UC San
Diego School of Medicine.
He has a PhD in Immunology. He is a Journal referee for the Diabetes
Journal published by the American Diabetes Association.
http://raidivision.ucsd.edu/Faculty/Pages/joseph-cantor.aspx
I wrote this article:
Role of MMR II vaccine contamination with GAD65 containing chick embryo
cell culture in the etiology of type 1 diabetes
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/318305895_Role_of_MMR_II_vaccine_contamination_with_GAD65_containing_chick_embryo_cell_culture_in_the_etiology_of_type_1_diabetes
Dr. Cantor commented on my article above:
“This is a logical hypothesis and designing pre- and post-vaccination
GAD65 autoantibody levels is a reasonable first step to obtain evidence
of a humoral immune response to a vaccine “contaminant” that is also an
autoantigen in Type I Diabetes. If these data support the hypothesis
then mechanistic cause/effect studies should be done in the best animal
model available. In our frustration with random (and dangerous)
nonsensical anti-vaccine arguments, we should be careful not to
overreact and avoid all vaccine safety research. In the true spirit of
scientific inquiry and progress, we should continually strive to improve
vaccine safety at the same time as efficacy. From what I have read, Vinu
is not arguing for reducing or stopping vaccines, which of course save
millions of lives, but rather to make the best vaccines that we can.”
After billions of dollars spent on decades of diabetes research, more
than 50 years after the introduction of the chick cell contaminated
measles vaccine, fundamental questions regarding vaccine safety have not
even been asked, much less, answered. If it takes an outsider like me,
an electronics engineer with zero formal training in medicine or
immunology, a vaccine victim, to raise such fundamental safety
questions, what does that tell us about our medical and vaccine safety
systems?
The article above was also recommended by 3 other diabetes experts.
PDF: https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034771
More details:
Bioinformatics analysis links type 1 diabetes to vaccines contaminated with animal proteins and autoreactive T cells express skin homing receptors consistent with injected vaccines as causal agent
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034775
Cancer immunology, bioinformatics and chemokine evidence link vaccines contaminated with animal proteins to autoimmune disease: a detailed look at Crohn’s disease and Vitiligo
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034777
@ Vinu Arugugham
As usual, you try to prove your point by finding one or two places. As I wrote, though scientist don’t or shouldn’t make absolute statements, once an overwhelming body of evidence goes in one direction, summarizing for the lay public may breech pure science. I guess the title could have been:
100s of Well-Done Studies Have Found No Association Between Vaccines and Autism, So Association/Risk Extremely Unlikely.
More scientifically accurate; but most people would not understand. As I wrote with gravity, it is possible that somewhere at sometime on Planet Earth some confluence of cosmic factors could have resulted in the Law of Gravity not applying, so what? Instead of calling it the Law of Gravity, maybe we should call it the Extremely High Probability of Gravity Applying?
Over and over you have said things in your comments that indicate a total lack of understanding of science, so even if the CDC statement, based on many well-done studies, wasn’t totally correct, doesn’t justify or defend your idiocies based on a few studies and no indication you have a basic understanding of microbiology, immunology, epidemiology, biostatistics, history of infectious diseases, or the current status of infectious diseases in the world (but a plane flight away).
It isn’t a defense to point out someone may have made the same or similar errors. And given the bases of the CDC statement, the actual risks if more and more people fail to vaccinate, and their expertise in the above sciences, compared to you it would be like saying, well, yes, you committed armed robbery; but the CDC received a ticket for jaywalking.
So, to summarize, as far as I can tell, just about everything you have written, including the arrogance of thinking you are right, lacks an understanding of science, whereas, the CDC headline is followed by links to numerous studies, reviews, and articles, all done by top scientists, all with numerous references.
So you quote from an Institute of Medicine report about IgE, the antibody that protects us against worms (did you know that?) and involved in allergic reactions.
First, a temporary allergic reaction in the vast vast majority of cases is NOT serious and certainly still better than what is protected against. Would you really prefer to get tetanus rather than a mild allergic reaction? And if one is allergic to hepatitis B surface antigen, then how would one react to natural Hepatitis?
You do know that ovalalbumin is what egg whites are made of? And if a child is known to have an allergy to eggs, doctors will still give vaccines; but will observe for longer, A rare number of children can have anaphylaxis; but this occurs immediately and can be handled with an epipen. And if allergic to eggs, they are in many different foods, so if a child has an egg allergy, parents should have an epipen. Most, however, will have only minor short-lived symptoms, certainly better than the actual diseases. Gelatin is used in many foods, vitamin pills, other pharmaceuticals, etc. So the little in vaccines may cause a reaction in a few; but certainly not a greater risk than from the world around them. And casamino acids are derived from casein, the protein in milk and other dairy products, again found in many different foods.
Anaphylaxis has been demonstrated with some vaccines; but since easily handled with an epipen, no long term sequelae have been found AND if allergic to one of the ingredients in vaccines, odds are high will experience a reaction sometime in the outside world, perhaps, not with nearby availability of an epipen. Note even getting vaccines at a pharmacy, not doctor’s office, have personnel trained and epipens present.
So, you found that kids can have mild allergic reactions to vaccines and, in rare instances, anaphylaxis, treated immediately with NO longer term sequelae. Given your ignorance of the history of infectious diseases, let me give just one example. Prior to the development of the measles vaccine in early 1960s, on average per year 50,000 kids were hospitalized, 1,000 developed life-long disabilities (deafness, blindness, mental retardation, seizure disorders) and 400 – 500 died. Prior to antibiotics that for the most part successfully treat secondary bacterial pneumonias, the death toll from measles was far higher. There is NO scientifically validated treatment for measles and it is just as contagious today as then. Our population has doubled and due to the overuse and misuse of antibiotics resistance is on the rise, so without the vaccine likely that the numbers above would more than double. Just one of the diseases.
So, you would trade mild short-term allergic reactions and the rare successfully treated anaphylaxis for the above???
If smallpox vaccine had never been developed, good chance that neither you nor I would exist. And if we were alive, highly likely we would have suffered through an incredibly horrible experience with possible loss of eye sight and certainly disfiguring pockmarks. And it is the one vaccine that really does have risks. Whereas in the past an outbreak of smallpox killed around 1/3 of population, the vaccine can kill several dozen and cause an unpleasant condition, progressive vaccinia. But if one faced the risk of being one out of three dying or one out of several hundred thousand, which would you choose?
Go back to electronic engineering and stop trying to deflect from your extremely deficient understanding of infectious diseases by finding a few places. There is an old saying: The Exception Proves The Rule. However, you choose the exception, even if highly questionable and taken out of context.
There is an excellent book on Vaccines, though quite expensive, about $330; but also available at university libraries:
Plotkin et al (2018). Vaccines (7th Ed). Elsevier
Also, read Rothman and Greenland, “Modern Epidemiology, 3rd ed”
Other good books:
Arthur Allen’s “Vaccine”
Seth Mnookin’s “The Panic Virus”
Paul Offit’s “Deadly Choices” and “Autism’s False Prophets”
and I already mentioned Susser’s book on causal inference.
I’ve got better things to do than waste time commenting with someone who obviously is incapable of changing his mind.
If interested you can read some of my articles on vaccines. Executive Summaries can be found at:
http://www.ecbt.org/index.php/facts_and_issues/article/expert_commentary
The summaries hyperlink to the pdf articles.
And a new article by me is to be posted on this website in a couple of weeks.
And just to make clear, I have NEVER worked for the CDC, FDA, or a Pharmaceutical Company; however, I do have a small 401k invested in a broad stock and bond fund, so likely that I may own, through the fund, a few shares in a Pharmaceutical Companie. And when I was working, I attended conferences where pharmaceutical companies had booths with free bagels, note pads, candies, and pens and, yes, I did eat the bagels and took some of the freebees. My G-d, I must be a Pharma-Shill???
Hey Joel,
I noticed in your website (ECBT) that the caption under the photo says, “Joel and dog Zip flashing a ‘V’ for Vaccinate”.;
http://www.ecbt.org/index.php/facts_and_issues/article/short_biography_and_joels_mission_statement
Please explain how the dog is flashing the “V” sign.
From my perspective, it appears you have taken liberties with the dog.
In the real world, that dog doesn’t have a clue what your talking about.
So, either change the caption or continue looking like a fool. 🙂
Dr.Harrison,
“And if one is allergic to hepatitis B surface antigen, then how would one react to natural Hepatitis?”
Let’s also ask, if one is allergic to influenza HA antigen, then how would one react to natural influenza infection.
In both cases, the course of the disease will be significantly worse because concurrent with the infection, one will also suffer an allergic reaction.
This situation is happening right now across the northern hemisphere in the case of influenza, resulting in more deaths that you are reading about in the news. The influenza vaccine caused the development of long term persistent IgE mediated influenza allergy. When the vaccine has low efficacy as happened this season, people suffer the infection concurrent with an allergic reaction, resulting in more deaths. The cause of death is often described as “sepsis shock” as doctors DO NOT recognize that it is actually a case of slow rolling anaphylactic shock. Commonly, anaphylaxis occurs within minutes/hours due to a step change in allergen exposure. In the case of influenza allergy, the viral exposure ramps up over days (no step change), hence the slow rolling anaphylaxis.
This is the reason I am suggesting (earlier post) people take antihistamines upon influenza infection, to control the allergy part, especially if you have received the flu shot in the past few years.
Dr. Harrison,
You wrote:
“So you quote from an Institute of Medicine report about IgE, the antibody that protects us against worms (did you know that?) and involved in allergic reactions.”
“And if one is allergic to hepatitis B surface antigen, then how would one react to natural Hepatitis?”
Beautiful, thank you for bringing up worms because that is exactly what I was going to bring up next. So you agree that vaccines cause you to develop IgE mediated allergy to all proteins in the vaccine (such as hepatitis B surface antigen, ovalbumin, milk proteins (casein, casamino acids etc.)). In other words, the vaccine programs the immune system to recognize exposure to these proteins as a worm infection.
As quoted below, in low intensity worm infections, the immune response is IgE dominated. As the worm infection intensifies, the immune system starts making more IgG4, resulting in a high IgG4/IgE ratio state. If the worm infection intensity goes down, the immune system goes back to the IgE dominant state.
Turner et al [1]:
“Individuals who had detectable levels of IgE but not IgG4 to rABA-1A (11%) had lower average
levels of infection compared with individuals who produced anti-rABA-1A IgG4 (40%) and sero-
negative individuals (49%) (P = 0.008). The ratio of IgG4/IgE in rABA-1A responders positively
correlated with intensity of infection (P < 0.025).”
And we see the exact same thing in the food allergy literature. When as part of oral immunotherapy (OIT), a person starts slowly consuming more quantities of an allergen (“worm infection intensifying”), they develop high IgG4/IgE ratio specific to that protein.
Alum-Containing Vaccines Increase Total and Food Allergen-Specific IgE, and Cow’s Milk Oral Desensitization Increases Bosd4 IgG4 While Peanut Avoidance Increases Arah2 IgE … [2]
One of the milk proteins contaminating vaccines is the bovine folate receptor (FR) protein. It comes as no surprise that some people will develop IgE mediated allergy to FR following vaccination. If this person consumes cow’s milk, the immune system detects “worm infection intensifying” and produces IgG4 against FR.
IgG4 against FR is the main antibody involved in CFD and resulting ASD.[3]
And as expected, a milk free diet causes IgG4 levels to drop, and CFD/ASD symptoms improve.[4]
Genes of course can determine whether a person has a strong or weak immune response against worms. Having a genetic predisposition that produces a strong immune response against worms is obviously an advantageous feature. It takes poorly designed vaccines that misdirect that worm response towards harmless everyday food proteins, to produce life-threatening food allergy or life-ruining autism.
We don’t need “random mutation” hand-waving or jump through “epigenetic” hoops to explain the origin of antibodies involved in CFD, down to the exact antibody isotype and subtype.
So now you know EXACTLY how vaccines cause food allergies and autism. And we are not talking about just “biological plausibility”, but REPEATEDLY PROVEN biological processes.
I hate tetanus, measles and other VPD just as much as you do. I want a tetanus vaccine that is not contaminated with cow’s milk proteins. Is that too much to ask in 2018 after more than two hundred years of vaccine making? The first step in making better vaccines, is accepting and learning from the fact that current vaccines are fundamentally flawed.
More details and references:
https://zenodo.org/record/1034557
References
Turner JD, Faulkner H, Kamgno J, Kennedy MW, Behnke J, Boussinesq M, et al. Allergen-specific IgE and IgG4 are markers of resistance and susceptibility in a human intestinal nematode infection. Microbes Infect. 2005;7(7-8):990–6.
Hoyt AEW, Schuyler AJ, Heymann PW, Platts-Mills TAE, Commins SP. Alum-Containing Vaccines Increase Total and Food Allergen-Specific IgE, and Cow’s Milk Oral Desensitization Increases Bosd4 IgG4 While Peanut Avoidance Increases Arah2 IgE: The Complexity of Today’s Child with Food Allergy. J Allergy Clin Immunol. Elsevier; 2017 Jul 7;137(2):AB151.
Frye RE, Sequeira JM, Quadros E V, James SJ, Rossignol D a. Cerebral folate receptor autoantibodies in autism spectrum disorder. Mol Psychiatry. 2012;18(3):369–81.
Ramaekers VT, Sequeira JM, Blau N, Quadros E V. A milk-free diet downregulates folate receptor autoimmunity in cerebral folate deficiency syndrome. Dev Med Child Neurol. 2008;50(5):346–52.
Your citation number 3:
There is no control group. No blinding either and there is absolutely no way to know that the improvements described are the results of the diet or something else.
Alain
Folinic acid improves verbal communication in children with autism and language impairment: a randomized double-blind placebo-controlled trial
https://www.nature.com/articles/mp2016168
Dr.Harrison,
“Would you really prefer to get tetanus rather than a mild allergic reaction?”
False choice. If you clean up the dirty vaccine, you would NOT have to choose between tetanus and allergies.
“mild allergic reaction”
Anaphylaxis is not a “mild allergic reaction”. Please stop belittling a condition that can kill.
Every vaccine package insert will tell you, the vaccine is contraindicated if you have had anaphylaxis to the product in the past.
The first dirty vaccine causes you to develop IgE mediated allergy to the proteins.
The second dirty vaccine results in anaphylaxis due to the above allergy.
The third time it is contraindicated (my son’s case).
Fix the stupid root cause. Clean up the stupid vaccines instead of beating about the bush.
Your own ECBT “Scientific Advisory Board” member Dr. Offit said, vaccine makers and regulators have no interest in cleaning up these dirty vaccines. He called for consumer activism.
https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/article/paul-offit-a-choice-not-to-get-a-vaccine-is-not-a-risk-free-choice/
Why don’t you make some noise about that?
We know vaccines save lives. They don’t have to be contaminated with food proteins to save lives.
So please stop pushing this false choice between tetanus and allergies.
Rates of severe allergic reactions from vaccines are about one per million. http://www.jacionline.org/article/S0091-6749%2815%2901160-4/abstract
As much as you would like to claim otherwise, there’s no real evidence that vaccines cause food allergies, as opposed to trigger an existing allergy into an allergic reaction. In fact, large-scale studies found that vaccines do not cause the allergies.
To Vinu Arumugham:
You write: “In both cases, the course of the disease will be significantly worse because concurrent with the infection, one will also suffer an allergic reaction.”
That is absurd. Even if one had an allergic reaction to the vaccine, why would one have an allergic reaction to the natural microbe unless exposed to it concurrently with the vaccine? Are there bacteria and viruses floating out there with egg whites attached? You really are IRRATIONAL.
You write: “This situation is happening right now across the northern hemisphere in the case of influenza, resulting in more deaths that you are reading about in the news. The influenza vaccine caused the development of long term persistent IgE mediated influenza allergy. When the vaccine has low efficacy as happened this season, people suffer the infection concurrent with an allergic reaction, resulting in more deaths. The cause of death is often described as “sepsis shock” as doctors DO NOT recognize that it is actually a case of slow rolling anaphylactic shock.”
Wow, so you are privy to data/statistics that are NOT available to the general public. Delusions of Grandeur??? And your immense medical knowledge tells you that doctors would NOT know if “septic shock” is case of slow rolling anaphylactic shock. Really! Where did you find “slow rolling anaphylactic shock, certainly NOT in any medical text book. And if this were remotely the case, there would still be statistics/data on number of cases of septic shock deaths by month, so one could see if much higher during flu season and if not explained by some other bacterial infection or cause.
You write: “So you agree that vaccines cause you to develop IgE mediated allergy to all proteins in the vaccine (such as hepatitis B surface antigen, ovalbumin, milk proteins (casein, casamino acids etc.)). In other words, the vaccine programs the immune system to recognize exposure to these proteins as a worm infection.”
Nope, neither I nor the CDC report says vaccines cause allergies; however, if one has an allergy, e.g. eggs, then one will react to the minute traces of eggs in the vaccine. The vaccine doesn’t cause the allergy any more than if there is egg in bread, the bread caused the allergy. And you write: “in low intensity worm infections, the immune response is IgE dominated.” So how many American children with allergies have had worm infections, something much more prevalent in the Third World? And even if that were the case, the allergy would develop to the actual substance. As usual you found a few articles that confirm your rigid belief system.
By the way, I assume you are aware of the increase in allergies to peanuts? Of course you are and of course you believe caused by vaccines as most other antivaccinationists. Recent research has found that giving small doses of peanuts (not whole because infants would choke) early in life actually reduces significantly cases of peanut allergies, despite the kids getting all their vaccines. Research has also found that kids raised on farms have far fewer allergies. And kids raised with pets in urban environments. Explanation is simple, exposure to “dirt” leads immune system to habituate to non threatening substances. The only exception is kids raised in inner cities. Explanation is exposure to cockroach droppings. I won’t bother citing the articles on peanuts. Find them yourself. However, clearly one of the allergies on rise can’t be explained by vaccines.
As for your writing: “Anaphylaxis is not a “mild allergic reaction”. Please stop belittling a condition that can kill. Every vaccine package insert will tell you, the vaccine is contraindicated if you have had anaphylaxis to the product in the past.” Vaccine packets are written by manufacturers, not scientists. In fact, all pharmaceutical inserts have extensive lists of adverse reactions, including some that there may have been one case report without any proof caused by the vaccine. As for anaphylaxis being a condition that can kill. Well, yes; but not if there is medical professional and epipen or its equivalent. I have NEVER found a single report of someone dying from anaphylaxis after receiving a vaccine. Probably are a few cases I missed; but a few cases compared to literally 10s of thousands of deaths from vaccine-preventable diseases. We don’t live in your fantasy perfect world where ALL medical interventions work 100% of time with 0% risk. With vaccines, the risk from the vaccines are exponentially smaller than from the natural diseases.
Below is from CDC:
Persons Who Have Had an Allergic Reaction Following a Previous Immunization
For an individual patient who has experienced an immediate reaction to immunization, it is important to identify the type of reaction that occurred, obtain a history of prior allergic reactions, and try to identify the particular agent responsible. An algorithm approach to these patients has been published (13) and additional advice is available for allergists on the evaluation of these adverse events (10). In general, a history of a severe allergic reaction to a vaccine should be considered a contraindication to additional doses of the same vaccine (13). Referral of the individual to an allergist for evaluation is usually indicated to possibly determine the component responsible, before making decisions regarding administration of the additional doses of the same vaccine or other vaccines that have the same components. Patients who have not had a severe allergic reaction following a vaccine, but who have a history of possible allergy to a vaccine component can often be vaccinated safely after careful evaluation (6). [CDC (2017 Oct) Preventing and Managing Adverse Reactions. Available at: https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/hcp/acip-recs/general-recs/adverse-reactions.html ]
Note that they only recommend not giving same vaccine if components
As for “[my] own Dr. Offit [saying] “vaccine makers and regulators have not interest in cleaning up dirty vaccines. He called for consumer activism.” First, your choice of words “dirty vaccines” is not even close. How is milk protein, eggs, etc. dirty? They are natural ingredients found almost everywhere. I guess you consider pollen dirty since some people have allergies to it. Well, let’s get rid of pollen. Oops, no plants and we starve to death. Well, at least there would be NO pollen allergies. Dead people don’t exhibit allergies.
Offit actually said:
“Now, it took a long time for the science to mature. Frankly, it took about 10 years to do the kinds of epidemiological studies that showed that the whole-cell pertussis vaccine didn’t cause epilepsy, didn’t cause mental retardation. But from the standpoint of those parents, reasonably they were convinced by the show, there weren’t data in hand, and they ultimately, I think, formed a consumer activist movement that moved us away from the whole-cell pertussis vaccine, frankly, to a safer, so-called acellular vaccine. Although that old vaccine didn’t cause permanent harm, still the new vaccine was better, and I think that was a good outcome of that movement. And it led to something called the National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act, which included the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System. Many good things came from that original advocacy.”
Initial reports of serious adverse events did lead to development of the acellular vaccine; but later studies found that the serious adverse reactions were NOT associated with the vaccine. A problem with anecdotal reports. However, I disagree partially with Offit’s “safer, so-called acellular vaccine.” It does have fewer less serious adverse events; but has been found to not confer the same level of protection nor the same duration as the whole cell vaccine. And here we have a clear cost-benefit situation. Do we choose the vaccine with fewer non serious adverse events or the vaccine that confers better immunity and longer duration, thus needing fewer boosters? I would opt for the latter. The disease is still far more dangerous.
You write: “We know vaccines save lives. They don’t have to be contaminated with food proteins to save lives. So please stop pushing this false choice between tetanus and allergies.”
One can always improve on things. They are working on a universal flu vaccine made from recombinant genetics. But you continue to exaggerate the risk for severe allergic reactions from vaccines and your belief that they actually cause the allergies. People with an existing allergy can react; albeit in most cases with mild reactions and in rare instances with anaphylaxis which in the vast vast majority of cases is successfully treated with no long term sequelae.
It never hurts to get community input. This is what the Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System does and, yes, it was the public that led to VAERS. Unfortunately, antivaccinationists use VAERS reports to “prove” their case. However, just because someone thinks a vaccine responsible doesn’t make it so. Police often bring people in for interrogation following a crime. Should we assume each and every one guilty? Investigators look at VAERS for credible cases and do further investigations. The FDA does this with other drugs. No matter how well done the clinical trials to get something approved, there is always the possibility of rare events and, of course, if the public wants to speed up the improvements in anything, including vaccines, we can agree to pay higher taxes. The best researchers still need money to do their research. Offit did not say the manufacturers not interested in improving vaccines; but given the low profitiability (see my article to be posted next week on this blog) and the fact that they confer a much greater benefit with a much much smaller risk of harm, they are quite good right now.
There is an old saying: Don’t sacrifice the good for the perfect. As with peanut allergies, the latest research showing not caused by vaccines, they will find out what causes other allergies and develop appropriate interventions. I might point out that cow’s milk is designed for calves, not human babies. I haven’t found any articles of allergies to mother’s breast milk?
I get the impression that because you have a child with problems that you have become fixated on trying to lay blame and, unfortunately, your lack of understanding of the science underlying vaccines, and your ARROGANCE in thinking you are certain you are right, has you focusing on vaccines which if people were to listen to you could lead to an increase in vaccine-preventable diseases. While I sympathize with any parent whose child has problems and wish this NEVER occurred, I can’t sympathize with a parent fixated on a life-saving invention, e.g. vaccines, and writing and promoting opinions that potentially could lead to many harmed children. I realize you are at a stage where you are so vested in your beliefs that nothing will change them; so I direct my comments at other open-minded followers of the blog.
Dr. Harrison,
“Nope, neither I nor the CDC report says vaccines cause allergies”
Then you are demonstrating your inability to understand this simple statement from the IOM report:
https://iom.nationalacademies.org/Reports/2011/Adverse-Effects-of-Vaccines-Evidence-and-Causality.aspx
Document Pg. 65 (pdf pg. 94 ):
“Adverse events on our list thought to be due to IgE-mediated
hypersensitivity reactions
Antigens in the vaccines that the committee is charged with reviewing do
not typically elicit an immediate hypersensitivity reaction (e.g.,
hepatitis B surface antigen, toxoids, gelatin, ovalbumin, casamino acids).
However, as will be discussed in subsequent chapters, the
above-mentioned antigens do occasionally induce IgE-mediated
sensitization in some individuals and subsequent hypersensitivity
reactions, including anaphylaxis.”
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3122150/
“In the century since Paul Portier and Charles Richet described their landmark findings of severe fatal reactions in dogs re-exposed to venom after vaccination with sea anemone venom, treatment for anaphylaxis continues to evolve. ”
Severe fatal reactions in humans re-exposed to food proteins after vaccination with food proteins are killing our children now.
Is this rocket science? What have you geniuses learned in a hundred years? NOTHING. And our children are paying for it with their lives.
This is a crime against our children.
“why would one have an allergic reaction to the natural microbe ”
Because you are making IgE against the viral proteins.
Long Term Persistence of IgE Anti-Influenza Virus Antibodies in Pediatric and Adult Serum Post Vaccination with Influenza Virus Vaccine
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3065793/
Influenza specific serum IgE is present in non-allergic subjects.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16316424
Seasonal split influenza vaccine induced IgE sensitization against influenza vaccine.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26188254
“By the way, I assume you are aware of the increase in allergies to peanuts? … However, clearly one of the allergies on rise can’t be explained by vaccines.”
Wrong again.
https://www.nap.edu/catalog/23658/finding-a-path-to-safety-in-food-allergy-assessment-of
NAM report pg.241
“Allergens in Vaccines, Medications, and Dietary Supplements
Physicians and patients with food allergy must consider potential food
allergen exposures in vaccines, medications, and dietary supplement prod-
ucts (e.g., vitamins, probiotics), which are not regulated by labelling laws.
Also, excipients (i.e., substances added to medications to improve various
characteristics) may be food or derived from foods (Kelso, 2014). These
include milk proteins; soy derivatives; oils from sesame, peanut, fish or
soy; and beef or fish gelatin. The medications involved include vaccines;
anesthetics; and oral, topical, and injected medications. With perhaps the
exception of gelatin, reactions appear to be rare overall, likely because
little residual protein is included in the final preparation of these items. The
specific risk for each medication is not known.
Vaccines also may contain food allergens, such as egg protein or gela-
tin.”
“Really! Where did you find “slow rolling anaphylactic shock, certainly NOT in any medical text book.”
This is a problem created by poorly designed vaccines. Vaccines that cause IgE mediated sensitization to viral/bacterial proteins. This is a newly discovered man-made disease. The textbook has not been written yet … Your horribly designed vaccines create diseases at a rate the medical textbooks cannot keep up …
I predicted the finding below. Was it in your textbook?
Allergic reactions after egg-free recombinant influenza vaccine: reports to the US Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25428412
“As for anaphylaxis being a condition that can kill. Well, yes; but not if there is medical professional and epipen or its equivalent.”
You sickened 8% of kids with life-threatening food allergies using your horrible food protein contaminated vaccines. You want them to carry a medical professional in their backpack?
“With vaccines, the risk from the vaccines are exponentially smaller than from the natural diseases.”
Vaccines have simply replace communicable diseases with non-communicable diseases. I’ll admit that vaccines eradicated smallpox, polio etc. but considering the non-communicable diseases they have created, they are the worst medical disaster in history.
“How is milk protein, eggs, etc. dirty?”
They are supposed to be eaten, not injected.
https://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/medicine/laureates/1913/richet-lecture.html
“We are so constituted that we can never receive other proteins into the blood than those that have been modified by digestive juices. Every time alien protein penetrates by effraction, the organism suffers and becomes resistant. This resistance lies in increased sensitivity, a sort of revolt against the second parenteral injection which would be fatal. At the first injection, the organism was taken by surprise and did not resist. At the second injection, the organism mans its defences and answers by the anaphylactic shock.”
A hundred years later, you still don’t understand basic immunology …
” I guess you consider pollen dirty since some people have allergies to it. Well, let’s get rid of pollen. ”
There’s nothing wrong with pollen. How do people develop pollen allergies? Your horrible pollen protein contaminated vaccines. The FDA only bothers with viable organism contamination, not aeroallergen contamination of vaccines. So you have created the epidemic of allergies and asthma to pollen, cockroach droppings, house dust mite, pet dander and every other aeroallergen that vaccine plant personnel bring to the plant. The “clean room” spec. allows thousands of fine particles per m^3 to contaminate vaccines.
Short sighted influenza control policy based on poorly designed vaccines will sicken more people
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1112421
And that’s not all. The IgE to aeroallergens are not just sitting on mast cells in your airways causing allergies and asthma. They are sitting on mast cells in your stomach.
Everything you eat/drink is contaminated with aeroallergen proteins. Upon exposure to these aeroallergens, these stomach mast cells degranulate and dump histamine. Histamine increases stomach acid production. Epidemic of GERD. Voila!, multi-billion dollar blockbuster drug market for histamine H2 blockers and Proton Pump Inhibitors (PPI). And long term PPI causes cancer. There’s no end to the disaster you created with these horribly designed and manufactured vaccines.
Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!
Oh wait, you’re serious.
Let me laugh even harder!
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
Pollen allergies and hayfever predate even Edward Jenner.
There are natural pollen injectors like mosquitoes but they are not as efficient at producing allergies as aluminum adjuvanted vaccines.
And how, pray tell, did the pollen proteins wind up in the vaccines?
You got nothing.
please reread the post. The answer is there.
“Police often bring people in for interrogation following a crime. Should we assume each and every one guilty?”
Police should solve the crime. With vaccines we only hear “vaccines not guilty”, “vaccines not guilty”. Decades and billions later no one is even interested in solving the crimes of food allergy, autism, asthma or type 1 diabetes. Vaccines can never be declared not guilty until other root cause (or causes if you like) are found.
It is not even half past 10 in the morning where I am, and already that is the stupidest thing I’ve read all day.
1) Autism and Type 1 Diabetes are caused by genetics.
2) Even if we don’t know the cause of something, it is possible to exclude causes. The research has been done. Vaccines do not cause the things you claim.
To give you an analogy to explain your argument, suppose a person is accused of a crime. The suspect then produces proof that he was in a different city when the alleged crime occurs. You are saying that until another person is convicted, the first eprson must remain on the suspect list.
Do you understand how foolish you are being?
“Autism and Type 1 Diabetes are caused by genetics.”
Explain how genetics produces IgG4 antibodies against bovine folate receptor proteins?
Explain how genetics produces CD8 T cells against pancreatic beta cells, and why those T cells express skin homing markers?
And why many type 1 diabetes epitopes are located at near-identical regions of human vs. animal proteins contained in vaccines?
Here’s the Offit quote I am talking about:
“Yeah. I think there are a couple things. The influenza vaccine and the yellow fever vaccine are both made in eggs; therefore they contain small quantities or residual quantities of egg proteins. About a half a percent of the population is allergic to eggs, including severe allergies, including things such as bad hives and shock, and those people can’t get influenza vaccine. Well, there’s no reason you can’t grow influenza vaccine in mammalian cells, meaning non-avian cells. That can be done. The technology has been available to do that for decades, but there’s been little interest in doing that. It cries out for, in many ways, consumer activism.
Similarly, there’s a stabilizing agent that’s used in the chicken pox vaccine called gelatin. It allows the vaccine virus to be distributed equally throughout the vial. The question is, are there other stabilizing agents that you could use, that aren’t gelatin, that could accomplish the same thing? Absolutely. But again there’s [been] very little pressure, I think, to do that, even though it’s probably the most common allergenic material in vaccines.”
“However, I disagree partially with Offit’s “safer, so-called acellular vaccine.” It does have fewer less serious adverse events; but has been found to not confer the same level of protection nor the same duration as the whole cell vaccine.”
And, it does not prevent pertussis transmission. It provides no mucosal immunity. You can become colonized and as an asymptomatic carrier SPREAD the disease silently to unprotected babies (herd anti-immunity?). At least if you had a cough, you could stay away from babies. So you just the made the problem worse with your lousy vaccine design. And you develop multiple sclerosis [].
And for all these “benefits”, it is also helpfully contaminated with cow’s milk proteins so that you can develop life-threatening milk allergy and autism. Great job of “improving” the vaccine.
This is what happens when vaccinologists are clueless about immunological mechanism of vaccines and decide to experiment on the general population, while lying to them about vaccine safety.
“One can always improve on things.”
For vaccine makers, it is a case of “If it ain’t broken don’t fix it”. So vaccine makers are NOT going to fix it until the medical community accepts and declares that these horrible vaccines are broken. We still have the 50 year old MMR vaccine. Encephalitis is a known vaccine injury table listed injury for MMR. Even when there are accepted/declared problems like encephalitis there are no improvements to vaccines. Why?
“They are working on a universal flu vaccine made from recombinant genetics.”
The first question that needs to be answered is why does the human body not already use that technique.
After the first flu infection, the human immune system could create life-long protection against the non-variable influenza stalk protein, conferring universal protection against ALL future influenza infections. Why does that not happen? Without understanding such fundamental questions, they want to cluelessly spend a billion dollars finding a new way to shoot themselves in the foot with a “universal flu vaccine”.
One possible explanation is molecular mimicry between stalk proteins and human self antigens. So the immune system does not risk autoimmunity by creating a response against the stalk protein. Now if you force it/fool it into creating an immune response, perhaps by using an adjuvant, you will create a new set of autoimmune disorders.
“we can agree to pay higher taxes.”
If all the taxes used to hide vaccine safety problems and pushing unsafe vaccines are used to improve vaccine safety, no higher taxes would be needed.
“I haven’t found any articles of allergies to mother’s breast milk?”
That’s because vaccine makers have not added that to vaccines yet.
“And you write: “in low intensity worm infections, the immune response is IgE dominated.” So how many American children with allergies have had worm infections”
I said nothing about American children having worm infections. I said vaccinating with proteins programs the immune system to treat those proteins as worm proteins. I was pointing out that the dynamics of IgE/IgG4 in worm infections are therefore applicable in the case of vaccine-induced allergy.
Dr. Harrison,
You still have not responded with your understanding of the IOM’s IgE statement.
Dorit Rubinstein Reiss writes,
“there’s no real evidence that vaccines cause food allergies”
MJD says,
From the NIH website titled, Allergen Immunotherapy:
“Scientists are attempting to use immunotherapy to prevent and treat food allergy. However, the balance between the benefits and risks of immunotherapy for food allergy has not yet been well-studied, and it currently is not recommended except as an experimental approach.”
https://web.archive.org/web/20160909195614/http://www.niaid.nih.gov/topics/allergicDiseases/Pages/allergen-immunotherapy.aspx
Therefore, this also implies that scientists are UNCERTAIN about the effects of food-stuff proteins in vaccines.
In simplicity, and as Vinu teaches, manufacturers should be proactive and “clean up” vaccines making absolutely sure they are substantially free of said proteins.
Thanks, Vinu!
You are welcome, MJD!
@ Vinu Arumugham:
I just read Hoyt’s article that you reference. Actually NOT an article; but an ABSTRACT based on ONE, I repeat ONE case. And the authors indicate NO awareness of the latest research reducing the risks significantly of peanut allergies by actually giving small doses of peanuts at an early age while still vaccinating. And despite what they believe the association to be, in case studies there are always potential unmeasured variables actually responsible. Duh, I get you don’t understand this is why, at best, case studies, not one, can lead to hypotheses and actual research studies!
You really are an IDIOT, finding one abstract based on one case and off you go into the wild blue yonder.
@ Joel A. Harrison, PhD, MPH:
I really enjoy and appreciate your fine work on this thread directed at vinu- even if it never has an effect on him. others will read and learn.
NOW could you please, please do something about MJD?
Allowing him to wither on the vine seems to be the best approach.
@ Denice Walter:
How about taking up a collection so he can afford to go back on his meds?
It gets hilariously better from a Vinu standpoint: “Food Allergen Component Proteins Are Not Detected in Early-Childhood Vaccines,” also with Hoyt as first author.
You left this out:
“Although the ELISA detection limits are
quite low, the amount of allergen required to cause sensitization
is poorly understood”
But we know 8-18 ng/ml of casein in Dtap/Tdap not only is enough to cause sensitization, it is enough to cause anaphylaxis.
http://www.jacionline.org/article/S0091-6749(11)00747-0/fulltext
Dr. Harrison,
In that study of n=1, the duration was three weeks from vaccination to IgE measurement.
“And despite what they believe the association to be, in case studies there are always potential unmeasured variables actually responsible.”
If with n=1 and a duration of three weeks, one could have “unmeasured variables”, what happens with your epidemiological studies that have thousands of subjects followed for years? How many unmeasured variables do you have then? So your epidemiological studies generate piles and piles of “large scale” garbage. Explains why vaccine safety is an oxymoron. Explains why after billions and decades spent, you have answers to NOTHING. What is the root cause of food allergy, asthma, autism, type 1 diabetes? Official answer: Don’t know. Since when has it become fashionable to refer to these people who don’t know as “experts”?
The proof of the pudding is in the eating. If you are the expert, give me the answers. Otherwise, accept that you are no expert. I have root cause for ALL of them based on proven biological processes. You have NONE.
@ Vinu Arumugham:
So, “The proof of the pudding is in the eating. If you are the expert, give me the answers. Otherwise, accept that you are no expert. I have root cause for ALL of them based on proven biological processes. You have NONE..”
I look forward to your receiving the Noble Prize in Medicine. Wow, you really are one ARROGANT SOB. There is a difference between expertise in conducting and evaluating research and reviewing what is known and religious doctrine that assumes knowing the absolute answers. Prior to 1950s cancer was a death sentence. Nowadays we can save many lives and prolong others; but not always. So, I guess this is worthless. Either we totally understand the single (in your warped mind) cause of cancer and either can prevent it or always cure it or in your mind we know nothing. You really should go back on your meds.
As for “If with n=1 and a duration of three weeks, one could have “unmeasured variables”, what happens with your epidemiological studies that have thousands of subjects followed for years? How many unmeasured variables do you have then?”
You really DON’T UNDERSTAND. First, the larger the study population, the greater chance that random unmeasured variables that might affect the outcome in a few cases, will distribute between groups so less likely the “cause(s)”. Second, by replicating studies on different study populations with varied study designs, the chance of random unmeasured variables affecting the outcome gets less and less. However, as I have already written, one can’t prove the Null Hypothesis. One compares various groups on the difference of one or a few key variables, if they differ, then one gives a probability that the difference was actually “caused” by those variables and not random unmeasured variables. The probability becomes smaller the larger the groups AND the more varied replication studies; but as I wrote previously, even the Law of Gravity can’t state absolutely that some weird confluence of known or unknown cosmic factors might nullify its effects somewhere on planet Earth.
As for: “Explains why after billions and decades spent, you have answers to NOTHING. What is the root cause of food allergy, asthma, autism, type 1 diabetes? Official answer: Don’t know. Since when has it become fashionable to refer to these people who don’t know as “experts”?”
First, what makes you think there is ONE cause? I guess your pea brain would like a world where everything is black and white, where each thing has one and only one cause.
“answers to NOTHING.” You really are one sicko. We do know some of the causes or contributing factors of the above. Some Autism Spectrum Disorders have a clear genetic cause. Type 1 diabetes occurs most frequently in certain subtypes of HLA and has been linked to infection with measles (molecular mimicry), no, not the vaccine, the wild type virus. I’m not going to give some extensive list, wouldn’t make any difference and I don’t have the time.
It would be nice if we had simple answers; but the human body is very complex and the environment equally so. But knowledge is growing in leaps and bounds.
Even the article you link to by Kattan backs what I have written: “Clearly, many highly sensitive children with milk allergy tolerate the vaccines because these reactions are apparently rare . . . we recommend continuing the standard practice for DPT vaccination in all children, but advise caution when administering booster doses in highly sensitive milk-allergic children.” So, if you know a kid is high sensitive, simply keep them under observation for a few minutes with an epipen at hand. And the kids at risk for various ingredients used in miniscule levels in vaccines are at greater risk out in the world where they might not have an epipen available and such ingredients are often not clearly indicated on labels, etc. And the risks from the wild type vaccine-preventable diseases is much worse.
You are really tiresome. Someone who doesn’t understand immunology, microbiology, etc.; but are certain you have the answers. Well, tell you what, you don’t live too far from me. There is a nice little lake and it never freezes in Southern California. Tell me when you would like to come down and demonstrate your ability to walk on water. Until then, your arrogant belief that you have god-like absolute certainty just comes off as delusions of grandeur and that you really need professional help.
“Type 1 diabetes occurs most frequently in certain subtypes of HLA and has been linked to infection with measles (molecular mimicry), no, not the vaccine, the wild type virus.”
Genes did not change in the last 50 years. Measles have been reduced by vaccines. So why did type 1 diabetes prevalence increase?
Here’s a better answer:
Bioinformatics analysis links type 1 diabetes to vaccines contaminated with animal proteins and autoreactive T cells express skin homing receptors consistent with injected vaccines as causal agent
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034775
Cancer immunology, bioinformatics and chemokine evidence link vaccines contaminated with animal proteins to autoimmune disease: a detailed look at Crohn’s disease and Vitiligo
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034777
“arrogant belief … delusions of grandeur ”
I know I am a nobody but I stand on the shoulders of giants such as Richet, Wells and Osborne.
You ignored their seminal findings because of your hubris.
I therefore see these vaccine problems from a perspective you cannot.
“random unmeasured variables”
Assumption. How do you know the unmeasured variables are random?
“a few key variables”
Vaccinologists don’t understand immunological mechanisms. So you epidemiologists understand these mechanisms even less. How do you even know what the key variables are?
You could always stop feeding him.
“And the authors indicate NO awareness of the latest research reducing the risks significantly of peanut allergies by actually giving small doses of peanuts at an early age while still vaccinating.”
That’s not latest research, that is reinventing the wheel. It has been known for a hundred years.
Wells HG, Osborne TB. The Biological Reactions of the Vegetable Proteins I. Anaphylaxis. J
Infect Dis. 1911;8(1):66–124.
See pg.77-78
https://www.jstor.org/stable/30073318?seq=13#page_scan_tab_contents
@ Vinu Arumugham:
So, you found an article about food allergies. However, the only thing that mentions peanuts is almost at the end where it says: “Schema also records the use of the anaphylaxis reaction for the detection of the presence of small amounts of poisonous seeds mixed with food stuffs. He studied extracts of rye bran, peanut flour, and sesame-cake meal, which were contaminated or adulterated with castor-bean meal, cockle, charlock, and ergot.” (Wells, 1911, page 72)
Where does it talk about reducing the risk of any of the proteins by giving small amounts at an early age? And I couldn’t find any mention of vaccines in the article. Apparently, it is even the peanut flour that the article claims responsible for the anaphylaxis; but contaminants.
In case you are wondering, I got the entire article, all 58 pages and skimmed it.
“Where does it talk about reducing the risk of any of the proteins by giving small amounts at an early age?”
Please see pg. 78 with sentence starting “To part of them moistened corn meal …”
“sensitizing dose of zein” is vaccinating with zein. If corn was fed before vaccine, no sensitization/reaction. If no corn fed before vaccine, they were sensitized and subsequent exposure causes reaction.
Exact same situation as early peanut feed and peanut contaminated vaccines.
So if you can’t wow them with evidence, make up a symptom and look for a VAERS report that sounds a little bit like it?
FWIW, VAERS reports are unconfirmed. Anyone can report anything.
Said the fool to an enlightened scientist; hiroshima born again…
Alain
@ vinu arumugham
You write: “How is milk protein, eggs, etc. dirty?” They are supposed to be eaten, not injected.
Actually lactose intolerance exists in literature going back long before vaccines AND studies have shown an association between formula and colic. Colic seldom if ever found in breast fed babies. So, as I wrote earlier, maybe milk is intended for calves and just fortunate that many humans can use it; but some credible studies have also found that casein, milk protein, not really all that good for us. Whether true or not, I’ll leave that to future research.
Richet was talking about a toxin/poison. Only someone like you would automatically assume his findings apply to any type of protein. Our immune system has a number of ways to recognize dangerous intruders, including Toll-like receptors that recognize conserved patterns that pose a danger, and obviously would react the first time exposed to a toxin. And a number of the above are used in various medicines, including injectable ones, found in some perfumes, which could penetrate skins through small abrasions, etc.
You missed the comment where I discussed low rates of allergies among rural children and not as low, but lower also among kids raised with pets. You still have a need to ignore our complex bodies and environments in order to focus on vaccines.
Since you think you know more about immunology than I do, please list some of the books you have read and colleagues/friends who are immunologists who you regularly consult with.
You write: “NAM report pg.241 “Allergens in Vaccines, Medications, and Dietary Supplements Physicians and patients with food allergy must consider potential food allergen exposures in vaccines, medications, and dietary supplement products (e.g., vitamins, probiotics), which are not regulated by labelling laws.”
You really are STUPID. Yes, some ingredients in vaccines are allergens; but that doesn’t mean the vaccines caused the allergy which existed earlier. You don’t seem to understand the difference between an already existing allergy and the risk of being exposed to it. Incredible!
As for: ““And the authors indicate NO awareness of the latest research reducing the risks significantly of peanut allergies by actually giving small doses of peanuts at an early age while still vaccinating.” That’s not latest research, that is reinventing the wheel. It has been known for a hundred years. Wells HG, Osborne TB. The Biological Reactions of the Vegetable Proteins I. Anaphylaxis. J Infect Dis. 1911;8(1):66–124.
Yep, in guinea pigs they found they could prevent an allergic reaction by giving zein (corn protein) and oats at an early age. Well, we aren’t guinea pigs. Different species react differently. Give aspirin to a guinea pig and it dies. Give small doses to people and even dogs and beneficial. In fact, thalidomide was tested on several species. Some it had NO effect, others devastating effects. So, you found one article from long ago. And corn isn’t a dairy product, nor eggs, nor peanuts. The only mention of peanuts was that if contaminated with, for instance the fungus ergot, resulted in anaphylaxis. So, I’ll give you credit for finding an interesting article which I will add to my food allergy folder; but NO credit for your thinking you’ve proven anything. Nice paper; but obviously it has had NO effect on antivaccinationists claims of peanut allergies increasing due to vaccines. You keep missing the point that the new studies have found that kids given small doses of peanuts in powder form or the like have successfully avoided developing severe allergies despite given ALL the vaccines. If vaccines elicit IgE etc, why didn’t these kids develop severe allergies? And you are hoisted on your own petard by showing that early doses of a protein prevent allergic reactions despite vaccinations.
And you write: “Exact same situation as early peanut feed and peanut contaminated vaccines.” Actually, NO. Corn and oats are grains. Peanuts are a legume. Totally different. I have almost always owned and loved dogs. I give my dog hypoallergenic foods, no soy, corn, or wheat and I avoid giving him any type of nut as they can be toxic; however, I do give him salt free sugar free peanut butter. So, the article did NOT mention an intervention with peanuts and you automatically lump everything together that fits your ideology. In any case, once again, if early feeding of peanuts stops most cases of severe allergies despite kids getting all the vaccines, then difficult to blame the vaccines as cause.
In any case, I admit that late at night skimming the article I did miss something, even if for the most part it was not on point. When I write actual articles I take my time, re and re-read, take notes, write and revise and then send to colleagues, including professional immunologists. I NEVER assume that I am always right and solicit feedback, emphasizing no holds barred. I don’t walk on water; but I have 50 years of studying related subjects, attending seminars, and, as stated above, always asking others to critique what I write. Of course not with rapidly formed comments for a blog.
You write: “Genes did not change in the last 50 years. Measles have been reduced by vaccines. So why did type 1 diabetes prevalence increase?” First, if one reads literature from centuries ago, diabetes existed; but they died very young. Second, low birthweight and very low birthweight children that would have died years ago, now are alive and the literature shows that almost all of them have some problem or problems. And I could think of a number of other potential factors; but you can ONLY think of one.
How about this:
“A series of studies have reported a constant global rise in the incidence of type 1 diabetes. Epidemiological and immunological studies have demonstrated that environmental factors may influence the pathogenesis, leading to a cell-mediated pancreatic β-cell destruction associated with humoral immunity. The search for the triggering factor(s) has been going on for the past century, and yet they are still unknown. This review provides an overview of some of the most well-known theories found in the literature: hygiene, viral, vitamin D deficiency, breast milk and cow’s milk hypotheses. Although the hygiene hypothesis appears to be the most promising, positive evidence from animal, human and epidemiological studies precludes us from completely discarding any of the other hypotheses. Moreover, due to contrasting evidence in the literature, a single factor is unlikely to cause an increase in the incidence of diabetes all over the world, which suggests that a multifactorial process might be involved. Although the immunological mechanisms are still unclear, there seems to be some overlap between the various hypotheses. It is thought that the emphasis should be shifted from a single to a multifactorial process and that perhaps the ‘balance shift’ model should be considered as a possible explanation for the rise in the incidence of type 1 diabetes.” Egro (2013 Aug 1). Why is type 1 diabetes increasing? Journal of Molecular Endocrinology, Available at: http://jme.endocrinology-journals.org/content/51/1/R1.full.pdf+html
Notice the article mentions the “hygiene hypothesis” as the potentially main cause, what I was referring to by mentioning very low rates of allergies in rural kids and kids with pets. I also discussed multifactorial, something you reject, etc. And it mentions one study where introduction of MMR vaccine led to plateuing of incidence of diabetes; but also not replicated. However, the article discusses incidence of diabetes associated with several wild-type viruses.
You write: “If ingestion were the same as injection as you claim, why don’t you squirt the aluminum adjuvanted DTap vaccine into the child’s mouth? Why administer it as an intramuscular injection?” I guess you missed that I wrote through minor skin abrasions. And given that aluminum is ubiquitous and has been for 100s of millions of years our immune system, e.g. toll receptors, would NOT necessarily react regardless of mode of entry. Read, for instance, about Pattern Recognition Receptors, including pathogen-associated molecular patterns and damage-associated molecular patterns. Our immune system would go crazy if it reacted to everything in our environment, so it has developed ways to reduce this risk. And, by the way, they are working on vaccines that can be eaten, e.g. in bananas.
You cite the NAM report that does deal with the allergens in vaccines; but clearly states that severe reactions are RARE.
As for “You sickened 8% of kids with life-threatening food allergies using your horrible food protein contaminated vaccines. You want them to carry a medical professional in their backpack?” First, once again, despite what you choose to believe the allergies existed outside vaccinations and the research has found that most reactions to vaccines are mild. If, despite what you choose to believe, vaccines did not cause the allergies, then regardless kids with allergies should carry an epipen. Maybe you should focus your rage at a more valid direction. In UK epipens, two, cost $40. In US, $400 even though cost about $2 or $3 to produce.
You write: “Decades and billions later no one is even interested in solving the crimes of food allergy, autism, asthma or type 1 diabetes. Vaccines can never be declared not guilty until other root cause (or causes if you like) are found.” Root causes??? Nope, if multifactorial, including genetic predispositions, epigenetics, the 100,000 chemical introduced into our environment since World War II, our changing diets, over and misuse of antibiotics, etc. lots of possibilities.
Finally, together with your absolutist statements, “NOTHING”, “Horrible food protein contaminated vaccines, etc. absolute proof of your irrationality, of your succumbing to the Nirvana fallacy, that is, ignoring the realities of our world for an idealistic perfect world. You write: “police should solve the crimes.” Yep, it would be great; but they don’t solve most crimes. Yet, they do solve crimes and sometimes innocent people are convicted. And until they solve each and every crime with hard irrefutable evidence then each one of us, according to you, is still a suspect. Can you with absolute certainty prove that you didn’t commit any single crime within 50 miles of your place of work or residence? What an absurd statement. If we can’t find the “root” cause then everything and anything remains a “suspect” with regard to allergies. Did you really graduate from an institute of higher learning? Maybe you should read Thomas Nichol’s book “The Death of Expertise” where he makes a compelling case summarized as “Your Ignorance Equals My Knowledge.” You, in your arrogance and stupidity, believe that you know for certain what researchers around the world are working on. You are more intelligent and knowledgeable than the combined abilities of literally 10s of thousands. Wow! We live in an imperfect world. So, given your approach to things, since police don’t solve most crimes, should we just disband our police forces?
Now, I have wasted enough time on this. I am just finishing my next article which should be posted on this site, perhas as early as next Monday. It has been reviewed/critiqued by 8 professionals, though only two allowed their names to be included in the Acknowledgments.
You keep referring to your own articles. Let me know when any gets in a peer-reviewed journal and even more so, let me know when you have been hired as an assistant professor of immunology or I’m still awaiting proof you can walk on water. All you manage to do if attempt to find a few errors in what I write; but that is like a defense lawyer discrediting one or two eye witnesses; but not DNA, fingerprints, etc. You make the same mistake all antivaccinationists make, assuming that if you find one or two errors it discredits everything. Well, it doesn’t and you haven’t even managed to really find errors in what I wrote.
Now back to my article. I am also reading a new edition of an immunology book. I regularly try to keep up with the latest, besides Scientific American, Nature and Science Magazines, and refresh what I have learned. I’m also reading a book on American History. And writing comments on blogs takes my time away from the above. My articles are read by, hopefully, lots of people, whereas only a few notice comments on a blog. However, I download them and save for future reference in what to expect from antivaccinationists to help in writing future articles
“Richet was talking about a toxin/poison. Only someone like you would automatically assume his findings apply to any type of protein.”
Attention to detail? …
https://www.nobelprize.org/nobel_prizes/medicine/laureates/1913/richet-lecture.html
“On the other hand all the proteins without exception produce anaphylaxis: one has seen this with all sera, milks, organic extracts whatsoever, all vegetable extracts, microbial proteinotoxins, yeast cells, dead microbial bodies. It would be of more interest now to find a protein which does not produce anaphylaxis than to find one that does.”
You don’t have a clue of hundred year old immunology concepts and you are a vaccine salesman?
“lactose intolerance”
What has lactose intolerance got to do with injected vs. ingested cow’s milk?
“You missed the comment where I discussed low rates of allergies among rural children and not as low, but lower also among kids raised with pets. You still have a need to ignore our complex bodies and environments in order to focus on vaccines.”
Rural children and kids raised with pets are likely to have a healthier gut microbiome.
Poor gut microbiome PREDISPOSES for allergy. C-section birth and antibiotics can also result in suboptimal gut microbiome. Predisposition is just that, predisposition. Predisposition does not create allergy. You need a dirty vaccine to create allergy.
type 1 diabetes and autoimmunity
They performed a simple experiment. They injected human skin protein into mice. The mice developed vitiligo – an autoimmune disease. Human and mouse skin protein are similar but not identical. The mouse immune system detected this difference and determined that the human skin protein must be mutated mouse skin protein – cancer. So it attacks the human skin protein but given the similarity, it also ends up attacking mouse skin protein. Autoimmunity as a result of a “cancer” immune response.
In humans with skin cancer, developing vitiligo improves prognosis. Basically, it is a sign that your immune system is attacking the cancer.
What happens when you do the opposite and inject humans with animal proteins?
What happens when you inject vaccines containing numerous animal proteins (chick embryo cell culture, Madin Darby Canine Kidney (MDCK), bovine serum albumin, porcine gelatin, Vero green monkey proteins etc.) into humans? You get to discover new man-made autoimmune diseases everyday. No “multifactorial” cock and bull story needed. Type 1 diabetes, Neuro Myelitis Optica Spectrum Disorders, System Lupus Erythematosus, Crohn’s, Vitiligo, Kawasaki disease just to name a few.
One of the latest “treatments” for IgE mediated vaccine induced allergies is omalizumab.
Take a sledgehammer and destroy ALL IgE indiscriminately. Pure genius. Ends up causing increases in cancer and parasitic infections. And omalizumab is made with Chinese Hamster Ovary (CHO) cells. What happens when you inject CHO animal proteins into humans? Autoimmunity.
When will you ever learn?
Maybe you should call it AIECBT.
Allergy in every child by two.
Asthma in every child by two.
Autism in every child by two.
Autoimmunity in every child by two.
Pushing dirty vaccines, you can claim great progress with this mission statement.
Bovine serum albumin (BSA) contaminated vaccines and membranous nephropathy (MN):
In response to:
“Have you considered bovine serum albumin (BSA) contaminated vaccines as the source of both BSA and BSA antibodies in these patients?”
Dr. Du writes:
“That is a very interesting question I never thought about. Immunization of some types of mouse strains (e.g. BALB/c) with cBSA can induce MN-like kidney disease. …”
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/51182667_Early-Childhood_Membranous_Nephropathy_Due_to_Cationic_Bovine_Serum_Albumin?feedback/
“peer-reviewed journal”
https://www.omicsonline.org/open-access/evidence-that-food-proteins-in-vaccines-cause-the-development-of-foodallergies-and-its-implications-for-vaccine-policy-2329-6631-1000137.php?aid=60994
“Corn and oats are grains. Peanuts are a legume. Totally different.”
Nonsense. They all have proteins and you can develop allergy to all those proteins by the same mechanism. As Richet and the IOM have pointed out, you develop allergy to not just grains and legume proteins but to all proteins including viral/bacterial/fungal and any food proteins.
“Well, we aren’t guinea pigs.”
That’s why they use guinea pigs to create the model of human asthma?
Medical Immunology notes from the University of California, Irvine, School of Medicine.
http://jeeves.mmg.uci.edu/immunology/CoreNotes/Chap21.pdf
pg. 157:
“A guinea pig can be sensitized by intramuscular injection of an antigen, say OVA
(ovalbumin). Its immune system responds by producing antibody to OVA, including (but not
exclusively) IgE. Some of this circulating IgE will be fixed onto mast cells in various tissues,
including the vasculature and respiratory tract. Three weeks later, the same animal can be
challenged either with an intravenous dose of OVA or by exposure to an aerosol containing
OVA. Following IV injection, the animal will rapidly develop severe vascular shock and die
within a few minutes (the combination of venule constriction and capillary dilation results in
pooling of blood in the peripheral circulation and a drastic drop in blood pressure). If
exposed to the aerosol, it will equally rapidly die from bronchial constriction, an
experimental model for human asthma.”
“Yes, some ingredients in vaccines are allergens; but that doesn’t mean the vaccines caused the allergy which existed earlier.”
The allergy DID NOT exist earlier. The first ever exposure to most allergen food proteins that children have is through food protein containing vaccines. They are sensitized by the vaccine and that is why they react the first time they are exposed to those foods in their diet.
“If vaccines elicit IgE etc, why didn’t these kids develop severe allergies?”
It is not early/late oral peanut introduction that matters for allergy. It is oral peanut introduction BEFORE peanut containing vaccines are administered, that reduces allergy, as was the case for zein/guinea pigs in 1911.
Children definitely developed severe peanut allergies without early peanut introduction, just like those guinea pigs back in 1911.
Introducing peanut in the diet before vaccinations produces oral tolerance, that provides some protection against developing peanut allergy. But that is no excuse to inject peanut containing vaccines into children.
First stop doing stupid things like injecting food into people, nature can deal with the rest.
Children get yeast containing HepB the day they are born. How are you going to introduce yeast into their diet before their HepB vaccination? They develop IgE against yeast. Result: atopic dermatitis. Your vaccines are an absolute disaster.
Professional Misconduct by NAM Committee on Food Allergy
https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034559
“First, if one reads literature from centuries ago, diabetes existed; but they died very young. Second, low birthweight and very low birthweight children that would have died years ago, now are alive and the literature shows that almost all of them have some problem or problems. And I could think of a number of other potential factors; but you can ONLY think of one.”
Centuries ago, you would not know which type of diabetes it was. Stop hand waving.
Can you explain the exact mechanisms of how low birth weight would lead to the formation of CD8 T cells that target pancreatic beta cells? Why do these T cells express a skin-homing receptor? Why do most epitopes involved in type 1 diabetes straddle near-identical regions of human vs. animal proteins contained in vaccines?
You could think of any number of irrelevant factors, but you have to explain the observations made in type 1 diabetes literature.
“This review provides an overview of some of the most well-known theories found in the literature: hygiene, viral, vitamin D deficiency, breast milk and cow’s milk hypotheses.”
And they don’t even consider the most stupid thing they have been doing. Injecting animal proteins into humans. Any surprise why they are still spinning their wheels a century later?
Dr. Joseph Cantor is an Assistant Professor of Medicine with the UC San
Diego School of Medicine.
He has a PhD in Immunology. He is a Journal referee for the Diabetes
Journal published by the American Diabetes Association.
http://raidivision.ucsd.edu/Faculty/Pages/joseph-cantor.aspx
I wrote this article:
Role of MMR II vaccine contamination with GAD65 containing chick embryo
cell culture in the etiology of type 1 diabetes
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/318305895_Role_of_MMR_II_vaccine_contamination_with_GAD65_containing_chick_embryo_cell_culture_in_the_etiology_of_type_1_diabetes
Dr. Cantor commented on my article above:
“This is a logical hypothesis and designing pre- and post-vaccination
GAD65 autoantibody levels is a reasonable first step to obtain evidence
of a humoral immune response to a vaccine “contaminant” that is also an
autoantigen in Type I Diabetes. If these data support the hypothesis
then mechanistic cause/effect studies should be done in the best animal
model available. In our frustration with random (and dangerous)
nonsensical anti-vaccine arguments, we should be careful not to
overreact and avoid all vaccine safety research. In the true spirit of
scientific inquiry and progress, we should continually strive to improve
vaccine safety at the same time as efficacy. From what I have read, Vinu
is not arguing for reducing or stopping vaccines, which of course save
millions of lives, but rather to make the best vaccines that we can.”
The article above was also recommended by 3 other diabetes experts.
PDF: https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034771
Is there some reason that your brilliance doesn’t allow you to prevent these shitty line breaks, Pretend Medical Student?
“Vaccine packets are written by manufacturers, not scientists.”
You are saying vaccine manufacturers (along with CDC and Sabin covered before) are also clueless about science. Now we are in agreement.
“it is important to identify the type of reaction that occurred, obtain a history of prior allergic reactions, and try to identify the particular agent responsible.”
Clueless CDC again. There are thousands of different proteins in each vaccine and you administer five shots in one sitting and they want to “try to identify the particular agent responsible.”.
Johns Hopkins tried that for my son and came up empty.
“Kattan backs what I have written”
Kattan backs what I have written too.
Kattan says clean up the dirty vaccine.
“Manufacturer investigation and possible labeling or elimination of casein from the vaccines might avoid this risk.”
The Japanese agree with me too.
Removal of gelatin from live vaccines and DTaP-an ultimate solution for vaccine-related gelatin allergy.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14624794
Destefano et al. reported Type 1 diabetes odds ratio for MMR vaccine is 1.36, Hib is 1.14, Varicella is 1.16. Patterson et al. reported T1D odds ratio for tetanus vaccine is 1.57 and diptheria is 1.27.
https://iom.nationalacademies.org/Reports/2011/Adverse-Effects-of-Vaccines-Evidence-and-Causality.aspx
Assuming 90% vaccine uptake and calculating the number of cases for the US population of 320 million, we get 1 million cases of T1D. Estimated total for T1D cases from American Diabetes Association is 1.25 million. So your epidemiological studies themselves are showing that the vast majority of T1D cases were vaccine induced.
Jesus Christ, shut up already vinu.
“Nirvana fallacy”
Nonsense. When you had the technology to meet 7.4mcg/ml of ovalbumin contamination in the influenza vaccine in 1967, why were you sickening people with 38.3 mcg/ml in 2008?
“O’Brien et al. [13] measured 7.4 mcg/ml of ovalbumin in influenza vaccines in 1967. Goldis et al. [14] measured as much as 38.3 mcg/ml in influenza vaccines as recently as 2008. ”
https://www.omicsonline.org/open-access/evidence-that-food-proteins-in-vaccines-cause-the-development-of-foodallergies-and-its-implications-for-vaccine-policy-2329-6631-1000137.php?aid=60994
@ Vinu Arumugham:
You really are one big jerk. I’m not a vaccine salesman. Salesman implies some economic interest. As I wrote on a previous comment, I don’t even own shares in pharmaceuticals except what a broad 401k stock and bond fund may have. But yes, I reminded my grandparents and parents when they were alive to get flu shots, pneumococcal shots and all my friends to make sure their kids fully vaccinated. And I have had ALL vaccines recommended and more. When I worked for US Navy years ago in Western Pacific, I got Yellow Fever, Typhoic/Paratyphoid, Plague, Cholera, my THIRD smallpox vaccine (one as infant, one again when went to Europe summer 1968 and then Navy 1975), and all the others, all by walking down a corridor at one time. Both arms were really sore and had low grade fever. Finally took a couple of aspirins and I was fine next day. So, based on 50 years of study, and my understanding of things being multi causal, and all the research on vaccines, yes, I am a vaccine advocate and proud of it; but I don’t suffer from delusions of grandeur. However, until you get hired as assistant professor in immunology and/or get several of your self-published, non-peer-reviewed, not reviewed at all except by a few random persons, noticed and evaluated by a reasonable number of people, you are just one more person with NO CREDIBILITY! And your cherry picking of studies together with GROSS extrapolations just doesn’t cut it.
As for Richet’s lecture, yep, they found anaphylaxis, with strongest reaction in guinea pigs. Again, extrapolated from one species to another is problematic. One case mentioned of preventive injection of anti plague serum in humans. You do understand that serum refers to gamma globulin taken from and combined from numerous persons who survived (so reaction could have been to anything, e.g. foreign human proteins); but you continue to miss the main point that such reactions have been found to be rare in children following vaccinations and, as I wrote, I have found NO cases of death or long term sequelae; but I have NO doubt there have been a few, not from Septic Shock from your slow developing anaphylaxis. But until credible evidence, not some lunatic self-published who thinks he knows more than 1,000s of others who have actually devoted their lives to researching subject, some lunatic who suffers from delusions of grandeur, I will stick with the immense number of epidemiological studies. And since you have clearly demonstrated you don’t know the basics of causal inference nor how epidemiogical research works, that you assume that someone trained in how to do and evaluate research should have THE answers, that you make incredible assertions that NOTHING is known and that just about every affliction under the sun is attributable to vaccines, dragging up a lecture that refers to some research is worth next to nothing.
And you apparently missed in Richet’s lecture: “The general conclusion is as expected but nevertheless necessary to be shown: (1) through the digestive mucous membranes never passes more than tiny amounts of colloids, but sometimes it does pass them; (2) these minute amounts are enough on occasion to cause the anaphylactic state either preparatory or unleashing; (3) the amounts of colloids that pass into the digestive juices are weak enough to give immunity rather than anaphylaxis, especially if it be remembered that most are cases of ingestion repeated and increased at various intervals: all which conditions favour antianaphylaxis immunity rather than true anaphylaxis. These findings in the field of alimentary anaphylaxis are perhaps not without importance to clinical medicine. It may be that many cases of dyspepsia are nothing more than light attacks of anaphylaxis. Doctors have long found that regular diet on strictly uniform lines was to be preferred to all other regimens. It is as if by the repeated ingestion of one some protein substance the organism had accustomed itself to it and had immunized itself against this usual antigen.”
So vegetable protein ingested NOT injected. Thus, one more piece of the puzzle that shows allergic reactions could be caused by other means. And he points out that, as with current approach to preventing peanut allergies, one can avoid anaphylaxis. Did you miss this???
In any case, Richet’s lecture now added to my ever increasing library.
And your incredibly STUPID statement that police should solve ALL crimes and science should have THE answers, you are just tiresome. Science isn’t an answer, it is a PROCESS and everything is tentative; but as more and more research is done, some things less tentative than others. Do you really think that ALL the vaccine researchers who also make sure their own children get vaccinated are that stupid? Yep, you do. Incredible.
” It is as if by the repeated ingestion of one some protein substance the organism had accustomed itself to it and had immunized itself against this usual antigen.”
So vegetable protein ingested NOT injected. Thus, one more piece of the puzzle that shows allergic reactions could be caused by other means. And he points out that, as with current approach to preventing peanut allergies, one can avoid anaphylaxis. Did you miss this???”
You are confused as usual. He is talking about ingested proteins producing tolerance, not sensitization.
You’d make great tier 1 phone tech support.
Making influenza behave like dengue …
Induction of IgE against influenza proteins following influenza vaccination has been demonstrated multiple times. In fact, induction of IgE against numerous target and non-target proteins present in multiple vaccines, has been demonstrated numerous times.[1] The Flublok vaccine has 3X the viral protein content as a regular vaccine.[2] As predicted, it resulted in allergic reactions in people previously sensitized to the influenza viral proteins.[3] It can also be expected to produce stronger sensitization.
Consider dengue infection. The initial mosquito bite that injects dengue virus into a person, causes the induction of IgE against dengue proteins.[4] Upon a subsequent bite that introduces the dengue virus again, the person develops hives due to a dengue specific-IgE mediated allergic reaction. As the infection (and thus allergic reaction) progresses and more histamine is released, vascular permeability increases. The result is hypotension and dengue shock syndrome.[5] Basically, a type 1 hypersensitivity reaction caused upon dengue virus exposure following IgE mediated sensitization to dengue viral proteins.
The route of exposure for natural influenza infection is the respiratory tract, not subcutaneous (SC) or intramuscular (IM) injection. Influenza vaccines artificially changed the route of initial viral protein exposure to SC or IM injection thus making it similar to the route of exposure for dengue. The result is an IgE response to influenza proteins, similar to the response for dengue. It should therefore not come as a surprise that we are modifying the course of influenza infection such that it is acquiring characteristics of a dengue infection (hives and shock).
Repeated influenza vaccines reduce vaccine effectiveness (VE). Long term persistent vaccine induced IgE antibodies can neutralize vaccine proteins upon subsequent vaccination, resulting in low VE reported by multiple teams.
Increased hospitalization rates have been observed in asthma patients that have received the influenza vaccine. Again, this is as predicted because asthma patients are likely to produce stronger IgE responses to the viral proteins upon vaccination.[6] On subsequent virus exposure, they can be expected to develop severe IgE mediated asthma.[7,8]
It will be interesting to hear alternative explanations that can account for all these observations, including the deaths of otherwise healthy younger patients, being attributed to “septic shock”.
An appropriately designed vaccine that does NOT induce IgE, administered to vulnerable patients alone, could be part of a larger influenza control strategy. The current strategy combining poorly designed vaccines and mass vaccination alone, is making the problem worse.
References
Arumugham V. Professional Misconduct by NAM Committee on Food Allergy [Internet]. 2016. Available from: https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034559
Corporation PS. Flublok Quadrivalent 2017-2018 [Internet]. 2018. Available from: https://www.fda.gov/downloads/BiologicsBloodVaccines/Vaccines/ApprovedProducts/UCM524684.pdf
Woo EJ. Allergic Reactions After Egg-Free Recombinant Influenza Vaccine: Reports to the US Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System. Clin Infect Dis. 2014;60:777–80.
Koraka P, Murgue B, Deparis X, Setiati TE, Suharti C, Van Gorp ECM, et al. Elevated levels of total and dengue virus-specific immunoglobulin E in patients with varying disease severity. J Med Virol. 2003;70(1):91–8.
Tuchinda M, Dhorranintra B, Tuchinda P. Histamine content in 24-hour urine in patients with dengue haemorrhagic fever. Southeast Asian J Trop Med Public Health. Thailand; 1977 Mar;8(1):80–3.
Joshi AY, Iyer VN, Hartz MF, Patel AM, Li JT. Effectiveness of trivalent inactivated influenza vaccine in influenza-related hospitalization in children: a case-control study. Allergy asthma Proc. United States; 2012;33(2):e23–7.
Arumugham V. Short sighted influenza control policy based on poorly designed vaccines will sicken more people [Internet]. Available from: https://www.zenodo.org/record/1038445
Arumugham V. Medical muddles that maim our children with allergies, asthma and autism [Internet]. Unpublished; 2017. Available from: https://www.zenodo.org/record/1034595
“police should solve ALL crimes ”
If a police department cannot solve the biggest crimes, it needs to be replaced.
Your science is an abject failure when it comes to answering some of the biggest questions in medicine.
JP,
I second the motion.
Alain
And I’ve thirded it. Vinu needs some time in time out for his recent flooding of the comments. (It looks like at least half of all comments since last night are his, and they’re very repetitive.) Vinu has now officially reached the level of annoying me, but, even more importantly, I sense that he has been annoying regular commenters whose input I value. Maybe I’ll let him back in a few days. Maybe not.
Many thanks 🙂
I was having a strong headache (partly related to Vinu but other stuff too).
Alain
@ Vinu Arumugham:
David: While he is quite tiresome, he has added to my ever expanding collection of articles and documents, including some interesting historical documents. Below is just “proof positive he really doesn’t understand the basics of epidemiology nor biostatistics, or, possibly, is so determined to further his rigid beliefs that he is willing to lie:
He writes: “Destefano et al. reported Type 1 diabetes odds ratio for MMR vaccine is 1.36, Hib is 1.14, Varicella is 1.16. Patterson et al. reported T1D odds ratio for tetanus vaccine is 1.57 and diptheria is 1.27.
https://iom.nationalacademies.org/Reports/2011/Adverse-Effects-of-Vaccines-Evidence-and-Causality.aspx
Assuming 90% vaccine uptake and calculating the number of cases for the US population of 320 million, we get 1 million cases of T1D. Estimated total for T1D cases from American Diabetes Association is 1.25 million. So your epidemiological studies themselves are showing that the vast majority of T1D cases were vaccine induced.”
I found both DeStefano and Patterson in the IOM report; but also reference list, so I went to the actual studies, though the same stats are in the IOM report.
DeStefano: “The OR (95% confidence interval) for the association with type 1 diabetes was 0.28 (0.07–1.06) for whole cell pertussis vaccine (predominantly in combination as diphtheria, tetanus toxoids and pertussis vaccine), 1.36 (0.70 –2.63) for measles-mumps-rubella, 1.14 (0.51–2.57) for Haemophilus influenzae type b, 0.81 (0.52–1.27) for hepatitis B vaccine, 1.16 (0.72–1.89) for varicella vaccine, and 0.92 (0.53–1.57) for acellular pertussis-containing vaccines. Compared with children who had not received hepatitis B vaccine, the OR of diabetes was 0.51 (0.23–1.15) for children vaccinated at birth and 0.86 (0.54–1.35) for those first vaccinated against hepatitis B at 2 months of age or later. [DeStefano F et al (2001). Childhood Vaccinations, Vaccination Timing, and Risk of Type 1 Diabetes Mellitus. Pediatrics; 108; e112.
Patterson:
Table 2. Odds ratios for nine common vaccinations before and after adjustment for confounding variables
Vaccination Odds ratio (95% CI) p
Tetanus 1.20 (0.66, 2.19) 0.55
Diptheria 1.09 (0.62, 1.93) 0.76
[Patterson et al (2001). Infections and vaccinations as risk factors for childhood Type I (insulin-dependent) diabetes mellitus: a multicentre case-control investigation; Diabetologia; 43: 47-53.]
So, anyone who has even one course in Statistics and actually understood what was taught would understand that Confidence Intervals that show less than one and greater than one are non-significant and that the less than one part of the interval could even imply a protective effect. Note that the Patterson article included several more vaccines, all with similar non-significant Confidence Intervals. So, his statement: “So your epidemiological studies themselves are showing that the vast majority of T1D cases were vaccine induced,” is just plain STUPID!
Why not both?
In any case, if I’m feeling generous I might let some of his comments through after a delay, but there’s no way I’m going to let him lay down more than half the total comment volume of RI over nearly a day again. (Over a 16 hour period or so, he posted more comments than every other commenter combined.) I’m pretty sure I banned him before on the previous version of RI, and forgot about it when I approved his first new comment recently, thinking it had been held up for moderation because of the number of links rather than because he was a “new” commenter on this version of the blog. He clearly took advantage of my transition to the new platform, and how the block list started anew.
Vinu is guest-blogging over at Lyon-Weiler’s joint. He doesn’t need to use RI for his pukefunnel,
Oh, that is hilarious.
@ Orac
“(Over a 16 hour period or so, he posted more comments than every other commenter combined.)”
Makes one wonder if he is gainfully employed and/or how much time he devotes to his kid(s). My excuse is I’m an old man, long retired, with too much time on my hands; but not the energy level I wish I had. I do have a dog from a rescue group that “demands” my attention, including waking me at 5 am to walk him. I guess I’m dog-pecked?
Dr. Joel writes,
I guess I’m dog-pecked?
MJD says,
I made a previous comment about a dog you were pictured with and I’d like to say it was much better looking than you! 🙂
Sorry I didn’t say that right away, Joel.
@Smut Clyde,
LW joint does not have us (RI minions) as commenter.
We usually dispose of chew toys like this: https://youtu.be/yYlNVVOrrtw
But Vinu was hard on the palate.
Alain
I note that Vinu’s post at LW’s place has over 30 references, and, as is tradition, 25% are by Vinu.
I once built a chain of 5 “papers” of Vinu’s self references (I stopped at 5 because real life was calling, not because I reached the end). That might be a mildly amusing game when/if we get an open comment post, to see who can build the longest chain.
Speaking of which, can anyone make heads or tails of this? The actual document referred to is here, as far as I can tell.
Speaking of which, can anyone make heads or tails of this?
The backstory is that Montanari and Gatti are grifters (you probably already guessed that part). Sylvie Coyaud over at Oca Sapiens reports on their activities
http://ocasapiens-dweb.blogautore.repubblica.it/tag/antonietta-gatti/
— such as their involvement in some conman’s promise to de-pollute the atmosphere in Rome by fitting busses with extractor-fan / air-filters on their roofs (these would filter the nanoparticles out of the air as the busses drove around).
In the present case, the seizure of their computers as evidence in a fraud investigation relates to their acquisition of access to an electron microscope. This was purportedly to let them continue their high-minded research in the public good. In practice they use it in paid consultancy / advocacy for their “Nanodiagnostics” laboratory.
JLW is trying to link the fraud investigation of Gatti and Montanari to their theory that the neighbourhood of the Quirra munitions range in Sardinia is polluted with nanoparticles, causing cancers in members of the armed forces. Gatti testified, I understand, to a parliamentary inquiry into allegedly-elevated cancer rates. Therefore they are Threats to the Fascist State and the Victims of Persecution.
In practice, the fraud investigation is about the microscope, which they use but do not own or pay to maintain.
http://www.unionesarda.it/articolo/cronaca/2018/02/22/sequestrati_pc_della_dottoressa_gatti_ieri_ha_testimoniato_nel_pr-68-700453.html
“The polygon of Quirra.” I do so love machine translation. Thank you for explaining.
In further developments, not-a-doctor Montanari is belatedly insisting that the seizure of their electronic records is not about their microscopy gig, nor about microscopy finances, and his original press statement was premature and is no longer operative. Also, “We have full confidence in the work of the judiciary”.
https://www.nextquotidiano.it/la-guardia-finanza-nel-laboratorio-antonietta-gatti-stefano-montanari/
Other sources are hinting at a complaint from a disgruntled customer of their “Finding Nanoparticles in Tumour Samples” service.
The SaneVax / Age of Autism conspiracy-interpretation of the whole affair is slightly different from JLW’s. Yes, the Fascist State is persecuting Montanari & Gatti, but not because of their military-cancers testimony, but rather to destroy the testimony that they planned to present to a future court case [citation missing]..
http://www.ageofautism.com/2018/02/computers-and-record-seized-of-dr-gatti-and-dr-montenari.html
The SaneVax comments in the SaneVax Faceborg thread are especially edifying. “Wouldn’t Gatti & Montanari have back-up copies of any evidence they planned to present?” “Yes, but look how effectively Big Pharma destroyed the evidence that previous whistleblowers possessed… the absence of evidence just demonstrates the scale of the conspiracy.
https://www.facebook.com/sanevax.inc/posts/2024722697556363
Speaking of which, can anyone make heads or tails of this? The actual document referred to is here, as far as I can tell.
The only links JLW provides are to a document establishing a parliamentary inquiry into cancer deaths among Italian military personnel. He offers a purported translation of the report of that inquiry, with lotsa antivax recommendations, and pages going up to p155 – but no actual source, other than “results provided by L. Larue”.
You have traced a document but its pages only go up to 68.
Yah, I became increasingly uncertain as time went along, but I’m kinda stressed out.
I asked at Sylvie Coyaud’s joint, and Sylvie obliged:
http://www.gianpieroscanu.it/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/Relazione-Finale-approvata-7feb18.pdf
Vinu is being added to my list of engineers/physicists/computer scientists who think they know more than they actually do. They have annoyed me so much with their off kilter “engineersplaining” it causes me to gag. (there is a particularly annoying one infesting Science Based Medicine lately)
@ Chris:
I’ve always wondered why is it engineers et al?
Is it something about the usually non-human/ non-biological nature of what they study that pushes them towards certainty?
Of course, I won’t go full tilt Simon Baron Cohen about STEM but….
It is because they have studied things that several people simply do not understand. Or so they think, there is lots of “I am smarter than you” attitude. That has been a running commentary on one particular annoying engineer/anthropologist/computer scientist at Science Based Medicine.
There is even an xkcd comic on the subject:
https://xkcd.com/793/
@ Michael J. Dochniak:
You write: “I noticed in your website (ECBT) that the caption under the photo says, “Joel and dog Zip flashing a ‘V’ for Vaccinate” Please explain how the dog is flashing the “V” sign. From my perspective, it appears you have taken liberties with the dog. In the real world, that dog doesn’t have a clue what your talking about. So, either change the caption or continue looking like a fool.”
“Dr. Joel writes, I guess I’m dog-pecked?
MJD says,
I made a previous comment about a dog you were pictured with and I’d like to say it was much better looking than you! Sorry I didn’t say that right away, Joel.”
I didn’t write the caption and really could care less. I guess it takes a real idiotic pedant like you to notice something so trivial. And, yes, my dog is much much better looking than me. When I got him from a rescue group who took him from a shelter that was planning to euthanize him, he had loose bowels from both giardia and coccidia, and bald bleeding spots on his paws and matted fur. I took him to a vet who suggested I not adopt him due to his “allergies” as he would cost a lot for vet care. Well, he was a really sweet dog and I adopted him and changed vets. Fortunately, I did my own research and put him on hypoallergenic diet and Omega 3 fish capsules and within three weeks his fur was beautiful and he had stopped scratching and biting. It took a couple of rounds of antibiotics to clear up his intestinal parasites. He has been my best friend now for over eight years. My previous dog, best friend, died just before his 15th birthday and I was devastated. Zip has more than filled the void. However, I’m not sure you are right about his not having a “clue what [I’m] talking about. He is an Australian Shepherd, in the top ten of intelligent dogs, and I “discuss everything with him and he is a good listener.” LOL So, if you were trying to insult me, you failed miserably.
You write: “From the NIH website titled, Allergen Immunotherapy:
“Scientists are attempting to use immunotherapy to prevent and treat food allergy. However, the balance between the benefits and risks of immunotherapy for food allergy has not yet been well-studied, and it currently is not recommended except as an experimental approach.”
Therefore, this also implies that scientists are UNCERTAIN about the effects of food-stuff proteins in vaccines.”
Nothing on the page you linked to in any way assumes it was vaccines that caused the allergies. In fact, vaccines are NOT mentioned at all. Does mention success with bee stings. So, if vaccines are not mentioned, how does this “imply that scientists are UNCERTAIN about the effects of food-stuff proteins in vaccines?” You are assuming facts NOT IN EVIDENCE. Dorit Reiss is a Professor of Law, so I hope she appreciates the previous sentence. My dog is more logical than you, and, yes, better looking than me.
Dr Joel writes,
So, if you were trying to insult me, you failed miserably.
MJD says,
Jeez, just complimenting your dog…
You and Vinu were passionate and articulate, it was a great read!
Thanks, Dr. Joel.
@ Michael J. Dochniak
You write: “Jeez, just complimenting your dog…” ; but you also wrote: “So, either change the caption or continue looking like a fool.”
Really, telling me I’m “looking like a fool” is “just complimenting [my] dog’?
Don’t you even understand what you write? Oops, of course not, must be effects of latex rubber on your brain???
As for Vinu’s being “passionate and articulate”, yep, like an old fashion revivalist fundamentalist preacher whose certainty based on direct communication from G-d. He doesn’t even understand basic statistics or does and believes his agenda allows for presenting false information. And, yes, I did miss some historical documents; but the fact that they reinforced what I said that giving various proteins prior to any type of injection eliminated future anaphylaxis, current approach to peanut allergies, even if vaccinated. As for all proteins, studies were on Guinea pigs, which I pointed out that different animals react differently. Richet’s Nobel speech created ideas for possible hypothesis testing not for automatically drawing generalized conclusions. And despite what Vinu chooses to believe, numerous epidemiological studies have found no association between vaccines and allergies or, as the Institute of Medicine’s report found, some rare instances; but research not the highest level; but good enough. So, unfortunate; but until we can develop inexpensive genetics tests and/or better vaccines, the benefit/cost ratio is exponentially in favor of vaccinating ALL kids. My article which will be posted on this blog deals with the economics of vaccine production. Basically, mandated childhood vaccines are highly highly regulated and monitored, so profit margins minimal. In fact, most pharmaceutical companies have stopped manufacturing them. So, given the overall benefits/cost ratio, expecting pharmaceutical companies to invest billions of dollars to reduce risk of few mild allergies and rare serious ones isn’t realistic. As the say goes, “don’t sacrifice the good for the perfect.” And despite this, research is being conducted to find better vaccines, vaccines that confer better and longer duration protection as well as, for instance, manufactured without eggs.
History is replete with instances of findings that, for whatever reason, didn’t enter the mainstream of thought (there are several books and articles that discuss possible reasons). The ancient Greek Eratosthenes not only knew the world was round but estimated its circumference with an error of only 15%. Actually, despite some historians, knowledge that world was round was accepted even by Columbus. There was a statue of Atlas holding up a Globe in Rome. The ancient Greek Democritus theorized the atom, then John Dalton in early 1800s. Another ancient Greek Aeolipile built a steam engine that worked. And on and on it goes. So Vinu’s drawing attention to even a Nobel prize speech from over a century ago gives an interesting historical perspective but no more proves that myself and others are clueless than it would be to attack major historical figures who contributed to science yet missed some things. Watch the new series Cosmos, available for streaming on Fox TV and Netflix and probably elsewhere.
VINU ARUMUGHAM IN HIS OWN WORDS:
For the reader, please NOTICE his ABSOLUTIST STATEMENTS. A world of black and white. For him imperfect knowledge is NO knowledge. Either one has THE ONE PERFECT ANSWER or all ones efforts are wasted. But, wait, Arumugham has THE ANSWERS. All the 1,000s of dedicated researchers world over don’t; but HE DOES. He often refers to his own papers posted on a website that I previously NEVER heard of. In all fairness, this alone doesn’t say anything; but it does show that his writings have not been vetted by any audience. Delusions of Grandeur anyone?
Note Vinu’s statement in quotes, my response in brackets.
Vinu: “However, the failure to develop vaccines against global pandemics such as infection with human immunodeficiency virus (HIV) despite decades of effort has underscored the need to understand the immunological mechanisms by which vaccines confer protective immunity.”
[We know how the immune system works and why it doesn’t mount a defense against an RNA retrovirus that mutates at exponential rates. Yes, there are conserved parts of the HIV virion; but not a normal target of our normal immune responses and, yet, we are working on ways of enhancing the immune response to these conserved areas. For Vinu it should be easy. His simplistic view of the world is both naive and STUPID.]
He writes: “If the traditional medical system could prevent or cure autism, why would MMS even be a topic? The failed traditional medical system creates autism and MMS usage shows how desperate parents are to help their injured child.”
[Yep, we can cure many forms of cancer or, at least, prolong life; but not always, so people, in desperation, turn to everything from Reiki to whatever. This doesn’t confer any scientific validity to what people turn to in desperation. Kids have literally died when parents have turned to “exorcists” to treat their children. I guess, for Vinu, that means “exorcism” is a potentially viable treatment and science/medicine should recognize it?]
He writes: “The n=2 study proves that vaccines are badly broken. Shit, man, n = 1 proves that you are badly broken.”
[Yikes, if that isn’t proof he doesn’t understand science, nothing does. The logical fallacy of Post Hoc Ergo Prompter Hoc (after something therefore the something caused). Imagine a little girl gets a vaccine and a few weeks later begins to regress. Well, guess what, they have found a gene which directly causes Rett Syndrome. So, whether kid gets vaccine or not, if gene present will develop Rett Syndrome. During the time between the vaccine and diagnosis lots of other things could have happened, e.g. exposure to chemicals/pesticides, subclinical infections, etc. In fact, the causes could have predated the vaccine. Diethylstilbestrol (DES) is a synthetic form of the female hormone estrogen. … In 1971, researchers linked prenatal (before birth) DES exposure to a type of cancer of the cervix and vagina called clear cell adenocarcinoma in a small group of women. Note that the cancer developed in young women late teens early 20s, thus, around 20 years after exposure. Years ago, in Sweden, there was an outbreak of salmonella. Doctors had a checklist of possible sources that they asked their patients. When patient answered they had recently eaten chicken, doctor stopped asking questions since chicken was known to be carrier of salmonella. Eventually, as a few patients answered they hadn’t eaten chicken, further investigation found the cause was potato salad. Of course, in this case, salmonella is often associated with chicken. The point is that what one believes, thus automatically attributing something to it, even when not the causative factor, can be wrong. Paul Offit writes in his book “Autism’s False Prophets” of a case where a medical researcher took his infant to get vaccinated. The clinic was really busy, so he decided to return another time. That night, tragically, the child died from Sudden Infant Death Syndrome. The researcher admitted had shots been given despite his training it would have been very difficult to NOT blame the vaccines. Post Hoc Ergo Prompter Hoc.]
And Vinu’s incredible arrogance and god-like certainty:
[I wrote: Really! Where did you find “slow rolling anaphylactic shock, certainly NOT in any medical text book]
Vinu responded: “This is a problem created by poorly designed vaccines. Vaccines that cause IgE mediated sensitization to viral/bacterial proteins. This is a newly discovered man-made disease. The textbook has not been written yet … Your horribly designed vaccines create diseases at a rate the medical textbooks cannot keep up …]
[Yikes. He has discovered something that not a single textbook includes. Maybe I should request his picture, mount in on my living room mantle and light votive candles?]
I wrote: Yes, some ingredients in vaccines are allergens; but that doesn’t mean the vaccines caused the allergy which existed earlier.”
Vinu responded: “The allergy DID NOT exist earlier. The first ever exposure to most allergen food proteins that children have is through food protein containing vaccines. They are sensitized by the vaccine and that is why they react the first time they are exposed to those foods in their diet.”
[HepB, the only vaccine given at birth does NOT contain eggs or dairy; but allergies existed prior to this vaccine being given at birth; however, for instance, formula given early on usually is based on milk or, sometimes, soy. Vinu’s statement lacks credible facts, though I’m sure he can find someone somewhere who has made such a claim.]
I wrote: “Police often bring people in for interrogation following a crime. Should we assume each and every one guilty?”
Vinu’s response: “Police should solve the crime. With vaccines we only hear “vaccines not guilty”, “vaccines not guilty”. Decades and billions later no one is even interested in solving the crimes of food allergy, autism, asthma or type 1 diabetes. Vaccines can never be declared not guilty until other root cause (or causes if you like) are found.”
“If with n=1 and a duration of three weeks, one could have “unmeasured variables”, what happens with your epidemiological studies that have thousands of subjects followed for years? How many unmeasured variables do you have then? So your epidemiological studies generate piles and piles of “large scale” garbage. Explains why vaccine safety is an oxymoron. Explains why after billions and decades spent, you have answers to NOTHING. What is the root cause of food allergy, asthma, autism, type 1 diabetes? Official answer: Don’t know. Since when has it become fashionable to refer to these people who don’t know as “experts”?”
“The proof of the pudding is in the eating. If you are the expert, give me the answers. Otherwise, accept that you are no expert. I have root cause for ALL of them based on proven biological processes. You have NONE.”
[As I wrote above, case studies suffer from Post Hoc Ergo Prompter Hoc Fallacy as well as drawing conclusions based on pre-existing beliefs. Epidemiological studies include large number of individuals. It would be, for instance, highly unlikely that all would have been exposed to the same pesticides, have the same genetic mutations, have experience other clinical or subclinical infections. And by doing such studies with various designs that reduce the possible influence of various other variables, by conducting them on different populations, in different countries, we do narrow the range of possible “causes.” And science doesn’t PROVE anything, though the term is sometimes used. Proof is term used in Classical Logic which I was required to take as undergraduate course. Science is always tentative. Science advances one study at a time by confirming or rejecting tested hypotheses. However, as the number of studies that go in one direction increases the tentativeness, probability decreases. As I mentioned in previous comment, even the Law of Gravity can’t state absolutely that some weird confluence of known or unknown cosmic forces cancels gravity somewhere on planet Earth.
And no we don’t know the “root cause” of various conditions because they have multiple causes which apply to different people differently based on their genetic predisposition; but we do know many of the contributing causes. As for not being an expert if I can’t give the root cause “for ALL of them, [then I] have NONE. I think this says ALL one needs to know about Vinu, he lives in a world of fantasy where he wants the certainty that people seek through religion. Well, science isn’t a religion, it is a method, a process, which has and continues to advance. We know much more today than even 10 years ago.
As I wrote in a previous comment, if one uses Vinu’s logic, besides closing our police departments, until each and every crime is solved, we are all potentially guilty. Can each and every one of you prove beyond any doubt that you weren’t the perpetrator of crimes committed within, say, 50 miles of your work or residence? Can you account for your whereabouts at all times? Well, as I wrote, science doesn’t work as Vinu’s closed mind does; but if numerous studies find NO association with a particular cause, then highly unlikely or if, as I wrote above, a rare association is found, we still have to look at the risk vs benefit. And again, his wanting the Root Cause, he should join a church.
A couple of other Vinu absudities:
“Maybe you should call it AIECBT.
Allergy in every child by two.
Asthma in every child by two.
Autism in every child by two.
Autoimmunity in every child by two.
Pushing dirty vaccines, you can claim great progress with this mission statement.”
“Medical muddles that maim our children with allergies, asthma and autism”
And, as I explained in a previous comment, he doesn’t understand basic statistics, e.g. confidence intervals.
I rest my case.
That insult directed at Vinu was from me, Dr. Harrison.
And…
Then everyone who received a flu shot and contracted the flu would suffer anaphylactic shock, per Richet. He’s been at this for a long time, originally as “APV.”
@ Narad:
You wrote: “Then everyone who received a flu shot and contracted the flu would suffer anaphylactic shock, per Richet.”
Probably not everyone; but a lot. In any case, good call. I missed that one. Blame it an old age?
It took a while but looks like both of you finally got it. This is what I called “slow rolling anaphylaxis” and it is still killing people right now.
Dr. Joel writes,
Don’t you even understand what you write? Oops, of course not, must be effects of latex rubber on your brain???
MJD says,
Your punching below the belt Joel because you know Orac won’t allow me to defend myself.
@ Orac,
It’s time that Joel faces the consequences for the “LR on your brain” insult.
Auto-moderation!?
No, that wouldn’t be right. These are dog eat dog days when it comes to vaccine safety.
Right, Joel should face consequences for the ” LR on your brain” comment:
applause, thanks, appreciation, commendation, agreement, perhaps even a stiff drink on the house.
Good job, Dr Joel!
One might note that Doucheniak has also pulled the Vinu routine in the past.
Vinu Arumugham Somehow Found One of My E-mail Addresses. Really pisses me off that he would bother me at home. On the other hand it shows his level of desperation, deep down he isn’t as confident as he pretends to be, that he needs to convince me to ignore my 50 years of education, training, and experience just because he thinks he is right. He believes that Orac is censoring him, not understanding that he really doesn’t say anything new and just takes up space with his machine-gun like comments, one after another, variations on a theme. In any case, I will respond to his e-mails in this comment; but I have already arranged that any future e-mails from him will go into my Spam folder and as soon as I figure out how to totally block, will do so. Or, since it is only one of my e-mail addresses, if necessary I will close it. I’ve plenty more.
In his e-mail, he wrote:
You wrote:
“Confidence Intervals that show less than one and greater than one are non-significant”
His reply:
“Nope. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2938757/ “In practice, the 95% CI is often used as a proxy for the presence of statistical significance if it does not overlap the null value (e.g. OR=1). Nevertheless, it would be inappropriate to interpret an OR with 95% CI that spans the null value as indicating evidence for lack of association between the exposure and outcome.” So I have provided epidemiological evidence showing ~80% of T1D cases in the US are vaccine-induced. And that’s not all. I provided mechanistic evidence describing exactly how animal protein containing vaccines caused these cases of type 1 diabetes. I have noted that you have not challenged the mechanism of causation I described.”
The article he links to is: Magdalena Szumilas, MSc (2010 Aug). Explaining Odds Ratios. Journal – Canadian Academy of Child and Adolescent Psychiatry; 19(3).
So, he found an article that says what he chooses to believe; but it’s WRONG. Significance testing dates back to one of the founders of modern statistics, R.A. Fischer. Basically, statistical significance is used in decisions, e.g., which seed to plant. When one has to make a decision immediately one uses some form of significance testing. However, research trying to discover/explain aspects of nature uses confidence intervals because one understands that the ONE EFFECT SIZE FOUND, e.g. mean, median, odds ratio, relative risk is not the true value. For instance, if one tosses an unbiased coin 10 times, sometimes it will come up 4 heads, 6 tails, etc. More often it will, in the long run, come up 5 and 5; but any individual toss or even a series of tosses won’t necessarily come up 5 and 5, so we have probability distributions based on the type of data we are looking at. In the case of a coin toss, we use the binomial distribution. From this distribution we can get the probability for 5 and 5, 4 and 6, etc. So, what if we get an average of 4 and 6 after five tosses of a coin. Is it balanced or not? Statistical significance will simply take the average and apply the probability. In many situations the average isn’t even a “real” value; but a number arrived at from the values obtained. Epidemiology, except when called on to make a program decision, uses confidence intervals. While statistical significance of, say, 0.05 says that the probability of the result found has only one in 20 chance of having been result of unmeasured variables that could have “caused” the outcome, the confidence interval says that the “true” outcome lies within a range, because it is based on the variation found within the studied population. So, though one would’t say it as any type of conclusion in an article, basically, the lower end of a confidence interval that falls below one for an Odds Ratio could mean that the variable being looked at had a protective effect because it falls in the probability range of the “true” value.
And the quote from the article: “Nevertheless, it would be inappropriate to interpret an OR with 95% CI that spans the null value as indicating evidence for lack of association between the exposure and outcome,” is both sort of right; but mainly WRONG. If I conduct a study comparing two groups on one variable and I find NO difference, it doesn’t mean there was NO difference, just I didn’t find it. Perhaps, there were confounding variables. Perhaps measurement error. However, as I’ve written before and Vinu ignores, as one does more and more studies using design variations, different study populations, different but related measurements, in different countries, and they all go in the same direction, then one can be confident in the results, the probability that the same unmeasured variable(s) were present in all the studies is miniscule. Confident; but not with Vinu’s god-like certainty. As I’ve written, even the Law of Gravity can’t say for certain it always applies, just with an incredibly high probability. Vinu wants certainty. I suggest he attend church as science does not give certainty, only probabilities which change as more and more research is done.
By the way, besides my PhD, I’ve a MS in biostatistics and proof-read with minor edits three statistics books. My name is in the Acknowledgements.
The article Vinu found is not a research article, so likely wasn’t sent to a number of peer-reviewers and probably given the journal not to professors of epidemiology or biostatistics. It states at the top: ”Information Management for the Busy Practioner” and the author gives her job as: Research Associate, Sun Life Financial Chair in Adolescent Mental Health.” I have found medical journals with articles claiming HIV doesn’t cause AIDS and probably can still find in some journal an article on cold fusion. I found a webpage that lists her publications, most descriptions of programs but even if she applied statistics correctly in any one of them or several, doesn’t mean she totally understands statistics and causal inference. The article does show how to compute an odds ratio and its confidence interval. List of her articles at: https://www.researchgate.net/scientific-contributions/15944128_Magdalena_Szumilas
Vinu also writes in e-mail: “And that’s not all. I provided mechanistic evidence describing exactly how animal protein containing vaccines caused these cases of type 1 diabetes. I have noted that you have not challenged the mechanism of causation I described.”
It would take too long to develop; but basically coming up with a mechanism, even from animal studies, isn’t proof of anything and the one article he found with IgE following flu vaccination actually found the IgE helped immune system to protect against flu and didn’t mention the vaccine “causing” flu, though included people with food allergies, nothing mentioned about any reaction after vaccination. As Rothman in his book “Modern Epidemiology” discusses, biological plausibility can be used to explain many different possible causes. It isn’t proof. And Vinu continues to ignore the overwhelming evidence from numerous epidemiological studies that vaccines don’t cause allergies, except in rare cases. And given the overall benefit to risk ratio, the risks from not vaccinating far exceed those from vaccinating. He doesn’t understand statistics and doesn’t understand epidemiology and certainly doesn’t understand causal inference. He is tiresome.
Yep, he found one article on odds ratio and doesn’t understand that giving a possible mechanism doesn’t prove that the mechanism actually was at work. I love it how he tells me I am wrong after finding one article when if I wanted to waste my time I could find quotes literally from dozens of books and articles and, as mentioned, I actually have an MS in biostatistics and have proof-read with minor edits three statistic books. Of course, they would ALL be wrong because Vinu, in his god-like abilities, knows that the one article he found is right.
From what I read Vinu is completely misunderstanding the article. You’re saying that a CI crossing the null value is non-significant. The article agrees and even does a worked example using this exact principle. IMHO the quoted article is claiming that lack of significance is, as you mention not necessarily the same as “no effect”. However as you point out over multiple studies our confidence in no effect (at a particular sensitivity) grows. Also Bayesian’s would probably (and IMHO correctly) interpret the results as evidence of no effect.
hello Joel Harrison
Can you provide citations for this statement: “the overwhelming evidence from numerous epidemiological studies that vaccines don’t cause allergies, except in rare cases”
I would like to see these papers. My reading of the literature leads me to conclude that vaccines almost certainly cause allergies. Allergies are generated to food-derived antigens in the vaccines, and also to ingested substances that contact the immune system stimulated by aluminum adjuvant. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19210370
Aluminum adjuvant is used to create animal models of allergic disease. This has been the standard practice for generating allergy disease models for decades.
I am interested to hear what you think of this paper and specifically if you think that the data supports the stated conclusions: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1448377/
The analysis and conclusions appear to be, shall we say, peculiar in view of the data.
MMS is almost certainly a dangerous treatment, and very unlikely to provide long term benefit. I think its a bad idea.
However, it is not true to say effectiveness is not biological plausible, at least temporarily. The microbiome helps sustain the neuroinflammation that causes autistic neurological/behavioral symptoms. MMS by ingestion or enema will affect the microbiome by killing bacteria, likely reducing bacterial loads and changing the microbiome composition. Such microbiome changes can reduce neuroinflammation. There are lots of studies on this now, proving that microbes in the gut can modulate neuroinflammation. There is also good evidence that oral antibiotics temporarily reduce autistic symptoms. The symptoms return after the antibiotic is stopped.
So, while MMS treatment for autism is almost certainly a bad idea, the parents using it may be observing a temporary improvement. The science suggests this could happen.
Citation needed, both that the “microbiome helps sustain neuroinflammation” and that said neuroinflammation “autistic neurological/behavioral symptoms”.
Microbiome connection: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3897394/
There are literally hundreds of studies proving that autism and other psychiatric disorders are mediated by inflammation.
Here is one interventional study in humans: https://www.nature.com/articles/tp2015142
A recent review: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27540164/
MMS by ingestion or enema will affect the microbiome by killing bacteria
How much orally-ingested bleach gets past the stomach and the small intestine, in your opinion?
Almost, Dan? Go crawl back into your hole before I dash off some notes to publishers regarding your casually massive copyright violations.
You really aren’t good at assembling a cogently structured string of words, are you?
[…] are routinely subjected to dangerous quackery like chelation therapy, chemical castration, and even bleach enemas. All of these quack interventions come from the antivaccine movement, who view vaccines as the […]
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