“Censorship.” You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

That AoA post is way beyond delusional.

Yet again, people on AoA complaining about “censorship” = priceless.

“…full mental jacket…”

Clever combining of pop culture references, or typo?

Also, any responsible scientists would reply to Chapman’s contention that they are superior with the statement “only at responding to the conditions of a specific local environment through the production of a greater number of reproductively viable offspring”.

Evolution jokes – awesome.

“I wonder if there is a word for such a delusion.”

Schizohitlerism?

If they really want balance on vaccines, they should have two experts that disagree over which vaccines to give, not whether to give them. There’s a viable argument over the economics of the H1N1 response versus risk (CBC had a broadcast on this on Monday). THAT is something the public could sink their teeth into – was H1N1 vaccination a waste of scarce tax money in a time of economic crisis? Discuss.

My opinion is – no. Apparently it’s also the dominant strain this flu season.

“We should take lying thieves with no interest in operating in the public’s interest at their word but the media should ignore parents and legitimate scientists who question the validity of vaccine science research performed by alleged criminals? I’m really confused!”

You mean like Andrew Wakefield? I’m confused too!

Great take-down. I’m very sad to see Katie Wright spouting such nonsense. Especially at that home of censorship, AoA, where censorship provides a “safe environment” for the perpetuation of delusion.

BTW, there’s a bit of a typo in the headline.

Instead of thinking about how much the stupid burns, think about Nic Cage in the remake of ‘The Wicker Man’ when he gets the bee treatment.

“Oh no, not the stupid! Oh God, the stupid!”

Well, “censoring” is just one of these irregular verbs, isn’t it:
I keep peace on my blog
you shut out dissenters
he is censoring.

@Rene Najera

Wow. You actually got a response from her telling you why (sorta) you were being banned? I didn’t even get that. Just an unceremonious blocking of all posts.

Luckily, there’s a solution for that! (Though I must admit, I’ve been a bit light on posting, recently, since I can no longer access AoA during the day and my evenings are a bit busy. Shoot me an e-mail, though, if you want a thread created about an AoA post.)

@Todd W.:
Nah, I just package up all my comments and e-mail them en masse to Kim’s personal e-mail. Then head over to her blog and post them there again. Then head over to Huffington Post and post them there once more. Basically, it’s an electronic carpet bomb of comments, usually on Saturdays, building up all the week’s comments. I’m pretty sure she’ll write about me on her blog. I hope she points over to my examiner page… I needs me some money.

“Telling both sides” often means that the SB side starts to talk and gets drowned out by the whimsy-based side’s protestations.Fortunately,a few shows feature interviews with a single guest:Fareed Zakaria and Rachel Maddow(last night: Timothy Geithner).(About “The Wicker Man”:only the original please,which I once ran into on late night TV and have since been recommending;I saw about 10 minutes- towards the end-of the re-make, which was *way* too much)

@Rene Najera

Ah. Nice tactic. I would like to have more posts on Silenced, though, as an illustration of how many comments never see the light of a computer screen over at AoA. More people than just myself, y’know.

Ooh cool.
So HHS Secretary Sebelius says “please don’t treat whackos with the same credibility as the reality-based people who’ve actually spent the time and effort learning a thing or two about the subject”, and the nuts at the end of the bar wank on about being repressed.
Oh, and Mr Doofus from DI : it’s Poul Thorsen, not Paul, but thanks for playing.

Ironic that IDiots are so happy to censor out other religious ideas, not wanting a bit of Plato’s Forms taught as science, nor Greek myths of metamorphosis.

See, that really is censorship, because they’re precisely on the same level as Ovid’s Metamorphoses, and have only the science that they have gotten (and then usually corrupted) from scientists.

But hey, pushing science out of the way to teach apologetics is all about academic freedom (well it sort of is, of the most corrupt kind), while keeping other religious apologetics out is simply about God’s truth, so it’s all all right.

Glen Davidson
http://tinyurl.com/mxaa3p

@20:

Reread Martin’s post. He did not say what you thought he said. He was merely commenting on how common it is for perspective to control what verb is used to describe said activity, NOT claiming that Orac “shuts out dissenters”.

Ironic that IDiots are so happy to censor out other religious ideas, not wanting a bit of Plato’s Forms taught as science, nor Greek myths of metamorphosis.

Which is especially ironic considering the huge influence the ancient Greeks had on culture at the time the New Testament was written. (There is a reason it was written down in Greek rather than Hebrew or Latin, after all, though note that some portions may have originated in Aramaic.) They really should read the classics if they want to understand the social milieu of the Bible and therefore the points it is trying to make. It wasn’t written in a vacuum.

“with parents of Autism being like the French Resistance during WWII”
My grandpa was POW, my grandma was carrying luggages of food accross Lyon. Their role was really minor, the risks they have taken, not so. They did not talk much about it, but it was clearly not happy times.

AoA have no idea that they are talking about.

To start with, French resistants (well, the real ones, most of those were killed) didn’t spent all their evenings blogging about how much the germans were repressing them.

Anti safe-vaxxers,

I was the first to report on the Sebelius quote, so don’t go blaming Ms. Wright.
http://www.ageofautism.com/2010/03/did-kathleen-sebelius-pressure-media-to-deny-vaccine-safety-voices.html#more

Kathleen Sebelius is telling the media to report her views in place of consumer groups who’ve identified the glaring flaws in all the shoddy tobacco science vindicating the government’s most heavily promoted drug, while ignoring all scientific evidence linking vaccines to autism. In other words, she’s manipulating the media.

Vaccines cause autism, the government has quietly conceded to that already in court cases like Hannah Poling and Bailey Banks. The only debate here is in how many children they cause autism in.

The “scientific community” that says otherwise is just derived from the IOM Report ruling, the panelists of which pretty much already announced their conclusion before receiving any evidence, and nominally based that the Danish data. With that discredited, all that leaves is one study from Britain and another by Verstraeten. Before publication, Verstraeten admitted the British study might not even be worth doing, while Verstraeten described his own study as “neutral,” which was later repudiated by the CDC itself. So much for the “Scientific Community.”

All you have left is hope that the mainstream media will not get wind of this, but alas, that’s already beginning to happen:
http://www.11alive.com/video/default.aspx?menuid=149#/News/A+New+Twist+In+The+Controversy+Over+Autism/49906865001/50317397001/71272069001

Cheers.

http://www.chem.cmu.edu/wakefield/pro.html

http://www.autism.com/triggers/vaccine/thimerosalreferences.htm

Jake,

Your overlords have already disowned the thimerosal/autism link. Now it’s “too many, too soon”. Get with the program young man.

Because the scientific community is just like the Nazi occupation and AoA’s brave maverick resistance is just like the French Resistance.

Isn’t it obvious? All of those FEMA labor camp commandants are out looking for firing squads right now.

I’ve never heard of Thorsen and a quick search on the homepages of the major newspapers reveals nothing. I no longer have access to the Lexis-Nexis database of all papers, but I doubt that would make any difference.

“I never saw the remake of The Wicker Man with Nicholas Cage, and, from what I’ve heard, that is a good thing.”

Oooo no, you’ve missed an absolute treat! At one point Cage arbitrarily grabs a doll and screams “howditgetburned.HowditgetburnedHOWDITGETBURNEDHOWDITGETBURNEDHOWDITGETBURNEDHOWDITGETBURNEDHOWDITGETBURNED???” and his vapid love interest just shrugs and says “…I don’t know”.

The salient features of the plot have been made into a techno music video:

I’ve never heard of Thorsen and a quick search on the homepages of the major newspapers reveals nothing.

Blogs don’t mention Thorsen prior to 2010, except as part of a list of authors in reference sections. A Google News archive search also doesn’t reveal much of anything about Thorsen prior to 2010.

You’ll probably get the standard answer, Rene: “censorship is ok when we do it.”

I hereby certify post #33 to be 100% content-free.

Inspector 37
United States Bureau of Content

Until a few weeks ago, neither had the anti-vaccination camp. They wouldn’t have recognized him if he knocked on their door at 2pm and asked to speak to them about Jesus.

You gotta love the comparison of the situations.

For the Wakefield paper, pretty much every one of the minor co-authors abandoned ship long before the hammer came down on St Andy. As soon as the shit he pulled came into the open, and the extent to which people were abusing the outcome of the work was clear, they couldn’t disassociate themselves from it fast enough, leaving only St Andy to carry the flag. When he fizzled in the mire, there was nothing left but ashes.

With Thorsen, we have the anti-vax side so desperate for anything that they are propping up not only the significance of his contributions to the project (calling him a major player), but also the magnitude of his transgressions (he’s missing? News to him). Jeez, if the actions of minor authors were of so much significance, then the Wakefield study was hammered dead years and years ago. By their take, the Wakefield study was an example of the crew jumping ship, leaving only the rats to steer the boat.

You hear that, those of you with autistic children who accept the science and don’t buy into the pseudoscience claiming that vaccines cause autism? You aren’t part of the “autism community.”

They co-opted the phrase “autism community” a long time ago, and the approach most people take is that nothing can be done about it. The term “autism communities” is used to distinguish anti-vaxers (the “autism community”) — a minority in all likelihood — from the rest of the people involved in autism one way or another.

True censorship requires police power for its enforcement. Katie Wright and her AoA comrades can write and publish whatever they want with near-impunity because they are free from censorship and because libel lawsuits are expensive to prosecute and hard to win. However, freedom from censorship doesn’t mean that any individual is legally empowered to compel others to write what they want them to write, and publish what they want them to publish — such as newspaper articles that give equal time to hogwash, or hostile, irrational blog comments.

@Ian

Thanks, “asshole”, I just shot coffee out of my nose. :-p

@Jake

while ignoring all scientific evidence linking vaccines to autism

How can you ignore somethng that doesn’t exist?

Excerpt from “A Modest Proposal, You Shitbags”:

It is a melancholy object to those bad-ass mothers who walk through this great town or travel in the country, when they see the streets, the roads, and even the mother-fucking cabin doors, crowded with beggars of the female sex (bitches), followed by three, four, or six shit-bag children, all in rags and shit and importuning every passenger for an alms. These mothers, instead of being able to work for their goddamn honest livelihood, are forced to employ all their fucking time in strolling to beg sustenance for their helpless lice-infested infants: who as they grow up either turn thieves for want of work, or leave their dear native shithole of a country to fight for the Pretender in Spain, or sell themselves to the Barbadoes, those assholes.

@JustaDipshit, I mean JustaTech, try @54 next time so you are directing your dumb question in the right direction. I wouldn’t expect anyone on this blog to know who the AAP is because you all don’t have a clue about anything in regards to this entire subject. It just shows that you don’t know the most basic things about such a critical subject. This is equivalent to an IT guy not knowing what a computer monitor is. Maybe you should be focusing on a different subject idiot. And yes, I will admit I’m a bit strange, but I know the ins and outs and every answer you all have ever been searching for when it comes to the cause of Autism. And very soon you will all know it too. Like I’ve said before, 2010 is the year something big happens, and you will all finally shut the hell up and bury your stupid little heads in shame. Then you can start a new blog about how it is acceptable to inject plutonium into pregnant women because pharmaceutical companies say it’s ok. Wow, how can you not have brains of your own?

@63 Smarter Than You – Wow, do tell. What’s the big thing that’s going to happen in 2010? Are you using your powers of prestidigitation, or do you have some kind of inside scoop? I remember someone similar to you (but without the profanity) bragging on Kathleen Seidel’s blog on March 22, 2006 that

…I would like to make a virtual wager that within the next 18-24 months scientific evidence will make the thimerosal-autism link a near certainty. If you are willing, I’ll let you name the stakes.

Hmmm. It’s not just 24 months later, it’s 48 months later. Better luck with your powers of foresight.

@63

Mad, MAD they called me! But soon, I’ll show them all! Their time of reckoning shall come! Oh yes, it shall come!

*maniacal laughter and well-timed lightning/thunder*

Do they have paragraphs in your secret volcano lair? Check behind the boxes of one-piece henchman jumpsuits. You know, the ones you use to dress up your straw-man army.

Also, why are you hoarding all of these “answers” to yourself? Purportedly, thousands (or, according to one misguided commenter, hundreds of thousands) of people are suffering from “vaccine injury”. If you have clear, evidence-based answers, why withhold them from the rest of society?

I can’t wait for October/November 2010, when we get to find out that something big is coming out in June/July 2011!

I’m willing to bet it will be some lame moronic paper in JPANDS, Medical Hypotheses or Medical Veritas. Probably with the same quality as the paper described here:

We tried hard to find any science to analyse, but failed. The author just waxes moronically about infections, immune responses and ASD children without a shred, nothing, to support this ‘hypothesis’. The author is clearly setting up a post hoc argument using sources that don’t support such a conclusion.

Considering the quality of the Morphing Troll’s writing and use of evidence (which is never), I suspect it will be as laughable as the 2001 Blaxill and friends paper.

@Chris…you a girl or a boy? Try going and talking to one of the Scientists or Doctors yourself for once you douchebag…maybe it will open up your eyes a little bit to what has happened here. You google searchers that think you actually know something annoy me. Let me ask you ChrisTY…have you ever talked face to face with one Doctor, Scientist, Toxicologist, etc. that has performed any of the Science associated with this issue from either side of the argument? Have you questioned them or took the time to understand what they did, how they did it, and what the result was? If you want evidence, get off your lazy fat ass and go out there and get it like I did. I already have it and like I said, someone as elementary as you will not understand until it is fully complete. If you want to know sooner, I highly recommend traveling the country and world like I did to get it.

@Ian, not even close. You could never guess this in a million years. It’s something you have never encountered before or even heard of I assure you.

Something I’ve never even heard of? Neat! Some kind of fusion of jazz, camels, and the colour purprange (a new colour that was invented specifically for this Earth-shattering display of your genius)? C’mon, just a little hint… you can whisper it into my ear. Does it perhaps involve attempts at insult by calling men by women’s names (which really isn’t that insulting if you think about the number of smart female scientists there are out there…)

@Chris – stop acting as though Smarter Than You is a real person who can be engaged in a constructive debate. It’s much more constructive to mock him/her openly. That way, his/her ULTIMATE REVENGE! (thunder/lightning) will be that much sweeter, when he/she SHOWS US ALL!!!!!!111one

@ChrisTY…I didn’t ask for the evidence you google searched numbnuts…you wouldn’t know how to read or interpret one of those items you copied and pasted from someone’s website of bullshit. I’ve talked to many of the names that you copied and pasted. How many have you talked to ChrisTY? Have you traveled to Port Angeles Washington and talked directly with Paul Stehr-Green to discuss his epidemiology study related to thimerosal and autism, or his role he played in the Simpsonwood Conference? Have you interviewed Tom Burbacher at the University of Washington regarding his monkey studies? Have you interviewed Paul Offit in Philidelphia or Arthur Allen in D.C. about how thimerosal doesn’t cause Autism? Have you interviewed the CDC, FDA, EPA, AAP, WHO, NIH regarding this subject? Have you talked with David Kirby to really see how he came to the conclusion he did? Have you peformed experiments on childhood vaccines to see just how much mercury is actually in them? Have you you interviewed hundreds of parents and autistic children to really understand how their child regressed into autism, or was born with autism? Have you researched the first 11 children diagnosed with Autism by Leo Kanner and seen anything interesting about the oldest one of them? Have you received a mercury loaded shot yourself and been introduced to the devastating world known as Autism? Have you sat in the courtroom for weeks listening to every piece of the testimony at the autism omnibus proceeding? Have you attended rallies to find out just why these people are so upset and feel the need to rally in front of the CDC or the Capital Building? Have you witnessed first hand a child regressing into autism right before your eyes? Dude, you can’t say yes to even one of these…so go continue your little google searches and keep letting your weak easily controlled brain be brainwashed by AFLAC…oops ORAC. I keep getting him confused.

But – But – he travelled to the sources of Science!!!!

I love to travel, and it’s long been my dream to travel to the sources of everything big – the Nile, the Amazon – and if I could travel to the sources of Science, brilliant! Please tell me where it is so I can book my ticket!

Also, I’m just crushing on the sexism. ChrisTY – What a nice subtle put-down – although it’s just subtle enough that I’m not sure what the implication is – that Chris is so dumb s/he must be a woman or that Chris is a woman and obviously a part of the Big Gender conspiracy (to do what exactly?) As a woman, I just love it when my genitalia is used as a pejorative!

STY: “Don’t get me wrong here though, I’m not saying vaccines are the culprit.”
“Have you received a mercury loaded shot yourself and been introduced to the devastating world known as Autism?”

I’m confused. Which is it?

UNLESS YOU TALK TO EVERYONE WITH ANY OPINION ON THIS SUBJECT YOU ARE WRONG!

RAAARGH!

Smarter Than You:

Most impressive, I can see that you are an operative of the first order. I do have one question, though:

What color is the boathouse at Hereford?

Bedside manner counts, Orac.

Nothing makes my newspaperman’s nerves twitch more than someone telling me: ‘You really don’t want to talk to that guy.’ (See Schlesinger or Schneider’s advice to reporters covering climate.)

The proper method — it takes more time but it’s still the proper method — is to explain why ‘that guy’s’ approach is invalid.

Sibelius doesn’t seem to have crossed the line that Schlesinger and Schneider did (although I don’t know the exact meaning of ‘reach out’). If you don’t know the story, Schlesinger threatened to ‘cut off’ the Times’ Revkin if he persisted in interviewing people of whom Schlesinger disapproved.

If it had been me, Schlesinger would have been the one cut off. Lucky for him, Revkin is more tolerant.

Just a piece of friendly advice.

Oh, damn! The only decent insult in there was directed at #84 and I was soooo hoping it was me, but alas, no . . .

Oh well. I’ll just go back to my crack pipe.

@Maydijo…you write some idiotic shit…do you even know what an autistic child is? I don’t think you know anything about this subject at all…nor do you appear to have past a third grade level education. A 10 year old responding to you could definitely sign his name “Smarter Than You”.

@96…that was actually pretty funny

The MST3k gang over at Rifftrax have a track available for the newer Wicker Man. It makes that movie watchable (but even then just barely) – that movie really, really bites.

@SmarterThanY’all
If you had traveled the world, surely you would happen upon any number of French-speaking countries and/or people. In French, Rene with one “e” is for males. Renee with two “e”s is for females.
Like “fiance” and “fiancee” are in English (adopted from French).
To quote Stephen Colbert, “It’s French, bitch.”

Besides, Kim Stagliano did a “quick google search” of my name and “outed” me on AoA. You, having been well traveled deep into the bowels of Science, must know how to google. In case you don’t, here, let me google that for you: http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Rene+Najera

@100…sorry I can’t be more accommodating to your special reading needs Tyler….I don’t have time for exact proper English or to worry about breaking it up into exact paragraphs…you are a joke if thats all you can write about on here…I added dots to separate things just for you “slow one”. Why don’t you be the first to respond to my @79? Tell me which ones you can say yes to Tyler if you can somehow get yourself to decipher my one large paragraph without getting confused or lost. I challenge you and look forward to your response. I have called everyone’s bluff on here already and it’s hilarious. Now I’m going to hear a bunch of bullshit lies that you all make up because I would have already had a response by now if anyone actually could answer yes to one of them. I really want ORAC to answer this question. He seems to know the least and I know all he does is google everything and spin it. He has no real knowledge of this subject at all, just the funny stuff he reads on the internet. How embarrassing to have his bluff called out on his own blog. I hope for his sake he responds. And just a hint to all of you who are wondering who this is. I am someone you all know very very well, however if I told you, you wouldn’t believe me for a second and I’m not about to blow my cover as it will ruin the final impact. I can also assure you that I am not who you think I am. I am not someone who has ever spoken to the public about this issue nor am I someone who is associated in any way with Jenny, JB, RFK, AofA, Blaxil, Wakefield, etc. etc. etc. I am however someone most people in this world are very familiar with and the last person you would expect to have researched and dug so deep into the roots of this issue with one single objective in mind. I am not attempting to re-open or further this debate, my objective is to close it, and trust me I will. Your ship and your world is about to sink forever, and you all will bury your heads in shame once you too realize the final answer. I’m wondering if I will actually half blame you all, given the fact that you are all so clueless and uneducated, how were you really to know I must ask myself. There are those that should have known, and did know, and they are the ones that have a freight train coming their way full speed ahead. Go ahead and give me a good laugh…take a guess who this is?

@Rene….so you are saying you are a girl…good now I know thanks. Now I know Chris and Rene are both women. And again I am not sexist, women are actually going to be taking over many powerful positions in the near future and I am all for it. I just like to know who I am having a discussion with. Thanks again you French fuck.

@105…again yet another meaningless moronic comment. Is this all you people have in here. You are all making ORAC look really bad being so easily humiliated. Someone respond to my 79!!!!

Smarter Than You/Dr. I M Smart/Medicine Man (I think), you are not as entertaining as Happ*h was. S/he at least maintained a website with lots of weird dick pictures on it. You just blather on about how special you are and make juvenile insults. Sir, you disappoint me.

I know, I know. STY is the Zodiac! It’s the same style of writing, the same delusions of grandeur.

And just a hint to all of you who are wondering who this is. I am someone you all know very very well, however if I told you, you wouldn’t believe me for a second and I’m not about to blow my cover as it will ruin the final impact. I can also assure you that I am not who you think I am. I am not someone who has ever spoken to the public about this issue nor am I someone who is associated in any way with Jenny, JB, RFK, AofA, Blaxil, Wakefield, etc. etc. etc. I am however someone most people in this world are very familiar with and the last person you would expect to have researched and dug so deep into the roots of this issue with one single objective in mind.

Oh hey everyone, it’s JOE THE PLUMBER.

STY drooled:

I am someone you all know very very well, however if I told you, you wouldn’t believe me for a second and I’m not about to blow my cover as it will ruin the final impact.

I knew it! He’s Matt Nisbet!

Science Mom…either way, male or female I’m sure you are nasty…again respond to 79 instead of your stupid idiotic first grade comebacks as you are embarrassing yourself!!!! I challenge you, you sick twisted Man Mom.

Have you interviewed the CDC, FDA, EPA, AAP, WHO, NIH

So have you ever eaten China? France? Italy?

@117…wow, just when I thought you people couldn’t get any dumber…let me explain this to someone who just doesn’t get it…79 is calling your bluff Dan…I’m trying to figure out if you all are really just a bunch of lazy fat asses that sit on your computer and gossip and pretend you know anything about anything just because you read the bullshit misinformation all over the internet…perfect example ORAC’s website…ORAC has never taken it upon himself to do any of the things that I have layed out in 79 (and those are just a few of the hundreds if not thousands of items)…and all of you are in the same boat…If you really care about this issue and want to get to the bottom of it why don’t you go after the most accurate information there is…THE SOURCE!!! Even Rene mentions that Kim Stagliano banned HER from Age of Autism. Has SHE ever talked to Kim about her adorable three daughters who all have Autism? Hell no SHE hasn’t! This is called ignorance. I used to be ignorant too, when I was like you all and just read the internet all day trying to figure it all out. Then I woke up and realized I needed to go after the information like no one has before, including the CDC. Why isn’t the CDC chasing down these Scientists who think they have a major piece of the Science that may implicate Vaccines as a cause of Autism and wanting to know everything about it? The CDC is responsible for determining what is causing this “disease” right? Why am I having to do this for them? I know the CDC’s Science better than the CDC themselves. I also know the other sides Science better than the CDC will ever know it. Put me up against the top ten CDC Scientists on the planet and I will anhialate them with their own Science and blow them away with the Science they don’t even know exists yet. The CDC needs to first recognize they have a devastating epidemic on their hands which will hopefully one day happen, maybe when the rate goes to 1 in 10 they will finally respond accordingly. In the meantime, I need ignorant people like you to stop pretending you know anything about this when you have not made any effort to really figure it out.

@79…

Have you received a mercury loaded shot yourself and been introduced to the devastating world known as Autism

Have YOU? This is what you’re implying. Can we actually experience autism by shooting mercury?

Now I really, really can’t wait for the book.

@122…nice try imposter…you have some serious issues! Next time don’t forget to put spaces in your name “SmarterThanYou”. Silly imposter, rookie mistake. And I will now sign off. No reason for me to respond anymore. I have defeated the shit out of all of you and you have shamed your god ORAC. All of your bluffs have now been called and you can sign off tonight having been disgraced and shamed. That was so easy, not even the tiny challenge I was expecting. Bye Bye Dumbasses!

Monomaniacal nutbag is monomaniacal.

Lithium really isn’t that bad, though the liver tests suck.

So, the Discovery Institute is:
– pro-intelligent design
– pro-climate change denial
and now,
– supportive of anti-vaxxer lunacy.

It’s a trifecta of stupid. It does make it easy to judge what the truth is on any matter, though: exactly the opposite of whatever the Discovery Institute’s stance is.

I’ve expounded on this creationist-AGW-denier-anti-vaxxer link on my blog.

Obvious troll was obvious, but not very much fun. Obvious troll fails, except in the vast spaces within his/her/its own disturbed, distorted, deranged, delusional mind.

Perhaps Happeh changed his meds (hence the change of style) and ISP (thereby eluding ORAC’s banned troll filter).

@128, nice try you fucking moron! @133, I just had to comment on the sexist part, I find it very funny. First of all I’ve never told you if I was a man or woman. Would I still be sexist if I am a woman? Second of all, many women are going to be taking very powerful positions in the near future and I am all for it. The men are definitely much less intelligent these days and if you know anything at all about this subject then you probably already understand why. I can absolutely assure you that I am not sexist, quite the opposite actually. I can also assure you that I am not aware of any new book that is coming out, I’m sure as hell not writing one, so no need to worry about my lack of paragraphs. Do you use paragraphs in your texts too you time wasting dipshits? This is a useless meaningless completely inaccurate blog, who gives a shit about paragraphs. Anyone can hit enter twice, but I do it more to annoy the shit out of you people and make it harder on your small simple little brains to comprehend. Also, quit with the tunnel vision on talking to the Scientists, that is only one of the many things I have done that has been very impactful in piecing this together. This is just one of the many items you have not done. There are many many many more things that are absolutely essential in really comprehending and understanding this entire issue. It’s so funny how I can say many things and you tend to focus on just one because that is all your tiny brains can handle. I apologize for coming across so full of myself, however if there is one thing I do know, it’s that I know more about this subject in my tiny left toenail than all of you combined including ORAC and it disturbs me to see you all misinforming innocent people that may stumble across the site or come across each of you in life that may actually listen to you. The consequences could be devastating to them and their families. Your information is very dangerous to someone who just may listen to you and end up with their life turned upside down like mine was as a direct result of it. I encourage all of you to seek as much information about this subject as possible, because I can assure each and every one of you that you are dead wrong in your so called conclusions you have come to that are as useless as yourselves in life. You will all finally have the big lightbulb come on. Don’t worry, it won’t be much longer now. Enjoy looking at yourselves in the mirror while you can now, because you won’t be able to shortly.

Personally, if I was answering @133, I would have provided something that, you know, actually answers the concerns expressed within, rather than answering ion a self-congratulating egotistic self centred semi-structured style that actually confirms that , yes, you are all bluff and bluster.

Shame on you for dishonouring the people here for thinking they would fall for it.

Kindly put something of substance up or piss off.

Some of us here are autistic, some of us here work inautism services or have autistic children. Your talk about ‘understanding the entire issue’ is not only factually inaccurate and condescending, it’s as transparant as hell.

You are either a moron or a very poor quality Poe. Unfortunetly for you, your arguement is so ridiculous, it’s impossible to tell the difference.

@Dedj

If STY is a Poe, and you can’t tell, then he/she is a successful Poe.

To answer 79, yes I have done all of those things and more. I have personally interviewed Science and have trekked the world talking to everyone and seeing everything first-hand. Of course, I could prove this to you, but you are so stupid that you couldn’t possibly understand. Also, I have an invisible flying car but I’m not going to show you because you’re not worthy to know of its existence. Also, I am sitting on your roof pooping in your chimney, but in such a way that you will never be able to find out if it’s true or not. And you’ll never find out who I REALLY am because I have constructed a series of false identities that are so elaborate, you’ll never know if it’s actually me.

BUT SOON YOU SHALL ALL SEE!

Non-falsifiable troll thinks circular arguments are delicious. He thinks that because he thinks things that are delicious are circular.

Morphing troll:

Answer it now, now, now! 79 answer it now!

I did answer, troll. What part of “yes” did you not understand.

What exactly is your evidence again?

The last comment is obviously a Poe. Either from the delusional guy who has been posting, or by someone who is pretending to the morphing troll.

Wow, smarter than you thinks the word of a doctor is more important than their research. Actually working with doctors for awhile should clear up all that MD worship. Doctors screw up all the time, and believe stupid things just as often as anyone else.

i have to say, this is some of the funniest shit i have ever read. i am so glad i stumbled across this blog a few days ago while researching DAN!

what entertainment!

i wish i had the mental organization (and dedication) to reply personally to many of the posters on here, but unfortunately i don’t. there are just too many things to say. not that my personal opinions would add much to the conversation, other than to say, “good point” or “thanks for the laughs!”

@Rene and Ian
Re: A modest proposal you shitbags

Bwah-hahahahahahah! I almost choked on my wine! i fucking love profanity.

@The Gregarious Misanthrope
Re: your name

best. name. ever. i wish i had thought of it myself. describes me perfectly. i totally want to steal it from you.

@snerd
Re: “You are either a moron or a very poor quality Poe”

since i am new here, and do not yet know the lingo, could you please explain to me the use and meaning of the word, “poe?”

@STY
Re: your erroneous assertion that one must speak to all the researchers of a particular study before one can have any valid beliefs in the veracity of their claims

are you seriously trying to assert this ridiculous premise? surely you can see the flaws in this argument? how could you ever believe anything at all? have you spoken with robert hook? francis crick? john snow? mathieu orfila? no? then how could you possibly have the audacity to comment/ expand/ or experiment on their contributions to science by researching autism?

do you know anything about the scientific method, standardized procedures, or the evolution of scientific theory and rational thought?

and why do you keep saying you are “someone most people in this world are very familiar with..?” have you BEEN all over the world? because i don’t care who the fuck you are, most people in the world haven’t heard of you. you could be jesus fucking christ, michael fucking jackson, the dalai lama, and lord shiva rolled into one, and most people still wouldn’t know who the fuck you are. do you know anything about population biology, cultural anthropology, or geography? or have you just not gotten around to tirelessly vetting those experts yet?

your strange brew of solipsism, megalomania, apologia, and selective skepticism intrigues me…. it makes me wonder: have you spoken to anyone who could possibly be labeled a mental health professional? or how about someone who specializes in reasoning and critical thinking? what do their studies tell you?

@92

And maybe also to stop smoking crack just prior to writing something that makes absolutely no sense at all.

Hide the pipe, guys…he’s on to us!

You know, I wish I had a killfile available for work; when I get home today I’ll use it on my home computer, but work doesn’t have it so I guess I’ll just have to skim over STY’s comments for REAL discussion.

@150…you are just an idiot imposter that again just shows you people don’t have brains or identities of your own…This has all been so hilarious to me. Once you all figured out that I called your bluff, your comments went to a whole new level of attempting to be funny and make fun of me because that is all that you have. You couldn’t quiet me with words of reason or some intelligent response. You all were like little first graders trying to make a good comeback that others would think was funny just to try and save your face. Most of you turn into sick twisted weirdos once the pressure is put on you to respond with something intelligent and the words that you write prove that you have no self control of your emotions and you act out of desparation. I find this pretty typical with you type of people. Do you realize how embarrassing that is for you? @Chris, it’s hilarious that you said “Yes”. Which one were you actually saying yes to? Tell me exactly which question you were able to say yes to? @144, you are stupid. I think 99% of doctors are fucking idiots that don’t know shit. It’s only the best of the best that really know and understand this issue, the rest are just puppets who say “the CDC says its safe so it must be safe”. How you interpreted anything to infer what you claim is a perfect example of you people spinning shit out of something that was never said. You all are the most pathetic “not being able to think for yourself” people I have ever encountered, and I have battled a lot of idiots such as yourselves. Anyone who thinks it is healthy to inject 62.5 mcg of mercury directly into a 12 lb baby’s bloodstream knows absolutely nothing about mercury and it’s extreme neurotoxicity at nanogram exposures. Since you are all dumb, 1000 nanograms equals one microgram. Do the math fuckers. Oh wait you can’t do that either, that is 62,500 nanograms. But since I am dumb and OJ says he didn’t kill Nicole and I believe him, I will go ahead and inject this into my baby who will be anhialated by this, but it’s perfectly ok because the CDC will be able to help me with my autistic child and give me all the answers to fix him afterword. Haha, now I’m starting to talk like you douchebag mother fuckers! I’m outs moronic people! Have fun reading my imposters from here on out!

For being smarter than us, STY, you sure know diddly about how vaccines are given as well as how much mercury of what kind are in vaccines versus food (big hint–latter has more dangerous stuff than the former). What’s the quote? Full of sound and fury, signifying nothing.

Woo-hoo! I’m a college man! I won’t need my high school diploma any more! [sets fire to it and starts singing]

I am so smart!
I am so smart!
I am so smart!
I am so smart!

S-M-R-T!

I mean, S-M-A-R-T…

Seriously, Calli. You can use facts to prove anything that’s even remotely true.

I am still giggling over “A Modest Proposal, You Shitbags.”

I got it! STY is Cartman from South Park!

historygeek,
I and several family members are involved with an organization that promotes “intelligent design”. Within this circle, I have seen strong criticism of the Discovery Institute, mainly over too much involvement with “young-Earth” creationism.

@154…you are the dumbest of dumb and like to talk like you are smart…1) Yes vaccines are given “intramuscular” that is very common and basic knowledge I never said the word “intraveneous”, where do you think it ends up though dumbass? Your “once upon of time” lasted until at least 2002 and most likely 2004 with all of the backstock…this was not recalled stupid ass. Worse yet, in 2004 they started giving flu shots to pregnant women which is the most devastating thing you could possibly expose a developing fetus to. “Readily excreted from the body”…you are a fucking idiot. Ethyl, as organic mercury can readily cross into the brain just as Methyl does, however Ethyl de-ethylates into the inorganic form much quicker than Methyl which basically locks it into the brain and inorganic can’t cross back out like organic. Methyl can wash in and out and takes much longer to de-methylate into inorganic that is why it has such a short half life in the brain. This is why your comments are such a joke. You don’t have to teach me about the guideline dumbass, I’m surprised you even know it. The problem is this guideline is based on someone eating fish (methyl organic mercury) and Burbacher proves in his monkey studies that they do not act alike once in the brain and the guideline should not be the same. In the end, much more inorganic mercury was found in the brain of those monkeys exposed to Ethyl vs. those monkeys exposed to Methyl. So in fact if we actually had a guideline for Ethyl mercury exposure, it would be way less than that of Methyl. Also in regards to your #1, children are given 2 flu shots the first year of life and one every year after, not to mention the even more horendous effects of exposing them to it in-utero. 94% of all flu shots still contain the full 25 mcg of mercury dumbass, good luck finding one. Childhood vaccines are not all thimerosal free as you claim so your credibility can be ruled out instantly. The problem is even worse now because they are exposing the pregnant women to this neurotoxin and it will anhialate a susceptible developing fetus and this year pregnant women were given two mercury loaded flu shots (regular and swine). Have you ever heard of Rho-gam Moms dumbass? I have interviewed hundreds of them for an obvious reason. You can refer to your little study of Rho-gam Moms if you want, but it is a joke and try telling that to a Rho-gam Mom that has 4 Autistic Children who were all exposed to thimerosal in-utero, but just by coincidence her only child that didn’t get the exposure is perfectly healthy. 2) I have already addressed this…however just for your “edification” Ethyl mercury was found to have a half life in the brain of 20 years. Hmmm would I rather have 50 days or 20 years? I know which one you have! 3) This is the dumbest analogy I have seen yet and makes me think you don’t really understand what I am talking about. Your calculations would equate to a child receiving 115 times the EPA guideline for Methyl Mercury IN ONE DAY not over a 4 month period!!! And this guideline is established for a much less toxic form, not to mention all of the synergistic effects with the aluminum and other ingredients in the vaccine. In laboratory the thimerosal solution is even more toxic to brain neurons than ethyl mercury by itself. Whatever you were trying to say in this one was completely elementary in thinking. We are not talking about the baby eating sushi here pal, we are talking about getting a completely different form of mercury injected into his body at hundreds of times the “guideline” within minutes, not 4 months. Damn you are dumb! 4) No you can’t focus entirely on the ethyl mercury…that is a very inaccurate statement and it is a common mistake amongst people who don’t look at the entire picture here and don’t really understand EVERYTHING. Many of these children are damaged before they are even born by the amalgams in the mother’s mouths, or the sushi they have eaten even before they were pregnant. You don’t understand how cummulative this metal is. It builds and builds and builds and causes damage and more damage. Then when a woman gets pregnant the developing fetus is incredibly susceptible to the effects of the mercury in the mother’s body. Many of these mothers are breathing in the vapors from their mouths every single day that child is trying to develop in the womb. Oh, but I’m sure you will try to say the mercury is stable once in amalgam form just like many dentists claim. Don’t even try it, I have don’t experiments with amalgams and seen the vapors come off from things like brushing it lightly, and a mercury vapor analyzer registered…guess what? MERCURY! To rule these types of exposures out is a fatal flaw, but it doesn’t surprise me given who I am discussing this with. 5) You are a clown and this has been addressed. 6) I have addressed most of this, however you have made a big mistake. Ethyl Mercury has a half life of 2 weeks in the blood maybe, but just because it leaves the blood doesn’t mean it left the body. Like I said before, more inorganic mercury was found in the brain in the monkeys exposed to Ethyl in the end, vs. those exposed to Methyl. Do you suppose this inorganic mercury will have left the brain by the next round of vaccines? NOT A CHANCE IN HELL!!! You are very elementary in your entire thinking process. I almost didn’t respond to you because your points were so bad. The only reason I did is because you tried to sound like you were actually smart, when in fact your words are riddled with errors and flaws and fatal mistakes. Do some more research there tough guy!

Haha Ian, I’m glad you stood down and thats all you could think of bitch!

@Fuzzzone…point taken, however I get a little wound up when I’m dealing with the opinions of ignorance, and not the opinions of issue related educated people. I never in a million years would try to convince innocent people about something that I didn’t REALLY know about and put their lives at risk. This is what many of these people do, that is where the anger comes from. I won’t be posting much more on here anyway, but if I do I will try to minimize the language and insults. But you must also remember, it’s many against one here 🙂

@Fuzzzone…Science Mom makes it very hard for me to take your advice…Hey Science Mom, do you know the difference between “blood” and “brain”? Read the two sentences carefully and tell me the difference. Ethyl mercury does leave the blood very quickly…BECAUSE IT GOES DIRECTLY INTO THE BRAIN!!!! I forgot, you especially are not very sharp so let me further explain it to you. “20 years in the brain”..”2 weeks in the blood”….you got that now?

Based on her complete lack of understanding of the “Science” I’m starting to think Science Mom is Allison Singer.

STY: Provided that you truly believe in the validity of what you’re saying, then I’d recommend to you two quotes. They are from sources with whom I don’t always (or even often) agree, but in these cases I give them their due.

“Patience is the companion of wisdom.” – St. Augustine

and

“Truth persuades by teaching” – Tertullian

@Ian…I must remind you that you haven’t said one thing of any relation to this issue yet…you have been completely silenced by this troll. How does that feel? I have anhialated everything and anything you people have said on here and proven you are all imposters and cowards who really know absolutely nothing about this subject, all you do is mislead the innocent people. Stop preaching about something you know nothing about and then you won’t have to deal with someone like me…fuckface…sorry fuzzzone

@176 I made a mistake impostor and you twisted abused my logic again to drive a false argument. And I don’t really care what Fuzzy has to say about religion either. I made serious good points about the vaccines-autism connection and as opposed to the other dumbshits here I interviewed Paul Offit about them. There is clearly a connection and I prooved before that the studies you idiots threw at me at 74 are not good you just googled them to drive the argument.

@179…if you are going to pretend to be me “Smarter Than YOu” you better speak beyond a first grade level otherwise forget about it. It is hilarious that this is all you people have. Hey Kathleen Seidel, why don’t you start debating me? You think you know it all and I laugh at your opinions all day long. You are even worse than ORAC! Let’s have a chat sometime.

@180, you’re an idiot and a manipulator. I said before clearly that I don’t speak that well and now you’re trying to humiliate me by impersonating me and then talking with all your academic elitist socialist perfect language. You’re on of the ppl on this blog who have been disagreeing with me from the start maybe one of these flase scientists like AFLAC. Go somewhere else dipshite and spit your bullshit there/

Jen, @180 is a dipshit imposter…don’t listen to him…you obviously have an open mind to this subject and understand when someone is talking some sense. It’s good to see someone in here that actually has a brain and can use it to think. Thanks. And to Ian again, that is correct you do not know anything about thimerosal/autism, but guess what I do! So don’t even try to talk to me about this subject until you educate yourself on it a little bit first.

No! I am Smarter Than You, bitches! And I am smarter than you, too, bitches, again. And stuff. Fat assess. You have all this time to reply to me? What the hell do you do all day? Jesus, how can you have so much free time? I bet you don’t have a fucking life.

@Ian…a fool is someone who tries to include himself in a discussion he knows nothing about. A fool is someone with the name Ian, setup from the beginning to be a failure by his parents. I’m sure Mr. T has taught you something, but that discussion is for a different type of blog. And yes, I do have the time to do this because my entire life revolves around this issue right now and I make sure I know every single point idiots like you and others on here try to bring up so I can anhialate your points in the end result. I do this for a very specific reason, and it is not even close to a waste of time for me. I have done this for years now trying to acquire any and all information, no matter how stupid it is, so I have not left one single base unturned. Every time I have done this it just reinforces everything I know and loads me with the ammunition I need to counter any and every point fools like you have. Thanks again to yet another idiot for your help.

@Ian…good job at giving yourself away as the imposter…nice one moron.

Smarter Than You @ 162:
Fuckers! Stop making fun of me. Is that the only fucking way you can fucking deal with my intelligence? You can’t use reason or anything like that?

Yes, it is a shame when people stoop to your level, isn’t it? I’ll attempt to not do so, though I acknowledge some of the words may be difficult for you, as they have more than four letters.

@165:
1) Yes vaccines are given “intramuscular” that is very common and basic knowledge I never said the word “intraveneous”, where do you think it ends up though dumbass?

No, you said “directly into the bloodstream”, which is what “intravenous” means. Perhaps I should apologize for using big words; I thought your handle meant you actually were somewhat erudite.

Your “once upon of time” lasted until at least 2002 and most likely 2004 with all of the backstock…this was not recalled stupid ass.

Correction; it lasted until 1999. The backstock ran out in 2002, though I can understand where if you were confused about the actual date, you might think the date the backstock ran out would be 2004. In any case, 2004 is six years ago; that is plenty long enough to see whether or not there has been a reduction in autism cases, as it is typically diagnosed before that age. There hasn’t been a reduction; on the contrary, the number has continued to rise at a steady rate (though it does depend on how you count it).

(As I sidenote, I have no doubt whatsoever that my ass is stupid compared to yours. After all, I do not keep my brains in mine.)

Worse yet, in 2004 they started giving flu shots to pregnant women which is the most devastating thing you could possibly expose a developing fetus to.

Actually, they started giving flu shots to pregnant women long before that. I know, because I got a flu shot in 2003 while pregnant. And I think you’ll find that there are much more devasting things to which a developing fetus can be exposed. Rubella, for instance.

“Readily excreted from the body”…you are a fucking idiot. Ethyl, as organic mercury can readily cross into the brain just as Methyl does, however Ethyl de-ethylates into the inorganic form much quicker than Methyl which basically locks it into the brain and inorganic can’t cross back out like organic. Methyl can wash in and out and takes much longer to de-methylate into inorganic that is why it has such a short half life in the brain.

I’m sorry, I thought you were interested in facts, not fantasy. Actual scientific research has determined that the half-life of ethyl mercury is two weeks, whereas methyl mercury is 50 days. That seems significant to me; I’m not sure why it isn’t to you.

Also in regards to your #1, children are given 2 flu shots the first year of life and one every year after, not to mention the even more horendous effects of exposing them to it in-utero.

Flu shots are not compulsory; children only receive them if the parents request it. They are available in several forumlations. The live flu vaccine (e.g. Flumist) cannot contain Thimerosal, as this renders it ineffective, but infants cannot safely receive live flu vaccine, so they must use inactivated flu vaccine. This is available in several formulations. I was curious to see what the real rations were, as your 94% figure seemed unlikely. So I decided to do a little research.

Influenza vaccines are made by several different companies and come in a variety of doses. So I had to do a bit of reading to find this.

Fluzone, made by Sanofi Pasteur, is one of the more common, and is as far as I can tell, the only one recommended for infants and toddlers. It comes in a 5mL multidose vial (with thimerosal), a 0.25 mL prefilled pediatric dose for 6-36 months of age, a 0.5 ml prefilled syringe for 36 months and up, and a single dose vial for 36 months and up. The prefilled syringes and the single dose vial are all thimerosal-free, and don’t even use thimerosal in the manufacturing process. Only the 0.25 mL prefilled dose is supposed to be used in infants, but if someone draws a 0.25 mL dose out of a 5 mL multidose vial, it will contain 12.5 mcg of thimerosal. (The dose you cited is for the adult dose, not the pediatric dose.)

Fluarix, made by Glaxo Smith Kline, is only available in one form: a 0.5 mL prefilled syringe (and thus is not suitable for infants). It contains no thimerosal, but thimerosal is used in the manufacturing process and a trace amount may remain. (“Trace” in this case is defined as less than 1 microgram.)

Fluvirin, by Novartis, is, available in both a prefilled 0.5 mL syringe containing only trace amounts of thimerosal (it is used in the manufacturing process, but removed) and a 5 mL vial (which contains up to 24.5 mcg of thimerosal per 0.5 mL dose). It is not recommended for infants.

The problem is even worse now because they are exposing the pregnant women to this neurotoxin and it will anhialate a susceptible developing fetus and this year pregnant women were given two mercury loaded flu shots (regular and swine).

Given that 2009 H1N1 was particularly deadly in pregnant women, I think this was very sensible.

Have you ever heard of Rho-gam Moms dumbass? I have interviewed hundreds of them for an obvious reason.

“Rho-gam Moms”? Is this an actual group, or something?

I am a mother, and my blood type is A-. Therefore, I received RhoGAM during my first pregnancy. (I used a competing immunoglobulin product on my second pregnancy. I think it was Gamulin Rh.) I don’t know about you, but I much prefer that to dead babies, especially as it did not harm either of my babies. It’s one of the great successes of modern medicine, having virtually eliminated Rh disease of the fetus in the developed world.

2) I have already addressed this…however just for your “edification” Ethyl mercury was found to have a half life in the brain of 20 years. Hmmm would I rather have 50 days or 20 years? I know which one you have!

I don’t know where that was found, because studies with actual human beings, including actual human infants, found that it has a halflife of only 2 weeks.

3) This is the dumbest analogy I have seen yet and makes me think you don’t really understand what I am talking about. Your calculations would equate to a child receiving 115 times the EPA guideline for Methyl Mercury IN ONE DAY not over a 4 month period!!! And this guideline is established for a much less toxic form, not to mention all of the synergistic effects with the aluminum and other ingredients in the vaccine.

It isn’t an analogy; it’s math. However, your confusion is understandable, as you didn’t understand how a person might think “injected directly into the bloodstream” meant the same thing as “intravenous”.

A child who is receiving ethyl mercury is not receiving 115 times the EPA guideline for methyl mercury. Perhaps you are confused, because only a short while back in the same post, you indicated that you knew they were different substances, though you were dramatically mistaken on the half-life of one.

Clearly I did not make the point clearly enough for you.

Nobody gives a vaccine daily for four months, and babies aren’t eating them, so the EPA guidelines for fish consumption are not a very good parallel.

As for synergistic effects with aluminum, I’d be interested to know what synergistic effects you propose exist.

In laboratory the thimerosal solution is even more toxic to brain neurons than ethyl mercury by itself.

Thimerosal (also called thiomerosal, and trademarked as Merthiolate) is sodium ethylmercurithiosalicylate. It decomposes very rapidly in the body to ethyl mercury and thiosalicylate. It was invented in 1927 and widely marketed as a topical antiseptic. 1.9% of the population is allergic to it; for them, the thimerosal-free versions of vaccines are critical. Use of the chemical has dwindled dramatically, from the widespread use in the 1930s to only small exposures nowdays. Yet somehow, you expect me to believe harm from it has *increased*. Strange.

We are not talking about the baby eating sushi here pal, we are talking about getting a completely different form of mercury injected into his body at hundreds of times the “guideline” within minutes, not 4 months. Damn you are dumb!

Ah, so you did understand my point. You just didn’t grasp what it meant.

Recommended daily allowance isn’t the same as a toxic threshhold. The RDA assumes you are getting that amount every day. Methyl mercury builds up; if you take that amount for four months, you will be perfectly fine. If you take that amount in one day and then lay off the fish, you will be perfectly fine.

No you can’t focus entirely on the ethyl mercury…that is a very inaccurate statement and it is a common mistake amongst people who don’t look at the entire picture here and don’t really understand EVERYTHING. Many of these children are damaged before they are even born by the amalgams in the mother’s mouths, or the sushi they have eaten even before they were pregnant.

Interesting; a moment ago, you were focusing in on one thing; now you want me to see the big picture? Mercury amalgam fillings are another matter; they are quite safe as long as no idiots come along to con the patient into having them drilled out, which turns the substance, once safely locked away, into an ingestible powder. Fortunately, this is inorganic mercury, and not easily absorbed by the body.

Sushi I have already discussed, by talking about the consumption of marine apex predators, but you clearly did not notice. That’s all right; it’s perfectly consistent with your reading comprehension otherwise.

Don’t even try it, I have don’t experiments with amalgams and seen the vapors come off from things like brushing it lightly, and a mercury vapor analyzer registered…guess what? MERCURY!

I’d be curious to know what your methodology was. Assuming, of course, that you really did perform the experiment you claimed.

5) You are a clown and this has been addressed.

Wow, what brilliant repartee! No wonder you are smarter than everyone else, if that is a prime example of your debate skill. The point of #5 was indeed addressed before; it’s the part you clearly still claim to understand yet don’t apply: that the recommendations are not directly comparable to the situation in vaccination.

6) I have addressed most of this, however you have made a big mistake. Ethyl Mercury has a half life of 2 weeks in the blood maybe, but just because it leaves the blood doesn’t mean it left the body.

Really? YOu just said it has a half-life of 20 years. Consistency is perhaps too much to hope from you. Ethyl mercury, like methyl mercury, passes easily across the blood-brain barrier and through all tissues of the body; it cannot be sequestered anywhere.

Like I said before, more inorganic mercury was found in the brain in the monkeys exposed to Ethyl in the end, vs. those exposed to Methyl. Do you suppose this inorganic mercury will have left the brain by the next round of vaccines? NOT A CHANCE IN HELL!!!

I am not familiar with the study that you’re referring to, but it does contradict other studies, which is remarkable. No matter, though. We don’t have to rely on monkey studies. Studies of human infants have shown quite a different outcome: in human infants, ethyl mercury has a half-life of only 3.7 days. (In adults, it’s over two weeks, but still much less than the 44-50 days I’ve seen cited for methyl mercury.)

Do some more research there tough guy!

Not that it matters especially, but I am actually a woman. And I would suggest research for you as well. Your numbers are dramatically wrong. I do not believe you are lying or making things up, though. I think what you believe to be “research” is reading a bunch of websites which correspond to your preexisting opinions, rather than actually reading scientific studies. I must confess, though, that I greatly doubt your claim of having studied mercury amalgam fillings and found that they outgas inorganic mercury vapors, though I am quite willing to change my opinion if you are willing to share your methodology.

“I am quite willing to change my opinion if you are willing to share your methodology.”

No doubt the sekrit would anhialate you.

@Calli in response to 195: 1) No correction needed…it is common knowledge the AAP and others recommended phasing thimerosal out in 1999, however everyone also knows it was not recalled and backstock lasted until at least 2002 but nobody really knows the exact date. I have personally seen many mercury loaded childhood vaccines with an expiration date of 2004, hence the 2004. Again such a weak response grasping at straws. However I will admit I, out of typing and thinking extremely fast used the words “directly into the bloodstream” which were misleading however the end result is the same, it ends up in the bloodstream. I should have said directly into the body without the somewhat protective mechanisms associated with the digestive system. Get over this one, it’s rediculous to even mention. Also, for you to think that all the mercury has been removed and the rates are still going up is absurd. They have not removed all of the mercury, they have just shifted it all around. I would rather give a 10 or 12 pound baby a mercury loaded shot than give a pregnant women with a .5 pound developing fetus a shot, or better yet two shots with 25 mcg in it. Are you kidding me, you actually think the rate will reduce when we are now giving 50 mcg of mercury to all pregnant women in the regular flu shot and swine flu shot? You are crazy! To hear that claim is the most bullshit thing I could ever hear. And that is about the only thing I do hear from you people because you know your epidemiology studies are so flawed you can’t reference them anymore. You all know this and that is why you grab onto the idiotic claim that mercury has been removed and the rates keep going up. Do you know that the latest CDC rate of 1 in 110 was based on 8 year olds in 2006. This means these children were born in 1998, and received the fully loaded vaccines, and also in 2004 started getting the flu shots. These kids received more mercury than anyone. And the so called rate just jumped from 1 in 150 to 1 in 110 after mercury was removed. Bullshit, read the study and this is still during a very devastating period where they were getting floored after they were born. Now they are getting floored before they are born instead when they are much more susceptible to the effects and at a much more critical time in their development. You are so completely wrong on this one, but nice elementary try once again. And yes they may have been giving flu shots to some pregnant women prior to 2004, however this is when they started the big push for it and it was officially recommended for pregnant women and children. And to clarify a very important fact, Doctors push these flu shots like they are giving out candy. They don’t wait for you to ask for one, that is hilarious. They make you feel guilty if you don’t get one and even though there are very tiny numbers of thimerosal free ones, nobody knows to ask for one. I had pregnant friends this year that were made to feel guilty they didn’t get one, even though the doctors didn’t even have a thimerosal free version. These flu shots are a huge devastating problem right now and I can’t possibly understand how you think the rates could come even close to dropping…hilarious. What research are you referring to with the half life of ethyl being 2 weeks vs. methyl 50 days? Are you referring to the study that just shows the half life in the blood? That is an obvious one, what you don’t understand is the half life of mercury in the brain and the study that proves the half life of ethyl in the brain being 20 years and the half life of methyl in the brain being 20 to 30 days. You need to understand when it comes to the toxicity of these two different forms, the determining factor of nuerotoxicity and the end result to the subject depends on how much inorganic mercury is deposited in the brain. Burbacher has proven much more inorganic mercury is deposited in the brain in the end vs. the methyl mercury. THIS IS KEY BECAUSE THIS IS WHY THESE KIDS ARE SICK. You can preach to me all day about your half life shit, but what it ultimately comes down to is how much mercury is in the brain after exposure. I’m sorry to tell you but Ethyl by far exceeds Methyl. Stop wasting your time with this one. And I see you are just as dumb as Science Mom and you don’t understand the difference between “blood” and “brain”. Read my post to her. She tried to say the same idiotic thing that I contradicted myself when if you only new that the blood and brain are two different things you wouldn’t have made that statement. Also, it seems that you only talk about half life in relation to the mercury in the blood which means nothing. I talk about half life in relation to the mercury in the brain which means everything. Your comment “Flu shots are not compulsory; children only receive them if the parents request it”, this is the most hilarious statement I have ever heard. Good one, maybe in your fantasy land this is true. Everyone knows they push they flu shots so hard, they almost beg you to get them. Enough said on that one. I’m not sure why you gave me a lesson on flu shots even though I already know all about them and who makes them. Not sure your point here, but I can assure you 94% of them contain the full 25 mcg. I don’t care about what you googled really quickly, I have the exact stat. The percentage for the swine flu is even worse. I’m not going to respond to your comment that it was acceptable to inject pregnant women with a 25 mcg mercury flu shot, you know where I stand on that. As far as you being a Rho-gam mom, yes this is a definite category. Let me ask you a question and I would really like an honest response…are any of your children autistic? Specifically the ones you received a shot with? I have interviewed hundreds of women similar to you and I assure you Rho-gam and autism is no coincidence. I’m tired of talking about the guideline for mercury exposure with you. I completely understand how it works, (.1 mcg/kg body weight per day). What is your point, I don’t care how you look at it in regards to two different forms of mercury, or if you eat it or inject it, regardless this guideline is the only one used for any form and you are not supposed to get an entire lifetime of mercury exposure per this guideline in one day are you? Answer this question and you will understand my point. It is about being spread out across time. If I weigh only 1 kg and live for 10,000 days, it is not acceptable to get all of the exposures to mercury that would have been just on the guideline limit each of these 10,000 days in just one single day would it? This would mean I would receive a shot of 1000 mcg (.1mcg/day x 10,000 days) in one day. Actually if I received this on the my 10,000th day it would make perfect sense why I didn’t go on to live another. Do you understand this concept? Moving on, do some research on aluminum and mercury. The toxic combination is not a 1 + 1 = 2. It is much much worse. This is also completely unstudied by your side which is gross negligence since they are both used together in certain vaccines. I’m not sure how your lesson on what thimerosal is addressed my comment that it as a solution is more toxic than ethyl mercury by itself. I have seen experiments done in laboratory on brain neurons that shows this. This is something your side also has no clue about and is also complete gross negligence, not to mention thimerosal has never gone through clinical trials. Would you like to speak about the independent study Eli Lilly did on terminally ill meningitis patients who all died a couple weeks later to prove thimerosal is safe to use in our mandatory vaccine program? I would love to hear your thoughts on that one. I love how you use the term “safely locked away” to refer to amalgams. Ha, you are a dentist you freakin clownshow. I can’t believe you fall into this trap of the ADA and actually believe this. Have you every looked at an amalgam with UV and infrared paper and light and put a mercury vapor analyzer over the top. Try it sometime and gently brush the filling as if you were brushing your teeth and watch the mercury register on the analyzer. Also, you will be able to see the vapors similar to smoke off a cigarette by coincidence I’m sure. You have never done anything like this, that is why you simply do not understand. You are only right about one thing, and that is if you drill them out you are in deep shit. I can’t believe you actually said something that makes sense. And just to add one thing to prove you don’t know much, the mercury in amalagams is elemental mercury, do you research. But then again it does become inorganic once it’s in the body over time just as ehtyl and methyl do. I’m seriously disturbed that you think it is ok for a pregnant mother to breath mercury vapors all day for nine months. Wow, you really are confused. I am starting to have some fun now. I love being challenged and then anhialating you with the truth. You are way to easy Calli. You are the type of people I am looking for on here though. The ones that think you are smarter than you actually are by using big tough words. Notice how I keep mine very simple and roll you right over anyhow. Bye Bye.

Well, this has been fun, I have to go because I’m flying out shortly to interview a PhD in Toxicology this weekend…what are you guys upto beside google searching?

Connect 4 tournament. Sure I can’t interest you in a quick game?

Don’t ban STY Orac, he’s harmless and amusing. Like a dog who thinks it’s people.

nice try, Chris. Smarter Than You just smoked you guys and now you try and make him out to be a danger to Paul Offit. Pathetic.
I do think that Orac shows alot of class for not barring comments. Freedom of speech is alive and well.

Something has been in the making since 2004 that is going to make many dead people roll over in their graves. It will be completed by about October/November 2010, but it may be a little bit after that when you all become very familiar with it. But once you do, you will all finally see where you went wrong, because you most certainly have, and even the worst of the worst of them, such as Paul Offit, will even finally acknowledge just how wrong he was once and for all. Don’t get me wrong here though, I’m not saying vaccines are the culprit. And why do I withhold this from the rest of society? Because until it is complete people such as yourselves could not possibly understand it.

Is the Time Cube guy investigating thimerosal now?

Allow me to register my excitement for some random internet troll’s mysterious and nigh-incomprehensible research, yet to be completed, that may take even longer to release in whatever undoubtedly-legitimate publication, that will set the world straight once and for all!

I’m actually sitting on the edge of my seat as I type this!

Chris, you most certainly did imply that Smarter Than You could be dangerous. If you meant you doubted that someone like Paul Offit would speak with him you would have used alot different wording. Besides being vitriolic and insulting he actually had alot of good points to make about thimerosal.

In this case, only two of those parties, government and industry, are with you, consumer is not. Even basic charities like Autism Speaks do not agree with your views. Even people who’ve served in high leadership positions in public health don’t agree with you,…

No Jake, make that just Katie Wright and Bernadine Healy (avid supporter of tobacco science). And that agreement means nothing for it’s based upon opinion, not facts. Do they have any evidence to support their opinions Jake? Do you?

Chris, his points were not all proven wrong. I will let his last post stand. (#199). I have no idea about Sallie Bernard’s vaccine request.

@jen

You are wrong about Chris. He called STY “strange” [understatement]. He said Offitt receives death threats and assumes he is careful whom he meets. You have assumed Reeses Cups even though the peanut butter and chocolate remained separate.

D+

I’m kind of wondering if SMY is here for a purpose. He keeps all us science types (you know, the ones who can actually mount a coherent argument with facts and peer reviewed literature on their side) occupied while we ignore the mainstream media, where all SMY’s buddies are commenting like crazy.

I guess I’m making a long-winded argument that SMY is a troll. We should be out there making the science-based points with the public. The people who actually count, unlike SMY, with xis/xer borderline psychotic rants.

Fear not, Marc. This was not the first appearance of Smarter Than You, and I suspect it will not be the last.

Yeah he/she/it really blew Calli away with 199

Yeah, sure… the verbal diarrhea of #199 was classic troll phenotype. No breaks, going from topic to topic and the argument by blatant assertion.

So is impersonating other people.

Orac – impersonating other posters is certainly a ban-able offense, yes?

Yes, entirely at my discretion. So, STY, cut it out or you’re out of here. And before you start whining that I’m being unfair, the others who “impersonated” you made it very obvious that it wasn’t you and that they were making fun of you.

You mean that STY is not “flying out shortly to interview a PhD in Toxicology this weekend.” ?

my previous comment from last night seems to have become lost in the shuffle, and buried beneath all of STY’s rants….

could someone please enlighten me: what is a “poe?”

thanks chris!

sooooooo true.

thanks, NJ. obviously i’m not up to snuff on recent internet lingo- i spent most of the last six years or so without the internet, in places where most people would have chopped off an appendage to have the chance to vaccinate their children against polio, measles, mumps, typhoid, etc…

shit, it’s a wonder i haven’t dropped DEAD, what with all the vaccinations i’ve had in the last few years… 😉

Otto, I had to look it up. 😉

This is not Pharyngula.

Oh, snap.

Serious point #1 – while I understand the HHS rationale for issuing the statment regarding anti-vaccine cranks and the media, all it does if feed the conspiracy. Now the media can report on the attempts of the government to “silence” the disease promoters. Remeber the old adage about how any publicity is good publicity.

Serious point #2 – STY is all sorts of crazy.

@195
Callie
Thank you for your smack down of STY. I was going to ask someone to list the reasons he was so wrong. I am pretty new to all of this and, unfortunately I totally know how parents are taken in with these types of arguments. His use of profanity is probably very appealing to confused and angry parents. It is easy to think ‘this guy is fighting the system for us’.

To make it completely clear; I know he is full of it.

Oh yeah, one additional comment:

Jen, if by “Smarter Than You just smoked you guys” you mean “Smarter Than You is a flaming loon”, then I agree. And the fact that you think this individual is making good points illustrates the general unhingedness of anti-vaxers.

I expect J.B. Handley or Jay Gordon to show up any minute now to concur with STY’s ranting.

jen, STY claimed there was still pediatric vaccines with thimerosal up to at least 2004. Yet, Sallie Bernard, the executive director of SafeMinds, could not find any in 2001!

Why? Is Sallie Bernard lying in her message on the Autism-Mercury message board?

@ a-non #244: I can’t believe I’m about to do this…

1 – just because Sallie Bernard is incompetent, that doesn’t mean the backlogs aren’t at least partially fact-based. However, even if the backlog issue was true, there would be no need TODAY to restrict vaccines, and there would have been a corresponding decrease as the surplus vaccines were used up. That is, if thimerosal had been shown conclusively to cause any side-effects, which it hasn’t.

2 – he corrected himself and retracted that intravenous/intramuscular statement. I know it was hard to find the crouton of truth in the word salad, but it was there. Let’s not jump on the poor bastard for making a mistake that he later owned up to.

3 – his argument was that while not compulsory, there is strong social pressure to get flu vaccines which makes them tantamount to compulsory. I don’t disagree with that – in fact normative pressure reinforces a LOT of health behaviour (exercising, eating properly, hygiene). However, there are thimerosal-free flu vaccines available, and there was a lot of media about that fact. Again, that’s only relevant if thimerosal is dangerous… which it isn’t.

The rest of your criticisms are fair. His “smack-down” really consisted of insisting that his own personal interviews and experiments were superior to those of dozens of actual scientists worldwide, working independently and finding converging results. With zero evidence to support his claims, that’s hardly a smoking gun.

Oh, and I see someone is posting under my name (#221). Neat, I am pleased to be visible enough to deserve impersonation. In the future, please be considerate enough to include a link to my blog (to make your counterfeit more believable, of course).

Ah, finally have some time on the Internet again…. And I see Smarter Than You replied! I do love me a good fisking. Alas, I am short of time, as I have a longer drive than usual to collect my children today. But I’ll give it a go anyway. Since my boldface on the last post didn’t show very well, I’ll switch to italics now to indicate STY’s content.

Smarter Than You @ 199:
1) No correction needed…it is common knowledge the AAP and others recommended phasing thimerosal out in 1999, however everyone also knows it was not recalled and backstock lasted until at least 2002 but nobody really knows the exact date.

As I indicated and as you apparently agree, it is understood that backstock lasted until 2002. I am not certain how you conclude from this that it absolutely must, in the absence of data, be assumed to have lasted two years longer than that.

I have personally seen many mercury loaded childhood vaccines with an expiration date of 2004, hence the 2004.

Ah, that’s why. You apparently think that if something expires in 2004, it cannot be used until 2004. That’s a rather strange line of reasoning, I must say. I have a bottle of water that expires in 2012. Do you think I won’t drink it before then?

“Mercury loaded” is, of course, a subjective term. The amount is very small.

Again such a weak response grasping at straws.

Well, you would know.

However I will admit I, out of typing and thinking extremely fast used the words “directly into the bloodstream” which were misleading however the end result is the same, it ends up in the bloodstream. I should have said directly into the body without the somewhat protective mechanisms associated with the digestive system.

I am glad you are willing to admit you misspoke; it shows rare maturity on your part. However, you follow it up with the statement that the bloodstream is equivalent to the rest of the body, a peculiar claim given that a) you earlier complained when I pointed out that the vaccine is not given intravenously (which suggests you know there’s a difference) and b) you also claim that mercury is somehow sequestered in the brain in a manner not reflected by blood mercury levels. Your assertions are contradictory; I hope you can see that.

Also, for you to think that all the mercury has been removed and the rates are still going up is absurd. They have not removed all of the mercury, they have just shifted it all around. I would rather give a 10 or 12 pound baby a mercury loaded shot than give a pregnant women with a .5 pound developing fetus a shot, or better yet two shots with 25 mcg in it.

Even assuming that every last bit of thimerosal in a flu shot taken from a multi-dose vial goes directly to the fetus (rather that being distributed around the woman’s body, which again would contradict your assertion that the bloodstream and the muscles are interchangeable with respect to dosing and toxicity), that would leave the baby with the equivalent of a single (perhaps two, if was recently) vaccines containing Thimerosal. You seriously think that two adult flu vaccines are equivalent, in terms of mercury, to the entire childhood vaccine schedule?

No, they are not merely “shifting it around”. The total amount, even if you assume all of the thimerosal from maternal flu vaccines enters the child, is considerably less than it used to be.

Are you kidding me, you actually think the rate will reduce when we are now giving 50 mcg of mercury to all pregnant women in the regular flu shot and swine flu shot? You are crazy!

Two points bear mention: 1) not all pregnant women will receive either shot, let alone both, and 2) even if they do, it’s still way less thimerosal. You should expect to see *some* effect on the autism rate. We haven’t. You have made no attempt to explain that; instead, you’d rather spout vulgarities.

And that is about the only thing I do hear from you people because you know your epidemiology studies are so flawed you can’t reference them anymore. You all know this and that is why you grab onto the idiotic claim that mercury has been removed and the rates keep going up. Do you know that the latest CDC rate of 1 in 110 was based on 8 year olds in 2006. This means these children were born in 1998, and received the fully loaded vaccines, and also in 2004 started getting the flu shots.

You act as if this is the only data in the entire world that we have to go on. It’s not. You can look at rates of autism in unvaccinated populations (yes, they do exist, and yes, they do have autism), you can look at rates in older autistics, you can look at other countries including ones which removed thimerosal much earlier, and the data all agrees — there is no relationship between the removal of thimerosal and the rate of autism. Look at Norway. Look at the recent study of adults in the UK, which found the rate of autism (diagnosed and otherwise) was very close to the rate in children. Look at the declining rate of mental retardation; it mirrors the increase in autism. Why is that, do you suppose?

Bullshit, read the study and this is still during a very devastating period where they were getting floored after they were born.

There are many studies. Out of curiosity, which one are you referring to?

And to clarify a very important fact, Doctors push these flu shots like they are giving out candy. They don’t wait for you to ask for one, that is hilarious.

That’s an odd thing to say, given that in the first few months of flu season, it is rationed (and was rationed more heavily for 2009 H1N1 due to the lower volume of product available at the time). I’m an asthmatic, and my doctor didn’t recommend it, for me or my children, because they didn’t have enough to give out. They would only give it to people who asked for it.

Now, there were flu clinics, and they advertised their existence. This is quite sensible; how will people know that they can come to you for a vaccine unless they have heard of you? It’s not the same thing as giving them out like candy. Perhaps your doctor is different, and has some “in” with the vaccine manufacturers allowing him/her to stock a lot more than anybody else. I wish I had your doctor.

I had pregnant friends this year that were made to feel guilty they didn’t get one, even though the doctors didn’t even have a thimerosal free version.

Given how many pregnant women died of H1N1 influenza this year, doctors should have been recommending it. But perhaps you think two dead bodies (mother and fetus) is better than autism?

What research are you referring to with the half life of ethyl being 2 weeks vs. methyl 50 days?

You also said it had a half life of 2 weeks (well, more accurately, it’s 18 days in adults and 3.7 in infants), so why are you objecting? I know you claim that somehow ethyl mercury deposits more inorganic mercury than methyl mercury, but that doesn’t makes sense. Ethyl mercury is excreted much faster than methyl mercury, which gives it far less opportunity to break down into inorganic mercury. What about this complicated to you?

You can preach to me all day about your half life shit, but what it ultimately comes down to is how much mercury is in the brain after exposure.

We agree on that. However, you prefer to choose figures which support your hysteria, rather than figures which are actually accurate. That’s your prerogative, but it’s not going to help you persuade anyone. Your line of argument is most suitable for self-justification, not persuasion.

And I see you are just as dumb as Science Mom and you don’t understand the difference between “blood” and “brain”.

And suddenly you realize that the body and the blood are not equivalent when it comes to dosing! I agree; the brain and blood are not the same (though note that both forms of organic mercury cross the blood-brain barrier easily). I’m glad you realize this. Now, could you please explain why you think muscle and blood *are* the same?

Read my post to her.

That’s hardly necessary.

Your comment “Flu shots are not compulsory; children only receive them if the parents request it”, this is the most hilarious statement I have ever heard. Good one, maybe in your fantasy land this is true. Everyone knows they push they flu shots so hard, they almost beg you to get them.

You seem to have difficulty grasping the difference between a recommendation and a requirement. I sincerely hope you do not work in engineering. The only vaccines which are compulsory are those which are on your state’s list for school admission. Influenza vaccines are not on the list, and never have been. And, barring some revolutionary advance in influenza vaccines (such as the invention of a truly generic influenza vaccine), likely won’t be.

I’m not sure why you gave me a lesson on flu shots even though I already know all about them and who makes them. Not sure your point here, but I can assure you 94% of them contain the full 25 mcg.

Really? If you knew all that already, why do you continue to assert that 94% of flu vaccines contain 25 mcg of thimerosal? What I posted contradicts you.

The percentage for the swine flu is even worse.

The swine flu vaccines contain precisely the same inactive ingredients as the regular ones; the only difference is the antigen. You do not know what you claim to know. That is obvious.

As far as you being a Rho-gam mom, yes this is a definite category. Let me ask you a question and I would really like an honest response…are any of your children autistic? Specifically the ones you received a shot with? I have interviewed hundreds of women similar to you and I assure you Rho-gam and autism is no coincidence.

I asked if it was an organization, not a category, since you capitalized it. But no matter.

I am Rh-. I received RhoGAM with both of my children. One is diagnosed PDD-NOS (autism spectrum), and the other is “neurotypical”, as some put it. So from my sample of two, you can’t really draw a conclusion, (Not that it will stop you; you are clearly an expert at drawing conclusions from inadequate data.)

I have no reason to doubt your claim that you have interviewed hundreds of women, but let me ask you something else — do you know how many RhoGAM (and equivalent) shots are given each year? Do you know how many Rh- mothers there are? Does hundreds really exceed the general population rate of autism, or are you merely seeing confirmation bias? Did you try interviewing Rh- mothers whose children are *not* autistic? I doubt that very much — your modus operandi is clearly to form a conclusion and then find evidence to support it. The opposite of science, in other words.

And while we’re on the subject of the rhesus factor, how many Rh- mothers have you interviewed who did not receive the shot? How many dead babies have you found out about? Do you even know what Rh disease of the fetus is?

What is your point, I don’t care how you look at it in regards to two different forms of mercury, or if you eat it or inject it, regardless this guideline is the only one used for any form and you are not supposed to get an entire lifetime of mercury exposure per this guideline in one day are you?

Yes, it’s obvious you don’t care. You have acknowledged that blood and brain are not the same; you have acknowledged that the children are not eating the vaccine; you have acknowledged that it is ethyl mercury and not methyl mercury; you have acknowledged that ethyl mercury is cleared from the blood much faster than methyl mercury — and you still cannot understand why it may be unwise to take the EPA guidelines as an absolute predictor of autism risk?

Also, you seem to have gone from four months worth of mercury to a lifetime of mercury exposure rather easily. That is, of course, entirely consistent with your casual approach to facts.

Of course, there’s another point I haven’t raised before. Have you ever read about mercury poisoning? Actually, real mercury poisoning? It doesn’t result in autism. Why do you think minute amounts of ethyl mercury would cause autism, when large amounts (which do cause harm) do not cause autism?

Moving on, do some research on aluminum and mercury. The toxic combination is not a 1 + 1 = 2. It is much much worse. This is also completely unstudied by your side which is gross negligence since they are both used together in certain vaccines.

If it’s unstudied, what makes you think there’s an affect? Because you want there to be one, so you can have something to be righteously indignant about?

Aluminum adjuvants (which are not used in influenza vaccines, by the way, but I’m sure you would know that if you actually had done the research you claim) are studied, and they are studied in conjunction with everything else in the vaccine. Why wouldn’t they be? What other way could a vaccine possibly be studied than by administering the actual vaccine and observing the effects?

I’m not sure how your lesson on what thimerosal is addressed my comment that it as a solution is more toxic than ethyl mercury by itself. I have seen experiments done in laboratory on brain neurons that shows this.

Okay, if you can’t understand the Nutrasweet/aspartame analogy, I can understand why you remain confused. (Hint: they’re the same thing.)

I love how you use the term “safely locked away” to refer to amalgams. Ha, you are a dentist you freakin clownshow.

Software engineer, actually. But I was working on a chemistry degree before switching majors. That’s why I know you’re full of it. I know about these things. You don’t.

Have you every looked at an amalgam with UV and infrared paper and light and put a mercury vapor analyzer over the top. Try it sometime and gently brush the filling as if you were brushing your teeth and watch the mercury register on the analyzer. Also, you will be able to see the vapors similar to smoke off a cigarette by coincidence I’m sure.

Ah, the classic scam. You’ve fallen for the trap laid by unscrupulous dentists who make extra money by scaring patients into having their fillings replaced. I’ve heard of those tests. They don’t reveal what you think they do.

And just to add one thing to prove you don’t know much, the mercury in amalagams is elemental mercury, do you research. But then again it does become inorganic once it’s in the body over time just as ehtyl and methyl do.

Well of course elemental mercury will become inorganic mercury; it’s fairly reactive. Actually, amalgam fillings contain both elemental mercury and a mercury alloy.

The ones that think you are smarter than you actually are by using big tough words. Notice how I keep mine very simple and roll you right over anyhow. Bye Bye.

Actually, this is how I talk normally. And I don’t think I used very many really big words. It’s definitely good that you stick to simple words, though. Given your difficulty in spelling and understanding and applying them correctly, this is probably wise on your part.

Actually, Dangerous Bacon, while I admit I enjoyed fiskin STY’s post, it is true that if you can make yourself understood at a lower level without compromising meaning, that’s best. Were I actually attempting to educate rather than debate, I would use less big words. (Though I have to think consciously to do that; in addition to my computer science degree, I hold an English major, and so I’m kinda used to big words.)

One need only look to my conversation with bensmyson over in the thread about Robert F Kennedy. I can respect bensmyson, even though I don’t agree with them. (Yes, for those who don’t know, it’s two people — Ben’s parents.) I have serious criticisms of their viewpoint — but not of their clear and abiding love for Ben. Common ground is precious, and I won’t give it up easily.

STY, on the other hand, I think will never have common ground with me, or probably many other people here. He/she seems too invested in righteous indignation to actually discuss things.

@Calli…I shouldn’t respond right now because I have to get up really early for an interview, however your responses to my last response were completely absurd and very confusing because you didn’t talk much sense and you try to spin things in ways that make me think you don’t understand my points. Maybe it’s because your simple mind really needs paragraphs to understand me so I will do that just for you:

First off, you and I will never agree on the duration of backstock used with mercury loaded vaccines. You have no idea where you even get the 2002 figure, in fact to put an end to this subject nobody can confirm the exact date so let’s stop talking about it. It really doesn’t matter if it is 2002 or 2004 because you wouldn’t have seen a reduction in rates anyhow because of the flu shot as I have mentioned before. At least you aren’t as big of an idiot as Chris claiming his email he has from Sallie Bernard proves anything. Chris come on dude, are you serious? That was just her initial email to obtain the vaccines…she had them within 24 hours.

Calli for you to say the amount of mercury doesn’t even compare to the mercury the children used to get is idiotic. Do you know the difference between a 14 pound baby and a .2 pound developing fetus. The effects of mercury on the latter are so devastating in the MOST critical time in the development. ANY amount of mercury exposure at this absolutely critical time in a human life will have catastrophic results. This simply can’t be argued and can’t be compared in any way to getting shots after the child is born because it’s in a completely different league of damage.

Given you are a little slow, I will try to understand that you completely did not interpret my comments on the “directly into the bloodstream” explanation correctly. I corrected myself and said it is injected “into the body”, and I’m sorry to tell you this but whether you want to acknowledge this or not when it is injected intramuscularly it doesn’t simply sit in the muscle and hangout forever like you want to claim. Do you think the muscle is like a balloon that doesn’t release anything into the bloodstream or the cardiovascular system? You are an idiot for making this statement. Get off this one, we all know the mercury ends up in the blood so stop even talking about it moron. And one last time for you because you don’t listen, I don’t give a fuck about the mercury in the blood, it means nothing! You are confusing mercury leaving the blood with mercury actually leaving the body. It does leave the blood readily but it is going into the brain, not leaving the body! Go ahead and think the mercury in the blood is a good indication of what is in the brain, you couldn’t be more wrong. Also, just to clarify a later point of yours, i will try to speak English on this one again for you, Ethyl Mercury enters the brain and quickly converts to the inorganic form which then can’t exit the brain. This right here makes your statement of the blood levels reflecting what is going on in the brain useless. Blood levels clear relatively fast because mercury has a high affinity for fatty tissue (THE BRAIN) and it locks in and doesn’t go back to the blood. Methyl converts much slower so it can be washed in and out of the brain and into the blood and excreted from the body before it converts and locks in. Hence, the end result is more inorganic mercury in the brain from Ethyl exposures than Methyl exposures. THIS IS THE KEY YOU DUMBASS!!!! How many times do I need to tell you this. Do I need to send you Burbacher’s study that proves this? You can’t argue this one so stop trying to spin it and sound like you didn’t pay attention to what I said. This closes this argument, please acknowledge this.

Again, I don’t care if flu shots are mandatory or not, pregnant women are getting them everywhere, TWO OF THEM. I see it everywhere and talk to everyone about it all the time. I live this shit and I see it everywhere, believe it, they are getting them because the doctors tell them they need to and unfortunately for them they are listening and severely damaging their children in the process. We can’t have a discussion on this one because we don’t have an exact stat of how many pregnant women actually get the shot, but I can assure you it is the majority, except for the women that know me. Regardless, the number of pregnant women getting flu shots now far exceeds the number when it was just the Rho-gam moms getting them, and trust me I know Rho-gam does not contain thimerosal anymore so don’t try to spin this shit.

I will tell you one thing, I have lived Autism. I will also tell you another thing, it is worse than the worst nightmare you could ever imagine even having. It will introduce you to a world that you could never in a million years even imagine existed, and put you into a place that is a million times worse than hell. I will not respond to your comment whether it would be better to have autism or death from the swine flu itself.

To touch on the rates, I’m not wasting my time on this one. Your big claim now is that Autism has always been 1 in 110 and there are 1 in 110 adults with Autism and it was just confused for a long time with MR. WOW, you just reached “beyond idiot, absolutely clueless” status. ARE YOU FUCKNG KIDDING ME!!! Show me the 1 in 110 adults with Autism? You will be lucky to find 1 in 5000! Are you one of those Nuerodiverse dipshits? They are the bottom of the barrel just abandoning the only hope of recovery for their children by having such rediculous beliefs that everyone is just a little neurologically diverse. I will laugh at that one all day!!! Everyone now acknowledges, even dumbfuck Insel, that Autism has an environmental component. If for one second you finally come to this conclusion, and the majority of people, even MIND, now understand this, the answer can and is only one fucking thing….MERCURY. If it’s not mercury, it will be the biggest coincidence this planet has ever seen, and whatever the culprit is would have to work identical to mercury in every single possible way.

Rho-gam…Ok now we are getting somewhere! I knew the second you said you were a Mother and had chidren that you had a Autistic child because that would be the only reason we would be talking on here, especially once you said you were a Rho-gam Mom it all clicked. You either have autism or aspergers or you have a child with autism. In this case you have a child. This is absolutely no surprise to me at all. You not only received the Rho-gam shots, you received a flu shot when you were pregnant. I know it’s hard for some people to acknowledge this, but this was devastating to your unborn children, and don’t take it like I’m saying it’s your fault, because it absolutely isn’t. And yes you are right, the majority of Rho-gam moms I have talked to had children with Autism, and had received the shots. However, many of them had multiple children but the only child with Autism was the one that received the in-utero shot. I’ve seen this so many times I lost count. I have never seen the opposite. Not one time have I seen one of these Mothers with multiple children and the ones who received the shot were fine but the one who didn’t is Autistic. I’ve looked everywhere for this. In your case I’m guessing of your two children who received the shots, the one who is PDD-NOS is a boy? And the one who is typical is a girl? It doesn’t have to be this way but it is very common because testosterone plays a huge role in all of this. Please be honest with your answers, not that you owe it to me but it will help with our discussion. Also, which child did you receive the flu shot with, and again don’t just say what you know will be the best to make me look stupid. And yes, I do know a lot about this condition but its not important for this discussion.

Again, yet another comment that confirms you know nothing about this…you clearly don’t understand that there is a huge difference between chronic and acute mercury toxicity. Acute toxicity is large exposures that target the kidneys, liver, etc. Chronic is what we are talking about here and your side does not have even the smallest clue about this. All traditional Western Medicine understands is Acute, and even Paul Offit talks about mercury toxicity from an acute standpoint which is a fatal fatal flaw. You simply can’t compare a one time massive exposure to mercury with slow cummulative exposures over a number of months and years. Chronic exposures target the brain, senses, central nervous system, endocrine system, oh wait…what doesn’t it target! It is absolutely devastating to those who are more susceptible and/or those that have a less ability to excrete due to low levels of sulphur based proteins such as glutathione, cysteine, and metallathione. Autistic children do not have the ability to excrete mercury. It builds and builds and eventually rolls them into the devastating world known incorrectly as Autism. It is simply mercury efflux disorder, or the inability to excrete mercury effectively.

I can tell you every answer you have ever wanted to know in regards to the cause of Autism. Why there are 4 boys to every girl, why the entire epidemic started when it did, why the rates spiked exactly when they did, why some are born with it and others regress, why there are only 1 in 110 at this time that have it and not everyone, why the symptoms are exactly what they are, why there is a delay in onset of symptoms after the “final” exposure before they enter full blown Autism, why one child might have it but the brothers and sisters don’t, etc. etc. etc. Don’t start asking me these questions because I’m probably not going to keep responding on here because this is taking too much of my time and I can’t give all this away right now because it will all be coming out soon. I’m telling you at this point in time I have the answer to every question anyone could ask me, and you will all soon too, just be patient. Trust me having this information nearly kills me because I want more than anything on this world for this devastation to stop so not one more child has to have their life taken away.

In regards to Aluminum and Mercury…this is an easy one, simply read the MSDS sheet directly from Merck and you will see thimerosal is not to be used with or combined with Aluminum. Yet another completely gross negligent act of the CDC. They completely disregard the EPA’s guideline for mercury exposure, and completely disregard any safety testing/clinical trials with thimerosal, and completely disregard that thimerosal and aluminum should never be used in combination. Oh wait, aluminum and thimerosal are used together in all sorts of childhood vaccines. How smart is the CDC exactly? The left hand doesn’t know what the right is doing. Besides this MSDS, ths is well known through a series of experiments but I’m not going to dig them up right now.

Another simple response to you…if you think the thimerosal solution as a whole is the same as plain ethyl mercury I have ran out of bad names for you. Seriously? Please explain? Oh and by the way, by education I received my bachelors degree in, you guessed it, ENGINEERING. And if you took basic chemistry you should know so much more than you do.

Listen very carefully, sometimes I don’t think you interpret the English language very well: Amalgams, when brushed lightly release vapors that you can see…do you understand that so far? When you put the mercury vapor analyzer up over the vapors it registers mercury vapors….HELLO…McFly?!?! Comprendo? This is 110% proof that amalgams are not stable like you and every dumb dentist claim. Vapors are released, they don’t have to be drilled out to be dangerous. This argument is closed.

And lastly, I’m glad you understand amalgams are elemental mercury!!! You should have googled that one first like you do everything else.

I have to say I was expecting much more of a challenging response from you. You are very good at trying to spin what I say or maybe you just aren’t comprehending it right because you are very confused in some of your responses. As a whole though, I am disappointed in the lack of challenge to this latest response. And just to clarify to everyone, many of the above posts are imposters and not me. Yes, I do swear a lot, however I am very intelligent in my thought processes and writing so if it is a bunch of rambline bullshit that makes no sense, it is more than likely an imposter.

To others, Chris you are still writing dumbass shit man, quit embarrassing yourself thinking you made this huge discovery with your lame ass email from Sally Bernard. And to KathArine, I’m not even going to respond to your “challenge”, it’s more than hilarious and such a beginners question, although if you look really hard you will find the response in this post. Sorry for getting all of your panties in a bunch, however its time the truth is spoken.

-Smarter Than You

@Calli…I shouldn’t respond right now because I have to get up really early for an interview, however your responses to my last response were completely absurd and very confusing because you didn’t talk much sense and you try to spin things in ways that make me think you don’t understand my points. Maybe it’s because your simple mind really needs paragraphs to understand me so I will do that just for you:

First off, you and I will never agree on the duration of backstock used with mercury loaded vaccines. You have no idea where you even get the 2002 figure, in fact to put an end to this subject nobody can confirm the exact date so let’s stop talking about it. It really doesn’t matter if it is 2002 or 2004 because you wouldn’t have seen a reduction in rates anyhow because of the flu shot as I have mentioned before. At least you aren’t as big of an idiot as Chris claiming his email he has from Sallie Bernard proves anything. Chris come on dude, are you serious? That was just her initial email to obtain the vaccines…she had them within 24 hours.

Calli for you to say the amount of mercury doesn’t even compare to the mercury the children used to get is idiotic. Do you know the difference between a 14 pound baby and a .2 pound developing fetus. The effects of mercury on the latter are so devastating in the MOST critical time in the development. ANY amount of mercury exposure at this absolutely critical time in a human life will have catastrophic results. This simply can’t be argued and can’t be compared in any way to getting shots after the child is born because it’s in a completely different league of damage.

Given you are a little slow, I will try to understand that you completely did not interpret my comments on the “directly into the bloodstream” explanation correctly. I corrected myself and said it is injected “into the body”, and I’m sorry to tell you this but whether you want to acknowledge this or not when it is injected intramuscularly it doesn’t simply sit in the muscle and hangout forever like you want to claim. Do you think the muscle is like a balloon that doesn’t release anything into the bloodstream or the cardiovascular system? You are an idiot for making this statement. Get off this one, we all know the mercury ends up in the blood so stop even talking about it moron. And one last time for you because you don’t listen, I don’t give a fuck about the mercury in the blood, it means nothing! You are confusing mercury leaving the blood with mercury actually leaving the body. It does leave the blood readily but it is going into the brain, not leaving the body! Go ahead and think the mercury in the blood is a good indication of what is in the brain, you couldn’t be more wrong. Also, just to clarify a later point of yours, i will try to speak English on this one again for you, Ethyl Mercury enters the brain and quickly converts to the inorganic form which then can’t exit the brain. This right here makes your statement of the blood levels reflecting what is going on in the brain useless. Blood levels clear relatively fast because mercury has a high affinity for fatty tissue (THE BRAIN) and it locks in and doesn’t go back to the blood. Methyl converts much slower so it can be washed in and out of the brain and into the blood and excreted from the body before it converts and locks in. Hence, the end result is more inorganic mercury in the brain from Ethyl exposures than Methyl exposures. THIS IS THE KEY YOU DUMBASS!!!! How many times do I need to tell you this. Do I need to send you Burbacher’s study that proves this? You can’t argue this one so stop trying to spin it and sound like you didn’t pay attention to what I said. This closes this argument, please acknowledge this.

Again, I don’t care if flu shots are mandatory or not, pregnant women are getting them everywhere, TWO OF THEM. I see it everywhere and talk to everyone about it all the time. I live this shit and I see it everywhere, believe it, they are getting them because the doctors tell them they need to and unfortunately for them they are listening and severely damaging their children in the process. We can’t have a discussion on this one because we don’t have an exact stat of how many pregnant women actually get the shot, but I can assure you it is the majority, except for the women that know me. Regardless, the number of pregnant women getting flu shots now far exceeds the number when it was just the Rho-gam moms getting them, and trust me I know Rho-gam does not contain thimerosal anymore so don’t try to spin this shit.

I will tell you one thing, I have lived Autism. I will also tell you another thing, it is worse than the worst nightmare you could ever imagine even having. It will introduce you to a world that you could never in a million years even imagine existed, and put you into a place that is a million times worse than hell. I will not respond to your comment whether it would be better to have autism or death from the swine flu itself.

To touch on the rates, I’m not wasting my time on this one. Your big claim now is that Autism has always been 1 in 110 and there are 1 in 110 adults with Autism and it was just confused for a long time with MR. WOW, you just reached “beyond idiot, absolutely clueless” status. ARE YOU FUCKNG KIDDING ME!!! Show me the 1 in 110 adults with Autism? You will be lucky to find 1 in 5000! Are you one of those Nuerodiverse dipshits? They are the bottom of the barrel just abandoning the only hope of recovery for their children by having such rediculous beliefs that everyone is just a little neurologically diverse. I will laugh at that one all day!!! Everyone now acknowledges, even dumbfuck Insel, that Autism has an environmental component. If for one second you finally come to this conclusion, and the majority of people, even MIND, now understand this, the answer can and is only one fucking thing….MERCURY. If it’s not mercury, it will be the biggest coincidence this planet has ever seen, and whatever the culprit is would have to work identical to mercury in every single possible way.

Rho-gam…Ok now we are getting somewhere! I knew the second you said you were a Mother and had chidren that you had a Autistic child because that would be the only reason we would be talking on here, especially once you said you were a Rho-gam Mom it all clicked. You either have autism or aspergers or you have a child with autism. In this case you have a child. This is absolutely no surprise to me at all. You not only received the Rho-gam shots, you received a flu shot when you were pregnant. I know it’s hard for some people to acknowledge this, but this was devastating to your unborn children, and don’t take it like I’m saying it’s your fault, because it absolutely isn’t. And yes you are right, the majority of Rho-gam moms I have talked to had children with Autism, and had received the shots. However, many of them had multiple children but the only child with Autism was the one that received the in-utero shot. I’ve seen this so many times I lost count. I have never seen the opposite. Not one time have I seen one of these Mothers with multiple children and the ones who received the shot were fine but the one who didn’t is Autistic. I’ve looked everywhere for this. In your case I’m guessing of your two children who received the shots, the one who is PDD-NOS is a boy? And the one who is typical is a girl? It doesn’t have to be this way but it is very common because testosterone plays a huge role in all of this. Please be honest with your answers, not that you owe it to me but it will help with our discussion. Also, which child did you receive the flu shot with, and again don’t just say what you know will be the best to make me look stupid. And yes, I do know a lot about this condition but its not important for this discussion.

Again, yet another comment that confirms you know nothing about this…you clearly don’t understand that there is a huge difference between chronic and acute mercury toxicity. Acute toxicity is large exposures that target the kidneys, liver, etc. Chronic is what we are talking about here and your side does not have even the smallest clue about this. All traditional Western Medicine understands is Acute, and even Paul Offit talks about mercury toxicity from an acute standpoint which is a fatal fatal flaw. You simply can’t compare a one time massive exposure to mercury with slow cummulative exposures over a number of months and years. Chronic exposures target the brain, senses, central nervous system, endocrine system, oh wait…what doesn’t it target! It is absolutely devastating to those who are more susceptible and/or those that have a less ability to excrete due to low levels of sulphur based proteins such as glutathione, cysteine, and metallathione. Autistic children do not have the ability to excrete mercury. It builds and builds and eventually rolls them into the devastating world known incorrectly as Autism. It is simply mercury efflux disorder, or the inability to excrete mercury effectively.

I can tell you every answer you have ever wanted to know in regards to the cause of Autism. Why there are 4 boys to every girl, why the entire epidemic started when it did, why the rates spiked exactly when they did, why some are born with it and others regress, why there are only 1 in 110 at this time that have it and not everyone, why the symptoms are exactly what they are, why there is a delay in onset of symptoms after the “final” exposure before they enter full blown Autism, why one child might have it but the brothers and sisters don’t, etc. etc. etc. Don’t start asking me these questions because I’m probably not going to keep responding on here because this is taking too much of my time and I can’t give all this away right now because it will all be coming out soon. I’m telling you at this point in time I have the answer to every question anyone could ask me, and you will all soon too, just be patient. Trust me having this information nearly kills me because I want more than anything on this world for this devastation to stop so not one more child has to have their life taken away.

In regards to Aluminum and Mercury…this is an easy one, simply read the MSDS sheet directly from Merck and you will see thimerosal is not to be used with or combined with Aluminum. Yet another completely gross negligent act of the CDC. They completely disregard the EPA’s guideline for mercury exposure, and completely disregard any safety testing/clinical trials with thimerosal, and completely disregard that thimerosal and aluminum should never be used in combination. Oh wait, aluminum and thimerosal are used together in all sorts of childhood vaccines. How smart is the CDC exactly? The left hand doesn’t know what the right is doing. Besides this MSDS, ths is well known through a series of experiments but I’m not going to dig them up right now.

Another simple response to you…if you think the thimerosal solution as a whole is the same as plain ethyl mercury I have ran out of bad names for you. Seriously? Please explain? Oh and by the way, by education I received my bachelors degree in, you guessed it, ENGINEERING. And if you took basic chemistry you should know so much more than you do.

Listen very carefully, sometimes I don’t think you interpret the English language very well: Amalgams, when brushed lightly release vapors that you can see…do you understand that so far? When you put the mercury vapor analyzer up over the vapors it registers mercury vapors….HELLO…McFly?!?! Comprendo? This is 110% proof that amalgams are not stable like you and every dumb dentist claim. Vapors are released, they don’t have to be drilled out to be dangerous. This argument is closed.

And lastly, I’m glad you understand amalgams are elemental mercury!!! You should have googled that one first like you do everything else.

I have to say I was expecting much more of a challenging response from you. You are very good at trying to spin what I say or maybe you just aren’t comprehending it right because you are very confused in some of your responses. As a whole though, I am disappointed in the lack of challenge to this latest response. And just to clarify to everyone, many of the above posts are imposters and not me. Yes, I do swear a lot, however I am very intelligent in my thought processes and writing so if it is a bunch of rambline bullshit that makes no sense, it is more than likely an imposter.

To others, Chris you are still writing dumbass shit man, quit embarrassing yourself thinking you made this huge discovery with your lame ass email from Sally Bernard. And to KathArine, I’m not even going to respond to your “challenge”, it’s more than hilarious and such a beginners question, although if you look really hard you will find the response in this post. Sorry for getting all of your panties in a bunch, however its time the truth is spoken.

STY:

That was just her initial email to obtain the vaccines…she had them within 24 hours.

Liar. If she had some, then Burbacher would not have had to add thimerosal to the vaccines he used in his primate study.

From the SafeMinds funded Burbacher paper:

Seventeen infant monkeys assigned to the thimerosal group were given the typical schedule of vaccines for human infants (Table 1). Thimerosal (Omicron Quimica S.A., Barcelona, Spain), dissolved in saline, was mixed with thimerosal-free vaccines to yield a final concentration of 4, 8, or 20 μg/mL Hg,
depending on the vaccine and the age of the infant

Ah, STY, darlin;

Hence, the end result is more inorganic mercury in the brain from Ethyl exposures than Methyl exposures. THIS IS THE KEY YOU DUMBASS!!!! How many times do I need to tell you this. Do I need to send you Burbacher’s study that proves this?

No need! It’s free via PubMed. Perhaps this quote from Burbacher would be of interest to you (I bolded the text):

A much lower brain concentration of total Hg was observed in the thimerosal monkeys compared with the MeHg monkeys, that is, a 3- to 4-fold difference for an equivalent exposure of Hg. Moreover, total Hg is cleared much more rapidly from the brain after thimerosal than after MeHg exposure (24 vs. 60 days).

hmmmmmm…..

You can’t argue this one so stop trying to spin it and sound like you didn’t pay attention to what I said. This closes this argument, please acknowledge this.

You first, STY.

STY wharrgarbled:

Your big claim now is that Autism has always been 1 in 110 and there are 1 in 110 adults with Autism and it was just confused for a long time with MR. WOW, you just reached “beyond idiot, absolutely clueless” status. ARE YOU FUCKNG KIDDING ME!!! Show me the 1 in 110 adults with Autism?

here you go.

i nominate jenb for post of the day for her exceedingly apt use of the word “fanfaronade.”

@jenbphillips: hey, jen. Nice to see you back again and posting wonderful information in rebuttal to STY (who I have killfiled so I don’t have to read her GIGO stuff. Your rebuttals and Calli’s are enough to make me happy for Greasemonkey.

P.S. I LOVE wharrgarble…I’ve seen it before but didn’t know where the link was…Thanks!

Wow, jenbphillips FTW!

Why would Bernard be looking for thimerosal containing vaccines if Burbacher planned to add it in varying amounts in the first place.

It looks like she tried to get some, failed. So Burbacher changed his game plan.

How is your fictional trip going? Have you even left your mother’s basement yet?

Actually a couple last things because your stupidity makes me laugh very hard and I need it:

@Jenb… your comment included “A much lower brain concentration of total Hg was observed in the thimerosal monkeys compared with the MeHg monkeys, that is, a 3- to 4-fold difference for an equivalent exposure of Hg. Moreover, total Hg is cleared much more rapidly from the brain after thimerosal than after MeHg exposure (24 vs. 60 days).”

See people like you interpret Science completely wrong…the key words in your post are “TOTAL HG”!!! Your interpretation of the meaning of what you posted is therefore completely wrong because you don’t know the difference between “Total HG” and “Inorganic HG”. It is the inorganic form that causes the severe neurologic complications. I bet you still won’t understand this as it could be confusing to a moron.

@”I don’t know anything about Science Mom”…Your post….”In regards to Aluminum and Mercury…this is an easy one, simply read the MSDS sheet directly from Merck and you will see thimerosal is not to be used with or combined with Aluminum.
Please do share this. Another evidence-free screed of epic proportions. Please provide some supporting evidence.”

You asked me to share the msds dumbass and then you try to back up and say you asked for supporting evidence…You are stupid! So I gave it to you. Read it and wheep. I’m sure after reading it you still think it is ok to inject this neurotoxin into your child. Your poor children have a very dumb mother that puts their lives at risk. You must remember I am an Engineer and I work extensively with MSDS sheets in my career. I am very fluent with reading them so nice try with your “assumption” that I have no understanding of it. It would be really hard to misinterpret this document. What part of Merck’s statement “Violent reactions possible with Aluminum” don’t you get? You simply close your eyes to anything that applies and implicates that we may have a serious problem here. I challenge you to respond to this in your own words and not some article that doesn’t apply. You dodged this one so fast because you knew you were burnt. Your post and response to this was completely moronic and didn’t counter my point or even anything close to it. You and Chris are by far the bottom of the barrel on this blog. ORAC, do you really allow these idiots to comment? They are even an insult to you.

And to re-address the dumbest point on this blog. You and ChriTY are assuming Sallie’s email was specifically for Burbacher’s study. Where did it say that? The toxicologist (also university based) I interviewed on Saturday has also experimented on these exact vaccines with Sallie and others, and so have other researchers such as myself. Show me exactly where she says it is for Burbachers study, because I know of several studies with these exact vaccines that were going on around the same time with other researchers. Also, why would the email only address DTap, this makes no sense if your claim is accurate? What about Hep B, Hib, etc? Again, such a stupid point you have anyhow to try and prove something. You two are the biggest rookie mistake makers on here.

Anyone else notice anything very interesting about the thimerosal msds? I think all of you need to read it so you finally understand the difference between acute and chronic exposures. Find any similarities with the chronic symptoms??? Ha, you might as well just sum it up in one word on the msds…AUTISM!!!! Oh wait, I forgot all you dipshits think Autism is strictly a psychological condition. You couldn’t be any further from the truth. Well, the truth is coming like a freight train and about to run you all over.

Later Morons!

It was not an email, it was a posting on the Autism-Mercury Yahoo group. You are as clueless as the noobies to Usenet who kept thinking they were on the internet, and that posting on Usenet was “blogging.” Like the PeterB who started the whole idiotic Pharma Shill Gambit. I’d think you were PeterB, but he was actually a bit brighter than you (and admitted to selling supplements).

Your thick closed skull cannot also deal with the fact that if Bernard had found thimerosal containing vaccine, then Burbacher (who was being paid by SafeMinds) would not have had to mix up their own.

Now, if you have any real evidence to support your opinions, please share them. Otherwise, just keep your delusions to yourself.

ChrisTY…you are a fucking idiot dudet! So she must have found all of the other vaccines then, because the only one she was asking for was DTaP, yet Burbacher still added thimerosal to all of the thimerosal free vaccines. Dude, get a clue, your “assumption” makes no sense. Shut the fuck up already! Your panties are in the biggest bunch over such an idiotic point.

ChrisTY…you are a fucking idiot dudet! So Sallie must have found all of the other vaccines then, because the only one she was asking for was DTaP, yet Burbacher still added thimerosal to all of the thimerosal free vaccines. Dude, get a clue, your “assumption” makes no sense. Shut the fuck up already! Your panties are in the biggest bunch over such an idiotic point that really wouldn’t prove or disprove anything anyway. You are a little unstable and can’t handle when someone calls you out over something really dumb you have done. Face it and move on.

Does anyone have anything of substance to say? My responses are at least full of substance, profanity sometimes as well but that comes with this condition and the straight up inability to accept ignorance and stupidity.

You people really need to pay attention to @268 and @271. These seemed to have made this “discussion” very quiet all of a sudden.

You responses are full of absolutely nothing but your clueless vitriol. They are just empty rants.

Delusional troll is delusional.

Hey Chris…I will give you a chance to redeem yourself…read the msds sheet I posted on here if you are smart enough to find it. Read it very thoroughly and tell me why you think it is acceptable to inject this into children at rates that far exceed the EPA guideline? Also tell me how it is acceptable to be using thimerosal in vaccines that contain aluminum? And yes, vaccines contain aluminum, I’m positive you didn’t know that. Can you give me your thoughts on this AFTER you read the MSDS very carefully?

Hey Raging Bee Pollen…dude come on, say something that is valid about this issue or at least respond to some of my points? As for the way I talk, I adjust my dimeanor accordingly, and as you see by who I am talking to in here, there is no reason to talk to them like adults. I feel like I am debating the town high school drunks. Not only are they drunk and vulgar, they are not educated on this issue at all. If I was actually talking to educated adults, I would be the most professional person you have ever seen.

@Chris…you fail…you are probably the most clueless person I have ever encountered…what you said is so stupid that you will not even get a response on that from your own side. Keep eating and breathing your aluminum pal!!! Once again you don’t understand the question or the point. Are you in 8th grade chemistry class right now? bye bye

How do you like Jenb now Salk, MI Dawn and Sister Mary? FTW!!!! whooohoooo!

Gosh, everyone, I’m so sorry I left STY unattended for so long. My, he has been fractious!

You will all be happy to know that this is my last post for a while

How many times is that that you’ve threatened to leave, STY? How can we miss you if you won’t go away? You’ve posted NINE TIMES since that statement, by the way, but I hope you’ve enjoyed wallowing in your alternate reality, in which you envision me finding my happy place in the corner after the proper spanking you’ve given me. In actual reality, I have a job that takes precedence over dealing with unstable Dunning-Kruger poster children, and this is the first opportunity I’ve had to respond.
You ranted:

See people like you interpret Science completely wrong…the key words in your post are “TOTAL HG”!!! Your interpretation of the meaning of what you posted is therefore completely wrong because you don’t know the difference between “Total HG” and “Inorganic HG”.

On the contrary, I do know the difference between “Total HG[sic]” and “Inorganic HG[sic]”. The most important difference for the purposes of this discussion is that Inorganic Hg is a component of the values given for Total Hg. Yes, the Burbacher study reported that of the total Hg detected in the brain, a higher percentage of it was inorganic in the thimerosal group vs. the MeHg group. I have not disputed that at any time. However, the total levels were still lower, and were cleared more quickly, in the thimerosal group. There are no data that support your claims that inorganic mercury “locks in [to the brain] and doesn’t go back to the blood”.

Burbacher et al do a bit of bleating and handwaving in the discussion about the purported thimerosal-autism connection, but their findings contribute nothing to this discussion, and of course in the intervening years numerous studies have failed to find any connection. Further, Burbacher et al did not do any sort of functional or histological analyses on these brains, thus everything you have raved on about regarding “severe neurologic complications” is unsupported by this or any other study investigating ethyl mercury in comparable amounts to what WAS injected during the course of the pediatric vaccine schedule. Note the past tense–as you no doubt recall, thimerosal has been removed from the childhood vaccines, and flu shots are also available in thimerosal-free preparations.

One last thing [!!!!] to the utterly dumb Jenb…you just showed me you are a google queen. You simply google all day and think you know everything.

No, I showed you an alternative strategy to your own which seems to consist principally of making shit up, along with a soupçon of freshly picked cherries; namely, citing sources and enabling other people to see and evaluate the background information that has led me to my current opinion on these matters. For someone who likes to crow about how ‘the Science’ is done, you seem regrettably unfamiliar with this approach.

I’m out of time and patience for wiping the drool off your chin, STY. Have a nice evening.

Needs more cowbell.

Hey Science Mom…why do you ramble about pointless shit without a true response to my questions…

You are starting to show your emotional instability a little Science Mom. It appears that I am getting you to lose your composure a little bit. Those who lose their composure lose Allison, I suggest you get it under control.

Elaborate on your msds comment without just stating a worthless opinion. I don’t give a shit what you say Allison Singer, remove the immense bags from under your eyes so you can read the msds and see thimerosal should never be used with aluminum. Good proof behind this one moron!

In regards to Mercury Symptoms…all you understand is acute symptoms dumbshit…just do a little research on chronic and get back to me…maybe autistic kids don’t have sensory issues, or central nervous system issues, or irritability, or maybe they are just perfectly healthy like you all claim? Ha, hilarious, actually distubing sad for your children who could get better if they had parents with brains that would fight for their health.

One other thing…I know many of you doubt some of the things I have claimed that I have done…go ahead and doubt this, but I assure you it is all true. I might be a little crude, but I will not lie to you about something I told you I have done. Take from that what you will and keep acting like I haven’t done things to make yourselves feel better about having done nothing yourselves. You will all see in the end. The clock is ticking you moron high school town drunks.

I’m not feeling the intelligence from you Jenb…

*sad panda*

Needs more cowbell.

ROFL!

Chris just ring the bell around you neck…Jenb good response…David, what you don’t realize is I adapt to my environment. Who are you again? And what do you know about the cause of Autism? STFU huh, are you a 13 year old girl (tween) and this is how you talk? I’ve never heard of a 13 year old girl named David…strange.

Wow, the responses have come down to this huh…you all are much too easy to defeat. I was waiting for this time when your responses were as silly and meaningless as these.

I think it is sad how trivially easy it is to overpower Smarter Than You with my superior intellect. Frankly, I’m surprised this individual (probably a teenage girl skipping the school she desperately needs) has managed to type so much on a keyboard that must function poorly when pounded upon by pudgy fingers coated with a gummy residue of Cheetos and drool.

I know it’s not socially appropriate to point out intellectual deficiencies in one’s antagonists, but I worry for the safety of Smarter Than You, someone who is clearly taken to suboptimal health choices. My guess is that Smarter Than You is snorting pulverized lead paint chips…this would explain the irritability, aggressiveness and severe learning problems.

Although it’s not sporting to pick on the blithering cretin, I enjoy exalting in my nonpareil intellectual capacity. It’s fun to win, and I have completely and utterly destroyed this maundering simpleton without even trying. Since I have repeatedly eviscerated my distended dullard of a sparring opponent, I bid adieu to Smarter Than You and her risible attempts at conversant English. Keep up that typing, sweetheart: practice makes perfect!

“You will all be happy to know that this is my last post for a while”

Promises, promises…..

I am impressed at how quickly STY (the alleged engineer) pulls out the MSDS for thimerosal, as if this is some innovative argument rather than one of the more common talking-points made by the mercury militia. Clearly he/she/it is just as ignorant of the difference between industrial exposure and vaccines as he/she/it is of the difference between vaccines and dietary exposure. (Here’s a little hint: when you get a dental x-ray, the technician leaves the room to avoid radiation exposure. Yet you are allowed to be exposed? What’s up with that? Simple. While your dose greatly exceeds the recommended daily allowance for a dental technician, you’re only getting that once every year or so, whereas he/she would be getting it several times a day. As with mercury exposure, if it’s kept occasional, your body is more than capable of dealing with it. Which perhaps explains why our species has actually survived on this planet. To hear the Age of Autism folks talk, you’d think our species should’ve gone extinct about a million years ago.)

I am also amused by the way the individual has, several times, dismissed opposing evidence as something someone googled, when it is fairly obvious that STY has an extremely shallow understanding of these concepts — as befitting someone who’s education might actually be *improved* by Google, since at the moment, STY’s arguments are essentially what is typically spoonfed by the mercury militia rather than anything he/she/it is likely to have discovered independently. “The MSDS for thimerosal says you need to take special precautions! OMG! And we inject it into our babies!” Well, yeah. You have to take special precautions when handling table salt too. Out of context, it means nothing.

Damn, you guys have idiotic comebacks, and again nothing at all that counters anything I have said…

The reason I have been so focused on the ehtyl mercury and msds is because they are two of the most elementary points of the whole issue and you guys can’t even dispell them other than your stupid insults that you claim I am such a “bad person” for doing right back to you. These are only two of literally hundreds of points and Science I can throw back at you but I simply can’t move on from these two because you have simply not addressed them. I have battled people like you for a long time, but you guys have been the least educated and had the fewest decent responses to anything I have said. I’m not going to even try to throw anything more complicated your way because you don’t even comprehend or understand the most simple pieces. I think even the dumbest of dumb Christschool and Kevin Leitch have given me more of an effort and that is sad. But eventually they ended up just losing their composures as well and all they had left was….”well well well ummmmm your mom!” Thats exactly the stage that you are all at and we barely skimmed the surface. The two most basic things you just try to shrug off as if it means nothing. You must all be associated with the CDC, they are known for this type of thing. I advise you all to open your fucking eyes!!!

Maybe you should go out for once in your life and talk to someone like Burbacher who has studied mercury for many many years. You will hear it directly from him too that ethyl mercury de-ethylates into the inorganic form which locks into the brain and induces an inflammatory response (inflammation) in the brain.

If I _were_ to talk to Burbacher, I might ask him what he means by “the inorganic form” of mercury. What ligands is he actually talking about? He couldn’t seriously mean mercury(0), because there aren’t that many reducing agents around, are there? What are the redox potentials?

Was that really Kevin Champagne? Dude, say “hi” to the Cajun Cowboy the next time Buttar butters you up.

Just finished a little research. I was at the library (yes, I actually do go to the library, Google is not everything) and read an article in the magazine Scientific American (I also checked out three books, one being a biography of Paul Dirac, and a Doctor Who DVD, “The New Doctor”).

It was the Evolution of Minerals. This is where I learned that the most abundant minerals on the earth’s crust are feldspars, about 60%.

Now, doing a bit more research on feldspar in wikipedia and the World Book Encyclopedia on our bookcase I find out that all feldspars contain silica and alumina (yeah, that is aluminum). The three main chemical compounds are KAlSi₃O₈, NaAlSi₃O₈, and CaAl₂Si₂O₈.

Notice how all three of them have these letters: Al ! Yep, that is aluminum. It is in the soil that you grow food in. It is part of the dust you breathe when the wind blows.

My encyclopedia says feldspar is used in making glass, ceramics and paper. A clay that is created when fledspar weathers, Kaolinite, is used to make fine china. The chemical makeup of Kaolinite is Al₂Si₂O₅(OH)₄. Who is now afraid of Grandma’s fine china?

So other than finding another planet to live on, how would you avoid ingesting and breathing in aluminum?

Chris,
As someone with a bachelor’s degree in geology, I have found the panic over aluminum highly amusing. You understate it a bit: “clay”, technically defined, has aluminum in it. Hence, a kid who eats a mouthful of mud could easily ingest more aluminum than would be in a thousand vaccines.

Also, a bit of randomness, that I think could sum up a philosophy for many here: “Ours is not to rule the Earth. We just clean up the mess.”
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/5777397/11/Shoe_shopping

please see my article on vaccines, chelation, and recovery at http://www.examiner.com/x-43538-DC-Autism-Examiner~y2010m4d26-Autism-advocate-Lyn-Redwood-discusses-mercury-vaccine-controversy-chelation-treatment-and-recovery. Of note is that Redwood had Gamulin injections while pregnant. Interestingly, a second mother of a child with autism I interviewed had the same thing.

As someone with a bachelor’s degree in geology, I have found the panic over aluminum highly amusing. You understate it a bit: “clay”, technically defined, has aluminum in it. Hence, a kid who eats a mouthful of mud could easily ingest more aluminum than would be in a thousand vaccines.