The invasion of well-meaning quacks into West Africa continues apace, part three

I stay away from the stores this weekend, too.

There is plenty of leftover food for the sons to enjoy. One just fixed himself a breakfast of turkey, mashed potatoes and gravy!

But, I may have to brave at least one store to get some parts to fix my wife’s computer 🙁

Orac, you’re not old- you’re SEASONED**.

-btw- you appear to be remarkably well-preserved*** which ( as I know only too well due to intense observation of myself and various cohorts and relatives) is either a mark of purity of intention or sun avoidance. Possibly both.

** insert mandatory reference to appropriate herb/spice
*** insert obligatory reference to formaldehyde etc

I’m surprised I didn’t think to look for this predictable passenger on the EVD bandwagon earlier: CBD Protective Against Ebola Virus.

Because cannabis is so very safe especially under doctor supervision, I believe it is crucial for the medical community to start human trials on survivability of Ebola infected patients regardless of the political restraints.

The author of this Vice piece seems rather taken with Dr. Richard Hiltner

Not so much with accurate details, though:

“The Ebola virus kills you by essentially dissolving the walls of your veins, making you bleed to death from the inside in a massive internal hemorrhage.”

Dave, have a look at this:

http://transgallaxys.com/~kanzlerzwo/index.php?topic=8275.msg19303#msg19303

Already in August 2014 (or even earlier) the WHO rejected homeopathy and other “alternative” nonsense because such quackery had led ebola infections to cross the border of guinea and caused the outbreak in Sierra Leone!

The mechanism of quackery to spread the disease already at that time was known, and warnings were made just because of that.

To go to Africa to spread homeopathy is nothing else but to go there and spread ebola. No one involved can push aside the guilt. No one!

Further: The people in Africa suffer from a disastrous shortage of medicaments and medical personnel. The LMHI and other homeopaths’ organizations and persons involved do know that, and they aggressively exploit the emergency situation of the Africans.

The Africans grab for the last straw. They MUST keep a smiling face despite knowing that they are defrauded. The Africans die. To abuse and exploit dying people is one of the worst crimes ever.

This crime is committed by leading German homeopaths. They do know what they do. And they WILLFULLY do it. And they go on doing it. They already prepare a second “expedition” to Africa.

Homeopathy is murder.

As already is pointed out: The whole intent of the homeopaths was to “prove” homeopathy works, and then boast with their “success”. They wanted to commit a fait accompli, like they did in Haiti. Edouard Broussalian, now one of the four, was in Haiti in 2011, extra, with other homeopaths, to apply homeopathy to the cholera-stricken patients. Later he boasted with a grand success. But fact is: he defrauded.

Broussalian wrote an article about the Haiti incident. This is the translation to English (there also is one to German, hosted on an esoteric sales web-site), saying:

[*quote*]
———————————————-
“at the end of our stay, we were no longer providing new patients with an
infusion, but immediately gave them the phosphorus spray.”
———————————————-
[*/quote*]
more:
http://ariplex.com/folia/archives/833.htm

The standard claim of homeopaths is do be “complementary”, “in addition” to “school medicine”. But one can see here that this claim is a lie. The standard treatment is willfully denied, and instead a homeopathic “spray” is used. I never before read of such a thing as a homeopathic spray.

It is a good idea to delve into the previous “heroic deeds” of Broussalian, Durge, Hiltner and Lindemann.

Broussalian already messed up in Haiti.
Hiltner messes up with astrology to choose homeopathic remedies.
Lindemann is an antivaxxer, and Broussalian also hates vaccines.

Number 4 of the gang is a special case: a “doctor of homeopathic medicine and surgery” – or something else of the sort. But no REAL medical doctor.

Check out her professional (?) education (?). she was on a college in India which produces bachelors, but not medical doctors. Here someone has done some footwork:

“Indian PM appoints Minister for Genocide”
http://ariplex.com/folia/archives/851.htm

The catch is: these homeopaths have no education in pharmacy, only in homeopathy. So Medha Durge neither is a qualified medical doctor nor is any of the 4 qualified with having experience with handling epidemics. They just DO NOT HAVE a qualification for the task.

As a comparison: two member of the Universitätsklinikums Bonn (Germany) will go to West Africa to do some research there. Look at THEIR expertise:

http://transgallaxys.com/~kanzlerzwo/index.php?topic=8375.msg19305#msg19305

THAT is a big difference, I dare say.

The Daily Mail has two articles online about the Ganta incident, with the second one showing a photo the house front of Durge’s “medical office”. It looks more like a shabby peddler’s hut than a medical office.

So we have 4 homeopaths, not being qualified for the task, willed to do homeopathy, supported by unknowing donors who were cheated into believing that a) the group members were fully qualified medical doctors who b) would do sound medical work.

This leaves a broad range of questions to ask the people in the background:

the LMHI
the “Freunde Liberias”
the Honorary Consul of Liberia in Leipzig, Michael Kölsch,
leading members of the Deutscher Zentralverein homöopathischer Ärzte (DZVhAe)
the head office of the United Methodist Church in the USA
the mission office of the United methodist Church in Liberia
the administration of the hospital of the United methodist Church in Ganta

Who pulled the wires between the LMHI and the DZVhAe? Who enabled the whole thing in Ganta?

Look: The idea was created in some places AND THEN escalated in the LMHI and the DZVhAe. AND THEN the homeopaths knocked on whose door? On the door of the Honorary Consul, because he is married with the treasurer of the DZVhAe, who not only is doing homeopathy. No! Monika Kölsch offers “Telehomöopathie”, something which I consider in essence to be nothing but the (of course) forbidden distant healing (my dictionary does not know an English expression for that).

Putting together the puzzle you can follow the first discussions and talks in web forums, then calls for support and money, even newspaper articles in German newspapers, asking for donations. AND in the background things are routed via the Leipzig connection to Ganta. Why Ganta? Because Michael Kölsch has connections.

If you dig deeper you will find a Siegfried Ziegler mentioned, who is a retired hospital manager in Chemnitz. Bingo! Ziegler was in that very hospital in Ganta from 1974-197 as CEO. So it is he who had the FIRST contact, it is he who has since then had the strong contacts with politicians in Liberia.

If someone retires in 2012, short over 60, how old was he in 1974? How do all these pieces fit together? Very simple: Siegfried Ziegler is a member of the Methodist Church.

The whole affair is a combination of a church reaching from the USA to Liberia, and of homeopaths having contacts all around the globe, from USA and India deep into the heart of Europe, BOTH GROUPS being trained in fiddling behind the curtains AND in cheating with language AND in covering up.

See the reactions now: nothing but a try to cover up. Their fait accompli was crushed the very moment some receivers of the LMHI emails published the email by Ortrud Lindemann, laying open the real intentions, and showing not only the names of the four, but also the names of the background eminences.

Look at Michael Kölsch’s description how he went to Liberia in 2012:

“Bericht über eine Unternehmerreise nach Liberia im März 2012”
http://www.liberia.michaelkoelsch.de/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Bericht_ueber_eine_Unternehmerreise1.pdf

The important part:

[*QUOTE*]
—————————————————–
In der Gerlib Klinik treffe ich mit fast 30 minütiger Verspätung ein, was mir Leid tut. Man erwartet mich am Eingang und begleitet mich zu Frau Gieraths-Nimene, der Gründerin und Eigentümerin der Klinik. Ich treffe eine sehr beeindruckende Deutsche, die mich herzlich begrüßt und mir gerne Ihre Klinik präsentiert. Ich sehe wartende Kranke in einem neu gebauten Gebäudekomplex, eine verletzte Frau, die soeben einen Autounfall hatte, in einem anderen Raum ist eine junge Frau dabei ,Zwillingen das Leben zu schenken, in wieder einem anderen Behandlungsraum liegen Malariapatienten. Zwei wichtige medizinische Geräte sind defekt was problematisch ist, da es noch keinen medizinischen Wartungsdienst in Monrovia gibt und eine Reparatur in Deutschland zeitaufwändig und teuer ist. Frau Gieraths-Nimene hat die Klinik vor dem Krieg zusammen mit ihrem Liberianischen Ehemann gegründet. Nach dem Tod ihres Mannes führt sie das Haus alleine. Es freut mich, dass sie der Homöopathie sehr aufgeschlossen gegenüber steht.

Sie teilt meine Auffassung, dass die Homöopathie eine geeignete Heilmethode sei, um damit das Gesundheitswesen in Liberia zu ergänzen. Sie ist preiswert und die Offenheit der Liberianischen Bevölkerung für alternative, sanfte Heilmethoden darf unterstellt werden. Wenige Tage nach meiner Abreise werden die „Homöopathen ohne Grenzen“ aus Deutschland zusammen mit Frau Gieraths-Nimene Liberianischen Ärzten in Monrovia die Homöopathie vorstellen
—————————————————–
[*/QUOTE*]

In short:
A native German woman married a Liberian and both founded a clinic in Monrovia, which after the husbands death is run by the woman alone.
Some few days after Michael Kölsch’s leave there the “Homöopathen ohne Grenzen” (the German branch of the “homeopaths without borders”) will present homeopathy to Liberian doctors in Monrovia.

Do note:

“Sie teilt meine Auffassung, dass die Homöopathie eine geeignete Heilmethode sei, um damit das Gesundheitswesen in Liberia zu ergänzen.”
(“She shares my opinion that homeopathy is a suitable medical treatment to complement the health care system in Liberia.”)

So Michael Kölsch is an active proponent for homeopathy, pushing homeopathy. And it can be guessed about his role in paving the way for the homeopaths without borders.

Is it possible that in 2014 a Honorary Consul for Liberia is NOT aware of the ebola epidemics in Liberia? Oh, he is aware of it. He organizes help.

Now, if someone has these strong connections that he has, and is so well connected with people in medicine and politics, does this man NOT know about the WHO ruling out homeopathy?

There are pants on fire in Leipzig, this we can be sure of…

There’s got to be that day that conventional medicine will respect homeopathy—both have their strengths, both have their weaknesses; they need to stop calling each other names.”

This “we’re-all-part-of-the-identity-smorgasburg” schtick is very old and very annoying. Medicine is being treated like different ways of making turkey stuffing. I like cornbread, you don’t. “No right, no wrong; just different. Why can’t our critics see that?”

Because you’re making objective claims of fact, not expressing personal preferences, that’s why. But this Identity Smorgasbord framework and its easy appeals to tolerance and “respect” plays well for people who want to duck accountability.

Brook, that’s exactly the sort of thing my own offspring would say!

Sastra, what you say is precisely true in regards to the anti-vaccine movement: they go as far to say that those who disagree with them are agents of malfeasance, paid shills and deserve to be behind bars.

@ Jenora Feuer:

You don’t have much of a choice- memory is associative.

Narad @6 — What is “EVD”?

Narad @6 — What is “EVD”?

Ebola virus disease. The longer I look at this, the more incoherent it seems. The seeming breakdown in David R. Allen’s command of the English language toward the end doesn’t help much. If anyone can convert the VEGF bit into something resembling coherent thought, I’d be fascinated.

It was actually at this point that I resorted to verification of his license, which is fine. And he went to UCLA, which makes his Web site all the more pathetic. Check this out:

“Our bodies contain a natural magnetic field, created by the flow of electrically-charged ions in and out of our cells and by the transmission of electrical impulses through the membranes of our cells.

A deficiency of electromagnetic force in our bodies creates a situation similar to running out of oxygen….

“With almost 90% of the earth’s electromagnetic field having been lost, … it is no wonder that many people’s bodies have become highly toxic and are functioning well below optimal capacity [sic].

With respect to the Strategic Helium Electromagnetic Reserve, though, I suppose knowing that this is also a Young Earth Creationist line won’t take up too much mental space.

Who is David Allen?
Australian-born musician. Leading force behind Gong and Invisible Opera Company of Tibet. Flying teapots and pothead pixies are involved.

‘“With almost 90% of the earth’s electromagnetic field having been lost, … it is no wonder that many people’s bodies have become highly toxic and are functioning well below optimal capacity [sic].’

HA! Wouldn’t that result in rather more serious problems than people being “toxic” and “functioning well below optimal capacity”? Like, y’know, losing our upper atmosphere and all the consequences of that?

^ Or this.

Our bodies contain a natural magnetic field, created by the flow of electrically-charged ions in and out of our cells and by the transmission of electrical impulses through the membranes of our cells.

Oh great, another case of not-even-wrong physics from a physician. It’s true that moving electrical charges will produce a magnetic field, but let’s look at orders of magnitude. Even if these things are consistently moving in the same direction (unlikely), you are talking about something on the order of a microampere per square meter. (That would be about 60 ions per second moving through a spherical cell 1 μm in radius.) Per Ampere’s law, that gives you a magnetic field of around 1 microtesla, but arranged in a loop around the current, so it doesn’t amount to much (especially once you average out the currents, which in a healthy body almost certainly average out to near zero). The Earth’s magnetic field is about 30 microtesla at the magnetic equator, and twice that at the poles, but it is a much larger scale phenomenon. Add the fact that the sorts of fluids you find in a body are highly collisional (i.e., an individual particle doesn’t get very far without interacting with another particle), which means that the frequencies with which those ions collide are much larger than any frequencies associated with that magnetic field. I’d say you can neglect the effects of any bodily magnetic field, at least under normal circumstances.

I don’t know enough about paleomagnetism to judge his claim that the Earth has lost 90% of its magnetic field, but I would take that claim with a large grain of salt.

@ama
While I don’t entirely disagree with the general gist of your comment, I take offense to your tone about Africa. We are not a bunch of primitives. It’s that kind of fallacious assumptions that underlie faulty critical thinking. (Forgive me if my reaction is out of line. I read less than a quarter of your comment, since I am wary of obsessive ranting comments that are longer than the articles to which they refer.)

JP@37 — Searching around a bit I found that Prothero, who wrote the paleomagnetism article you linked to, has a book called Reality Check that takes up causes near and dear to many readers of this blog. As it so happens, the geomagnetic field is his own specialty, so he writes with particular authority.

As the snooty waiter says, “good choice!”.

palindrom @38 – I haz mad information filtering skillz. I’m no scientist myself – well, I’ve studied some linguistics. Just a Ph.D. candidate studying Russian, Ukrainian and Polish poetry. If there’s one thing academic training in any discipline gives you, though, it’s a recognition of the importance of sources and credentials. (Well, it should, anyway.)

If I don’t get a decent job in academe – no adjuncting, please! – which is a real possibility, I’ve had thoughts of starting some kind of educational program for kids/teens on just basic critical thinking and information filtering. In the Internet age, it’s more and more a necessary skill – there’s just so much nonsense out there.

JP@40 — By coincidence, I came across this very interesting piece that dovetails nicely with what you say. He’s focusing on climate science, but the points he makes are much more general, and very relevant to almost every discussion here on RI.

Highly recommended.

Groan.

Shay@44: Look who’s talking! (cf #21)

The degree is usually a double bachelor in medicine and surgery (MBChB or similar). The knowledge requirements of the 5-6 year professional degree is the same as the US professional MD.

Durge’s WankedIn profile is here (note that the claim to an [Indian] MD isn’t backed up). She attended the Chandaben Mohanbhai Patel Homeopathic Medical College, which awards the BHMS degree.* This is a 4.5 year program (PDF) with only a secondary-school prerequisite.

Perhaps it has the same scope of practice as an MBBS in India, but it sure doesn’t look to be equivalent to a USian MD/DO. It also doesn’t seem to allow entry into a surgical specialization:

[hpathy.com]/ask-homeopathy-doctors/information-about-bhms-course/

The “Introduction to Normal Psychology” section has some good bits, though:

“(c) Mesmar and his theory, Hypnotism structure of consciousness.
“(d) Fraud and his theory-Dynamics of the unconscious. Development of the Libide.”

* And note that Durge also claims an MD with seemingly no further education to back it up.

^ Should’ve trimmed out the text that the footnote was meant to replace.

Shay: “Groan.”

I was amused with by “What, you guys have never heard of a full-bird colonel?” comment. But, then again, my dad only made it to Lt. Col.

Though at least his hat was embroidered with “scrambled eggs.”

I have many writing styles. Some I copy and some copy me.

You better check who Batra is.

^ This at least clarifies that a BHMS does not have the same scope of practice as an MBBS, which pretty much takes care of Durge’s credentials.

See? Simple.

The whole thing is very interesting because that text deals with an article written by India’s best-known homeopath, a Dr. Batra. Batra opposes the new laws which would add a voluntary 1-years course in pharmacy – to allow the homeopaths passing that exam to apply “allopathy.

@palindrom
November 30, 2014
#63

Batra does not have a point. They key to Batra’s tirade is one tiny statement, so tiny one does not realize its REAL meaning. Batra complains that homeopathy will lose its “charm”. Batra wants to maintain the magic and the wizardry.

Look at the situation: a homeopath does nothing else but waffle day and night, and delude patients, and rip them off with usesless crap. AND THEN the homeopath ON THE OTHER HAND uses some rotten, stinky,. diabolic “alloopathic” pills, …………………………… and the patients gets REALLY well again, in short time.

THAT is Batra’s real problem: the delusions won’t work anymore because patients now can COMPARE, AND FEEL that scientific pharmaceutical medicaments do work. Homeopathy immediately would collapse.

Batra does not whine for nothing. He owns several hundred homeopathic offices in India. They will go down the drain once people realize how he defrauded them over the last four decades.

Batra even used market research company Nielsen to make a “study” to boost his sales. That is a really mean imperialistic and capitalistic westerner trick.

THAT is Batra’s real problem: the delusions won’t work anymore because patients now can COMPARE, AND FEEL that scientific pharmaceutical medicaments do work. Homeopathy immediately would collapse.

You misunderestimate the power of suggestion, confirmation bias, and all that. In the west, people have access to all kinds of meds, but many still gravitate to homeopathy.

Most of ’em have the kind of chronic complaints that conventional medicine tends to do poorly with, especially when doctors are overworked. Naturopaths of various persuasions tend to make a big fuss over the patient, which undoubtedly helps them feel better. Add to this the tendency for many conditions to resolve on their own, and you’ve got yourself a business model.

Though not necessarily an effectual treatment.

palindrome @42 – That article was rad. Thanks.
ebrillblaiddes @ 45 – It’s really just a notion of a pipe dream at this point in time; I still have a dissertation to finish writing and a couple of years of funding, at least, to do it.

@palindrom
November 30, 2014
#66

Wrong. You look from your western point of view. But India is a terribly poor country. One of the details of the articles is the remark WHY the homeopaths are pushed: because there are not enough scientific medical doctors. To fill this need politics pushes homeopaths in. The same we had some decades ago in China. Remember the barefoot-doctors? It is always the same problem: not enough doctors and not enough medicaments. To keep the people quiet politics sends out surrogates.

In China the situation bettered, and, guess what: people want scientific medicine. They would be astonished to see how the westerners want “traditional Chines medicine”. Because there is none. All that stuff was an invention by Mao.

The Chinese do want pharmaceutical efficacious medicaments. The do know the difference. In India the situation will develop the same way. Right now there is a vacuum. But once pharmaceutical efficacious medicine is available (the pills and the doctors to hand them out) people will want them.

You underestimate the high criminal energy of the homeopaths. They treat EVERYTHING only with homeopathica, including lethal infections and diseases. How about homeopathy for asthma? Is lethal. How about homeopathy for poisoning? Is lethal. And so on, and so on.

People will see the difference. One only has to GIVE them the medicine.

Of course there always will be idiots, like in the west, who rather die than get a vaccination. But India has several hundred million citizens. Idiots are expendable.

But once pharmaceutical efficacious medicine is available (the pills and the doctors to hand them out) people will want them.

I don’t doubt it. Some years ago in India I remember seeing an advertisement for a ‘fruit beer’ promising it was made with “all artificial ingredients”. The irony of people in the west wanting ‘natural’ ingredients while those in India wanted the exact opposite was not lost on me.

That said, India has no shortage of wealthy middle class worried well who are just as vulnerable to placebo effects of homeopathy as their western counterparts. Homeopathy works well for some imaginary illnesses, it’s the real ones it’s useless for.

One of the details of the articles is the remark WHY the homeopaths are pushed: because there are not enough scientific medical doctors. To fill this need politics pushes homeopaths in.

Is anyone mandating the bridge training? (One might also wonder whether you share a “western point of view,” given the translations from German.)

In the U.S., naturopaths are enthusiastic about trying to gain prescriptive privileges, precisely because it varnishes what they crave – being respected as “real doctors.”

What you seem to be describing is the reaction of a single high homeopathic muckety-muck, Batra, to try to convince people with a BHMS not to do it. This presupposes his realization that, rather than being “pushed,” they may well be all to eager for the extra luster.

By the way, are you going to cop to the fact that the mere presence of the word “bachelor” doesn’t mean what you’ve insisting it does? The Indian equivalent of a USian MD is an MBBS: “Bachelor of Medicine and Bachelor of Surgery.”

Given the amount of time it took for the distinction to be clarified, with no deliberate effort on your part, it seems like a useful discriminator between your actually being engaged in an exchange and your merely promoting an idée fixe.

@Mrs Woo
November 30, 2014
#73

Homeopathy is based on religion.

A common item of many “nature” nuts is the belief that for each illness nature has a herb to cure it. This is based on the insane idea that man is made by god, and because god is benign, he MUST have made something to help man.

That the very same god made all the misery and death, is ignored. That god PLANNED EACH AND EVERYTHING, including pain and death, is ignored.

As JP and Mrs Woo note, altie balderdash appeals to both ends of the political spectrum- what’s really amazing is when woo-meisters attempt to simultaneously address the deepest desires of the left whilst catering to the righties’ fondest dreams-

and yes, I’ve seen it happen @ PRN, Natural News, AoA and TMR. G-d knows how but they do it!

Freedom, Nature, Independence and Spirituality are amongst the cachphrases promoted- harkening unto a time prior to the rule of the nasty corporations and the corrupt police state. Either g-d’s green earth or Gaia’s realm.

You AGAIN show a severe lack of understanding the situation.

No, you’ve just perfectly clarified which of the two presented options applies.

HTH. HAND.

JP – Very interesting about the Jehova’s Witnesses. Thanks for, uh, testifying.

once pharmaceutical efficacious medicine is available (the pills and the doctors to hand them out) people will want them.
Wiki: In 2013, there were 4,655 pharmaceutical manufacturing plants in all of India. Plenty of drugs in India, and paying patent fees for that production has not been a major concern, so they’re *cheap* drugs. If people can’t get them, or can’t be sure that the pills they’re paying for are actually what they’re labelled as, there must be other factors at play.

I’ll give Batra one thing: He at least presents a direct challenge to Dullman. What on earth the Nobel Prize being referred to for “Piler light therapy” is supposed to be remains obscure to me.

@JP – yes, fringes, or… the more fringe-y of some congregations. I do not agree with many teachings in Mr Woo’s church (they would be considered an independent, but loosely associated congregation). I was saddened to overhear at the end of the adult class (I am the pianist and snuck in quietly at the other end of the Sanctuary before they finished) a mother suggesting that if we taught children nothing but Scripture and made sure they knew evolution, etc., were nothing but “lies” that we would be more likely to retain our young adults in church. The class ended before she could further expand on that – I am suspecting she probably would have encouraged any with younger children who could to home school to completely “protect” them from “all those lies that keep them from the truth.”

People like that really worry me. I am glad they are not a majority anywhere.

The “Law of similars” is not by Hahnemann. It is much older. He read about it in a book, dated 1738.

This is (a) wrong and
(b) completely irrelevant to my argument that the Law of Similars is different from the Doctrine of Signatures (you invoke the latter as the supposed religious foundation of homeopathy).

Hahnemann in the organon talks mentions god several times. You can look it up here: http://www.ariplex.com/ama/ama_org6.htm

I suspect that most pioneers of mainstream medicine also mention god several times. This does not mean that mainstream medicine is a religion.

HDB on the doctrine of signatures

The latter dates back to Imperial-era Greeks, who did not see it as the result of divine design.

However, Flora Brand Herbal Teas have the following printed on the box.

For every disease we know God allows a herb to grow.

Along with moxibustion.

I am my son’s Sunday school teacher. There is a list of things I tell him to ignore.

@Mrs. Woo – That’s good.

@Johnny – I agree. I can’t follow the thread here – is she arguing for or against homeopathy?

I find myself unable to follow you argument.

Could you spell it out in simple terms?

Allow me: “ama and the Putnam Groove identity it refuses to cop to are infallible in every detail.”

ama — I don’t think you need to persuade regular readers of this forum that homeopathy is bunk, and harmful when it keeps people from seeking effective therapies. Might it be more useful to expend your energies elsewhere?

@Johnny
December 1, 2014
#105

The homeopaths sailed under a false flag. They claimed to be qualified medical doctors. With this claim the group “Freunde Liberias” asked for donations to support a humanitary aid action to bring medical help to the suffering people in Liberia, without mentioning that the sole purpose of the “mission” in Liberia was to “find the appropriate remedy”, and, of course, demonstrate that homeopathy works on ebola.

This sailing under a false flag brought them more than 5000 Euros in donations by unsuspecting citizens.

Will the homeopaths take responsibility? Will they go public in Germany and tell IN PUBLIC that they willfully did wrong?

What about the unsuspecting members of “Freunde Liberias” who supported the action? They gave their name, not they are under fire.

Johnny, you ask about “crush”. Very simple:

1. The homeopaths are caught in the act of making false claims about their qualification.
2. They are caught in the act of making false claims about their intended aim in Liberia.
3. They pull down the support group “Freunde Liberias”.

Despite this they STILL say in public they want to send a second group to West Africa. How?

They are neither qualified nor do they have any prove that their stuff ever worked. One thing makes THE WHOLE affair even more crimninal: The WHO already in August (or earlier) declared that “alternative medicines” are not effective against ebola and bear the risk of firing up the infection rate. Best example is the spreading of the epidemics from Mali to Sierra Leone because people from Mali went there to get herbal cures from a healer. The healer got infected and died. And so did MANY other Sierra Leone citizens.

At the time the homeopaths planned their trip to Africa the WHO already had made its rejecting statement. So the homeopaths knew damned well that they MUST NOT use homeopathy. This makes their action a criminal act. And they did know that and they do know that now. Will they stand up and admit that they are willfully committing a criminal act?

The homeopaths have a lot to explain now.
They cheated their own friends and their own supporters. They cheated the public. AND THEY CAN NOT DENY THAT.

They are crushed.

What you can do? A) smile and B) pass this on. Like the Daily Mail did. Like the other media did and do. People have the right to know that homeopathy is fraud.

I’ll tell anyone who will listen that homeopathy is a fraud, and I’ve been known to smile on occasion, so I guess I’ll bow out at this point.

Carry on.

Came upstairs for the night and Mr Woo was listening to an internet infomercial by a Dr Jonathan Wright with the “good doctor” (and, sadly, he is an MD) portrayed as standing with a small group who know the plot by pharma to make us sick, keep us sick, etc. It portrayed him as one of the “original protectors of health freedom” etc., etc., etc.

I cringed at every wooish word, and thought about yelling, “Bingo!” after a few minutes. I am wandering if I waste the time trying to prove this man a fraud if it will matter. I know he will just go look for another one. He has been not working closely with our PCP to manage things, taking the small improvements from beginning low doses of medication as a new baseline and adding supplements hawked by these profiteering snake oil salesmen to try to hit his target numbers (vs. having another doctor visit and finishing med adjustments.

He has had a second stroke (August) and believing the whole echo chamber that is alternative (medicine as well as news/conspiracy stuff) is going to end his life ten or twenty years earlier than it could last.

@Mrs Woo: Oy. That’s a horrible situation to be in. If it were me, which it’s not, I’d try to get to him now, before he gets too invested in alternative medicine and its worldview. When someone really gets entrenched in that, nasty things can happen, including within interpersonal relationships. I’ve recently lost a couple of actually close friends for daring to question the woo-rld-view. (Part of it was me recoiling at being called “brainwashed” or a “shill” by people I’d counted as friends; what an insult, that I’m either deluded, stupid, or don’t come by my opinions honestly.) Not to forget, of course, that he could die, which is the most important thing.

I can empathize with Mr. Woo a bit, too, though. Chronic illness sucks, and managing chronic illness sucks. In fact, I very ill-advisedly tapered myself off the antidepressant that I’d been taking for three years this summer. (The risk-benefit analysis would definitely suggest that I stay on it, for various reasons, rationally speaking.)

But I don’t want to take meds and see shrinks for the rest of my days; in and of itself, it’s depressing. What can I say? Half of what keeps me going in life is just sheer cussedness. (Plus, to be honest, the therapist I had to see in order to see the psychiatrist wasn’t exactly the sharpest tool in the shed, even if she was sympathetic.)

That being said, I’m thinking I’ll probably need to make an appointment with a psychiatrist in the near future. My little experiment has not been entirely successful, and I really caught hell with my advisor when I mentioned it (He’s also had problems with severe depression and has seen me at my worst.)

All this is just to say that even the stubbornest cuss can be gotten to, it turns out.

Mr Woo has diabetes and high blood pressure. He has been woo-enamored since before we met. I highly suspect his entire adulthood has been woo-believing. I originally found this blog years ago googling to try to debunk some of his suppositions.

Strangely, having only one grandkid on the spectrum with five other grandkids who have been successfully kept up to date on vaccinations has made him willing to add flu shot and a shingles vaccine to his to-do list this fall.

Chronic depression is a real struggle. I am glad you have an advisor willing to speak up. I reacted very badly to Mr Woo’s second stroke. I am chronically ill and not physically capable of doing enough to take care of him while he recovers.

Ah-ha; thus the ‘nym. I have to admit that it (well, the term woo in general) keeps making me think of the Wu-Tang Clan. “‘Cause yo, the Wu, the Wu got something that I know everybody wanna hear.”

The Daily Mail has a new article with a slightly different take on the incident: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2839577/Homeopathy-cure-Ebola-Doctors-attack-armchair-intellectuals-World-Health-Organisation-refuse-let-treat-deadly-virus-snake-venom-remedy.html

Thanks for pointing that out, ama.

Dave! The system sucks. It again swallowed a comment by me.

Will that day be before or after the day conventional medicine starts respecting bloodletting once again?

Well, actually, conventional medicine does respect bloodletting… for a few, very specifically indicated conditions, such as haemochromatosis.

*has the most to do with the strokes, not “the diabetes.” Sorry.

@ Mrs Woo:

That’s rather awful!
And it’s one of the reasons I write about charlatans and their prevarication. It’s all about money. If only we could get that message across to people like Mr Woo. Perhaps he needs to see photos of their estates.

This phoney medicine hurts real people. A few years ago, I used to play tennis at a very posh club: the manager was normal but afraid of meds and tried to avoid them at all costs: when her doctor prescribed a drug for cholesterol IIRC she instead opted for red rice yeast. She felt great but then had a stroke and had to undergo months of therapy because she had problems articulating speech. I’ve been told she still speaks with difficulty.

Interestingly, those entranced by woo hear ‘evidence’ and testimonials but fail to hear warnings from people like Orac or you or me. Possibly they may have a previous orientation away from authorities or have an axe to grind against doctors. As I’ve noted before, sometimes woo-meisters themselves feel that they or family members have been harmed by SBM- it may have been the first paving stone on their path to woo. And their fortunes.

@Mrs. Woo:

I’m really sorry you’re in that situation; that’s gotta be rough. Obiviously you really love the guy, or you wouldn’t still be there. Such a difference in worldview is akin to a deep religious divide, and I’m impressed that you’re holding up. I mean, Alex Jones, daaaaaang.

He seems to be at least somewhat moderate in his views, though, based on your description. I only hope that you can convince him one way or another to take care of his health (in a reality-based way) before something bad happens.

I’ve had friends tell me that they don’t “think it’s healthy to be taking pills every day just to be normal,”

Tell that to a diabetic.

@ Mrs Woo:

But does Mr Woo know of YOUR relationship with the Illuminati via RI?

At any rate, I just ran into a video that may help illuminate ( ahem!) how people become woo-entranced:
at Thinking Moms’ Revolution today, publisher and professional woo-enabler Tony Lyons explains how he became a supporter of the vaccine-autism hypothesis:
his daughter was diagnosed with autism after vaccines and a seizure; he later became familiar with Wakefield, etc.

He runs Skyhorse which is publishing all of those autism-related books being hawked at AoA and has given Gary Null his own imprint as well.
I’m sure however that his child’s autism was not the first foundation of his en-woo-ment.

Dave, to the rescue, please. Comment is stuck in the pipeline. 🙂

ama, if you poke Benneth’s name in the search box, you will see 8 post come up that mention him. I think it’s safe to say that our host has covered all the major loons, and a good portion of the minor ones. To get the full flavor of the crazy Benneth brings to the world, I would suggest checking out his YouTube postings.

Also, note that a comment with 3 or more links will go to moderation. Wether this is a bug or a feature I leave as an exercise for the student.

On the other hand, I’ve had friends tell me that they don’t “think it’s healthy to be taking pills every day just to be normal,”

Do they think it’s healthier not to be normal, then? Until or unless they can identify something that’s been demonstrated to help them be normal that’s proven to be just as safe and just as effective as those pills that’s the choice they’re making.

And should they identify something other than pills, I can’t imagine why the same objection wouldn’t hold–e.g., “I don’t think it’s healthy to have my chakra’s re-aligned every week just to be normal.”

JGC @140: Well, in a sense, yeah, at least when it comes to one camp of anti-anti-depressant folks. This is the camp that think Americans are being fed too many psych meds to numb them enough to fit into mainstream culture, etc., etc. You know, there might even be a grain of truth to that – I think maybe SSRIs and so forth maybe are overprescribed, esp. by GPs, but I don’t think it’s a huge problem, and I certainly don’t think it’s part of any plot by Big Pharma to keep people complacent. I think a lot of people operate on different ideas of what the word “depressed” means, too: This is where you get people saying things like, “You know, when I’m depressed, I go for a walk in the woods” or whatever. Gee, that’s nice, but when I’m depressed, I’ve been known to end up in the ER. (As an aside, I really don’t know why anyone would ever be concerned about me suddenly becoming normal. That’s about the last descriptor most people would use for me, I think)

Some people I know are just kind of vaguely in that camp, but some really close friends of mine back home have gotten further and further into the whole anti-Pharma, anti-GMO, anti-fluoride thing. It really kind of sickens me that they’d value their ideology more than, you know, my wellbeing and/or life.

The other camp is mostly comprised of my Polish and Russian friends, who seem to share a general mistrust of medicine and psychiatry in particular. This is actually somewhat understandable, given that psychiatry actually was used as a tool of state control in the Soviet Union and former Eastern Bloc countries. Folk remedies are still huge in Slavic cultures, too; “But my grandma said it works!” My friend Yana was telling me once about how she doesn’t think it’s good to take pharmaceuticals and prefers to take herbs instead. (Which is “grasses” in Russian, actually, which is sort of cute in a way.)

JP: I hear you on the tapering. It’s a special kind of hell, at least as far as SSRIs go. Can’t speak about SNRIs, but I’m sure that’s no picnic either. Good luck.

I used to follow a blogger who was a naturalized Russian. Not only did she believe ADD and most associated disorders were bunk- oddly, she was proud of her ASD diagnosis*- but she also viewed dentists as charlatans and was convinced that having even one tooth extracted would cause the rest to rot. ( I guess dentists in the Eastern bloc weren’t very good?)
* I say oddly, because you’d think someone who thought ADD was bunk would resist any diagnosis at all.

@Johnny
December 3, 2014
#138

I know that Benneth is mentioned at several places. And I viewed some of his videos. The reason to grill him “extra black” is a very simple one: because he is so dangerous. Many homeopaths are only stupid. But Benneth is wicked.

Most people do not know about his acting “career” or his political ambitions. Or his fight with Randi.
I guess that nearly no one knows about his copying David Guardino.

It is THESE things that display his real character. He is not a nutty homeopath. He is driven by his insane will to cheat others. Knowing this one can sort things out and understand why he attacked Randi or why he tricked out the London Nobel failure. For him it is fun to exploit others.

His messing with homeopathy is not restricted to some recipes on how to make this of that remedy. OH NO! He started to collect money, and by now claims to have sent homeopathic to Africa, to treat ebola.

Who collaborated with him for this? He says it is some German homeopathy company. Who is that in Germany, and who are his partners in Africa?

They create a shadow world, behind the back of the Liberian government and the WHO and other health organizations. Whatever government and WHO do, he does his best to destroy that. Because he, the genius, can cheat them.

John Robert Benneth is a criminal, letting people die just for the fun of it.

There must be en end to this. He must be treated as exactly what he is: a bio-terrorist. And not only he, but ALL the other homeopaths.

One thing not to forget: It is not only the ebola matter in Africa, it also is anti-vaccination disinformation and other fraudulent actions, killing US citizens. There are corpses! There are corpses in the USA. And their murderers still are at large.

JGC: True. I’d go back on anti-depressants if the side effects didn’t make me more miserable than no treatment at all. And of course there’s insurance to worry about. That’s one of the major reasons I haven’t been taking any medication since college ended.

@Politicalguineapig
December 3, 2014
#149

SOME are deluded douche-bags. But persons like Benneth are pure criminals with such a high criminal energy that they should be put in a padded cell.

SOME only talk about ding. But Benneth and others brought homeopathica to Africa. That is a high degree of aggression.

The highest degree of aggression is to claim that homeopathica are efficacious prophylactics against ebola. This is mass murder. Do not forget he thousands of citizens of Sierra Leone who died because of those dimwits who went across the border to go to a healer there.

That to claim something to be a working prophlactic IS mass murder is not an idea or a fear, it is a proven fact. Proven by thousands of dead.

The claim that homeopathica are working phrophylactics is not isolated. Even if it were DIFFERENT groups, some only pushing homeopathy, some others making the claims about prophylactic properties, it is the TOTAL PICTURE which counts, and the total picture is: push homeopathy + claim prophylactic properties.

What shocks me in West Africa is that local superstition has hugely aggravated the Ebola epidemic already. Then the homeopaths come along and introduce more distracting superstition – further confusing people. If they manage to popularize homeopathy for Ebola, I’m sure it will play a part in the resistance of the people there to quarantines and to going along with the efforts to contain the epidemic in general.
The homeopathic remedies also deceive consumers in the West. They are led to believe the homeopathic remedies have some curative power, by false advertising.
That in itself is a shocking situation.
But that deception becomes deadly, much worse, with Ebola in West Africa.
The “relatively harmless” homeopathic doctors have been laying the foundation for deadly deception in West Africa, with “relatively harmless” deception in the West.
There has been some anti-homeopathy activism by skeptics in the West, helping to counteract the false advertising in homeopathy.
And what we need to “get”, I think, is that this anti-homeopathy activism matters. Because if this BS isn’t counteracted when it’s “relatively harmless”, it may become deadly.
It’s a wakeup call – that our culture shouldn’t put up with such deception.

From the H5N1 blog, the Liberian Observer reports “Traditional Medicine to Be Used at ‘All’ Health Centers.”

The application of this policy extends but will not be limited to herbalists, homeopath, acupuncturists, ayurvedic, osteopath, therapeutic massagers, drugless therapists, bone setters, traditional midwives, chiropractic, steam bath and food supplements.