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Poor, poor pitiful Andy (Wakefield): Dissed again, this time by the Oregon Senate Committee on Health Care

Poor Andy Wakefield.

Beginning in the late 1990s until around six years ago, Andy was the premiere “vaccine skeptic” in the world. His 1998 case series published in The Lancet linking bowel problems in autistic children to the measles vaccine, the one where in the paper itself he was careful not to blame the MMR vaccine for autism but elsewhere was not so shy, launched a campaign of fear and loathing for the MMR vaccine that continues to this day. In his heyday, Wakefield was quite the figure, showing up on the media everywhere, treated with undeserved respect by much of the tabloid press and downright reverence by the antivaccine movement. (Indeed, Age of Autism founder J.B. Handley once famously referred to Wakefield as our “Nelson Mandela and Jesus Christ rolled up into one.” Of course, thanks largely to the efforts of Brian Deer, the wheels came off a five years ago. That year, Wakefield lost his license to practice and his (in)famous case series in The Lancet was retracted, as it had been demonstrated rather conclusively that Wakefield had committed scientific fraud in that study. Even the antivaccine quack mill Thoughtful House, where Wakefield had reigned supreme as chief antivaccine autism quack couldn’t take it any more, and its board of directors rather unceremoniously gave him the boot.

Of couse, since then, Wakefield has done pretty well for himself, remaining a figurehead adored by credulous antivaccine activists, a veritable hero. He was still flown to antivaccine conferences in nice hotels in places like Jamaica. He still manages to live quite a comfortable lifestyle, in part thanks to the generosity of of the deep pockets behind the antivaccine movement, as reported by CNN, in part thanks to his Strategic Autism Initiative. Another times, he exploited the tragedy of the murder of an autistic boy, Alex Spourdalakis, in a most shameful fashion.

So, two days ago, when I saw this story, I couldn’t believe it:

Andrew Wakefield, the British researcher who was made famous by his 1998 study that linked autism to a childhood vaccine, is coming to Salem next month to testify before the Legislature, a health care lobbyist confirmed Tuesday.

The Senate Committee on Health Care is exploring a bill, sponsored by Sen. Elizabeth Steiner Hayward, D-Beaverton, that would ban parents from claiming nonmedical exemptions from their children’s school immunizations.

By the time I saw the story, it was too late to blog about it for yesterday; so I put it in the hopper for today. However, two days ago, I did blog about the Oregon bill to which the article refers. The bill, SB442, was originally intended to clarify the procedure for parents to get non-medical exemptions to school vaccine mandates. However, in the wake of the Disneyland measles outbreak consideration was being given to amending the bill to eliminate non-medical exemptions altogether. As I pointed out, the very fact that a state like Oregon, which is a hotbed of antivaccine activity (J. B. Handley, for instance, lives there) would even consider such a bill, is a sea change in attitude in the wake of continuing measles outbreaks.

Of course, antivaccine activists weren’t going to take this lying down, and they didn’t. J.B. Handley, for instance, submitted testimony to the Oregon Senate Committee on Health Care on February 18. Not surprisingly, he pulled out the same old tropes that I’ve seen him using over the decade that I’ve been blogging and since I first encountered him: “too many too soon“; argument by package insert; the pharma shill gambit; and, of course, the antivaccine dog whistle that ties vaccine “choice” to parental rights and freedom.

Still, I couldn’t understand why on earth anyone would think that tarting up old, discredited Andy Wakefield, flying him up to Oregon, and plopping him in front of the Senate Committee on Health Care would serve the cause of “vaccine choice.” I mean, seriously. Is there any “vaccine skeptic” currently more discredited than Andrew Wakefield in the mind of the public? Sure, there are actually more despicable antivaccinationists, but few people have heard of them. Wakefield, on the other hand, is famous, but he’s famous because he’s a discredited fraud who did antivaccine research for money. Brian Deer showed us that. And there are many victims. I know that Wakefield’s visit was arranged by the Oregon Chiropractic Association, but I didn’t think that even chiropractors were so deluded to think that a discredited fraud like Wakefield would help their case. In fact, when I first heard of the story, I was almost happy. The more quacks and cranks antivaccinationists trotted in front of the committee, the better. What better way for them to shoot themselves in the foot, to self-immolate? I was even thinking of suggesting more cranks to testify, such as Mark and David Geier or Christopher Shaw. Heck, why not get Sharyl Attkisson?

Oh, wait. I had heard it through the grapevine that others scheduled to testify included Tetyana Obukhanyeh, PhD., and Lucija Tomljenovic, PhD.

Sadly, my anticipation of the spectacle of Andrew Wakefield testifying was not to be. Yesterday, many of you sent my way this story:

Oregon legislators have canceled a meeting to discuss a bill that would eliminate nonmedical exemptions from Oregon’s school immunization law, after it became clear that a controversial vaccine researcher who linked the measles, mumps, rubella vaccine with autism was planning to testify.

The Statesman Journal reported Tuesday that Andrew Wakefield, whose 1998 study was retracted from The Lancet and refuted by subsequent studies, was planning a trip to Salem to testify against Senate Bill 442.

He said in a phone interview on Wednesday that he objected to allegations made by Sen. Elizabeth Steiner Hayward, the bill’s sponsor, that he committed scientific fraud in his research.

Sen. Laurie Monnes Anderson, D-Gresham, chairwoman of the Senate health care committee, said she canceled the March 9 informational meeting because she felt the first public hearing, on Feb. 18, provided enough information.

Poor, poor pitiful Andy! He’s so toxic that the very mention of his potentially showing up to testify can shut down a legislative committee informational meeting. I don’t believe it for a minute when Anderson claimed:

Monnes Anderson said her decision did not have anything to do with Wakefield’s intentions to testify.

The March 9 meeting will only take invited testimony from constitutional law experts who will weigh in on the legality of SB 442, she said. During a work session, committee members can tweak the bill as well as vote on it.

Come on. Does Anderson really think her constituents are that stupid? Maybe she does. In any case, I’m torn by this decision. On the one hand, it would have been grand entertainment to see Andy trotted out in front of the committee to spew his usual brand of antivaccine misinformation, and I bet that he would not have been particularly impressive, old fraudster that Deer showed him to be. In fact, I rather suspect he would have inadvertently helped the cause of eliminating non-medical exemptions in Oregon. After all, what better weapon would those supporting the bill have than to be able to attach the name of someone as disreputable as Andrew Wakefield to opposition to SB442? On the other hand, there would have been a chance that letting him testify would have actually elevated him, made him less disreputable. In any event, my guess is that Anderson saw that letting Wakefield testify would turn her committee’s “informational event” into a media circus. No, strike that. It would have turned it into a circus. So she wisely canceled, because Wakefield is just that toxic.

My only consolation in this is that antivaccinationists seem to be their own worst enemies. As I said before, anyone with an ounce of political savvy would have realized that letting someone like Andrew Wakefield testify, someone who is (1) famous, (2) discredited, and (3) highly disreputable, testify is the same thing as putting his face on the opposition. There’s no way this could have ended well for antivaccinationists. In fact, the chiropractors and antivaccine “health freedom” types who pushed to get Wakefield on the list of people giving testimony should thank Monnes Anderson profusely for saving themelves from themselves.

They won’t, of course, They are just that deluded as to believe that having Wakefield’s chance to testify yanked hurt them. But, hey, according to news reports, Wakefield wants to hold a town hall meeting in Portland. Somehow, I doubt that will go very well, either. After all, remember what happened the last time Wakefield tried to have a “town hall” meeting to protest to what he viewed as a pro-vaccine provocation. “Pitiful” doesn’t begin to describe it.

By Orac

Orac is the nom de blog of a humble surgeon/scientist who has an ego just big enough to delude himself that someone, somewhere might actually give a rodent's posterior about his copious verbal meanderings, but just barely small enough to admit to himself that few probably will. That surgeon is otherwise known as David Gorski.

That this particular surgeon has chosen his nom de blog based on a rather cranky and arrogant computer shaped like a clear box of blinking lights that he originally encountered when he became a fan of a 35 year old British SF television show whose special effects were renowned for their BBC/Doctor Who-style low budget look, but whose stories nonetheless resulted in some of the best, most innovative science fiction ever televised, should tell you nearly all that you need to know about Orac. (That, and the length of the preceding sentence.)

DISCLAIMER:: The various written meanderings here are the opinions of Orac and Orac alone, written on his own time. They should never be construed as representing the opinions of any other person or entity, especially Orac's cancer center, department of surgery, medical school, or university. Also note that Orac is nonpartisan; he is more than willing to criticize the statements of anyone, regardless of of political leanings, if that anyone advocates pseudoscience or quackery. Finally, medical commentary is not to be construed in any way as medical advice.

To contact Orac: [email protected]

776 replies on “Poor, poor pitiful Andy (Wakefield): Dissed again, this time by the Oregon Senate Committee on Health Care”

He was invited by Oregon Chiropractors – just more evidence of how anti-science (and anti-vaccine) they are.

A. Andrew Wakefield can appear reasonable and convincing to those who do not know his record, as long as he doesn’t let himself go, as in the Stalin, Hitler and Pol Pot video. But he has that record, that’s very easy to point to.

B. I hope Oregon legislators remember, nonetheless, that these people were offering, as their main witness, a man found guilty of serious ethical violations with a documented history of less-than-dubious credibility.

I’m actually shocked that J.B. Handley was allowed to testify. This is someone who has no scientific credentials to speak of and has often been laughably wrong about vaccines, And that doesn’t even get into his very public bullying (including threats of legal action) against anyone who disagrees with him.

There’s nothing in J.B.’s testimony that you couldn’t get from spending a half-hour perusing any anti-vax website, and the Oregon Senate, by allowing Handley to address them, elevated him to someone with credibility to speak on the topic. I find that almost as offensive as Andy Wakefield nearly getting to speak in front of them.

A legislative hearing isn’t a scientific forum. One of its appropriate goals is to allow affected citizens to voice their point of view. Mr. Handley is an affected citizen, and letting him testify was the right thing.

The committee treating him as a scientific source would be an error, and it’s more than fair to point out the problems in his claims, but of all forums, a legislative policy making process is one that should be open and inclusive in hearing views. However extreme and unfounded.

Well, whilst there might be no debate scientifically, there clearly is politically. By not having the various anti-vax proponents testify surely there is the danger of these people asserting that their voice wasn’t heard and generally feeding into their persecution complex.

Much better would have been a public detailed examination of Wakkers – unless these legislaors though tthey wern’t up to it!

Oregon seems poised to become the go-to state for quackery. I’m interested but not entirely surprised to see chiropractors stirring the pot on this. Does anyone know if there are any national chiro organizations with position statements on vaccines?

Dorit it correct. Legislative hearings serve the function of allowing the public to have a say on matters that affect them. Not all testimony is created equally nor does it have equal impact. Legislators are savvy to those offering testimony with an axe to grind.

There is this collections of positions.
http://www.acatoday.org/level2_css.cfm?T1ID=10&T2ID=117

“Resolved, that the American Chiropractic Association (ACA) recognize and advise the public that:
Since the scientific community acknowledges that the use of vaccines is not without risk, the American Chiropractic Association supports each individual’s right to freedom of choice in his/her own health care based on an informed awareness of the benefits and possible adverse effects of vaccination. The ACA is supportive of a conscience clause or waiver in compulsory vaccination laws thereby maintaining an individual’s right to freedom of choice in health care matters and providing an alternative elective course of action regarding vaccination. (Ratified by the House of Delegates, July 1993, Revised and Ratified June 1998).”

He said in a phone interview on Wednesday that he objected to allegations made by Sen. Elizabeth Steiner Hayward, the bill’s sponsor, that he committed scientific fraud in his research.

Maybe he should threaten a defamation suit instead.

Narad and Dorit:

Seriously- what else does he have?

I mean other than the estate, the entourage and the legion of adoring acolytes?
Maybe money in the bank, stocks, bonds,..
Poor Andy!

Perhaps Wakefield can establish a new “Center for Legislative Integrity” and use the contributions that he solicits from his adoring fans to pay himself a salary as its director.

Well, he currently doesn’t have any outstanding lawsuits to solicit money, and he’s been rather unsuccessful in raising funds for his documentaries….I have no idea what he has left up his sleeve.

Seriously- what else does he have?

Well, there’s the ORI complaint, which has likely been filed appropriately.

Sen. Laurie Monnes Anderson, D-Gresham, chairwoman of the Senate health care committee, said she canceled the March 9 informational meeting because she felt the first public hearing, on Feb. 18, provided enough information.

Do we know Sen. Anderson’s views on the subject? IOW, is she opposed to the bill and thought (likely correctly) that having Wakefield testify would strengthen the pro side? Or does she favor the bill, and suspect that some of her fellow senators might fall for Wakefield’s schtik? Gresham is in the Portland area, and IIRC Portland is an anti-vax hotbed, but I don’t know if Gresham is one of the suburbs that attracts well-off granola types (as Marin County does in the Bay Area).

Eric, like I said elsewhere, Andy may be our un-intentional ally- at least to the general public’s ear- what he says and his presence alone- may strengthen the SB position.

Is it realistic at this point for Wakefield complain about allegations of fraud, as if the fraudulent nature of the Lancet publication had not been demonstrated?

Such sessions are generally open to the public. Were others denied their chance to speak for 3 minutes because this session was cancelled on account of Wakefield? And how much damage could Wakefield have done when lumped in with dozens of other speakers, all getting the same allotted time?

But now…Surely Wakefield and his supporters are going to make a lot of hay about cancelling this session because of him — it is mana from heaven for the anti-vaxers. Especially in Portland where Wakefield townhall meetings are being planned by the chiros.

Orac. it seems, will never learn…

I don’t know if Gresham is one of the suburbs that attracts well-off granola types (as Marin County does in the Bay Area).

No. It’s basically just a big, bland place with no real distinguishing characteristics at all. The only good thing about it is that it’s on a MAX line.

I heard Wakefield speak at a medical postgraduate meeting.

He may be deluded and a fraud; he had been successful because he is a skilled and persuasive rhetoritian. Even if you are very knowledgeable and aware of the falsity off his arguments he’ll beat you in a debate unless you’re also a skilled debater. Don’t underestimate him. He’s too dangerous to dismiss lightly.

J.B. Handley, for instance, testified in front of the Oregon Senate Committee on Health Care on February 18.

He appears to have submitted written testimony (PDF, pp. 36–43, although he himself seems to have been unable to put together a PDF, hence the scan).

In repeatedly using the phrase “the free world,” he fails to document his claims; I’ve already posted the Israeli schedule, for example – he changes how he “counts” as convenient.

It’s a small committee, and my sense from some brief email communications with several members is that most if not all are favorable to the bill.

I’m not sure where the suggestion to have an additional public input session on vaccine safety information originated, but it seems that they received enough feedback to realize that it was a counterproductive idea. The work session on March 9 will now only deal with constitutionality of the bill, and the only speakers will be the invited contributors with Con Law expertise.

SB 442 not only proposes to end non-medical exemptions, but also seeks to clarify the definition of what medical conditions qualify for exemptions. This last bit is just as important as the first. Right now in Oregon personal exemptions are ridiculously easy to get. One only has to ‘watch’ a video to obtain an exemption certificate, and by ‘watch’, I mean, ‘let it play in the background, give it an occasional prompt until it finishes, and then print out your certificate’. But, even if this option goes away, there are still many ‘vax-choice’ docs afoot, some of whom are already declaring that they will “find a way to get you a medical exemption if that’s what it comes to”.

Thus, it seems particularly important to clarify the kinds of medical conditions that qualify so that these docs can’t just substitute one loophole for another.

Calling Andy Wakefield as your expert witness on vaccination policy is akin to calling Bernie Madoff as your expert witness on financial investments.

My only hope when I saw that article was that some of the local Oregonian pro-vaccine advocates would provide the lawmakers with the pertinent information on Wakefield so he could provide an hilarious exhibition of hubris as did Dr. Oz when grilled by Sen. Claire McCaskill.

@Reality–
The lawmakers who co-sponsored the bill are well aware of Wakefield’s history–Senator Steiner is the one he’s pissed at for calling his work ‘fraudulent’. Note also that he was not “called him in to testify”. He was summoned by private groups and lobbyists to contribute to continuing public comments for and against the bill during the upcoming Health Committee Work Session. There’s no Q&A there–no ‘grilling’–just an opportunity to read something into the record.

#4: “A legislative hearing isn’t a scientific forum. One of its appropriate goals is to allow affected citizens to voice their point of view. Mr. Handley is an affected citizen, and letting him testify was the right thing.”

So what was Wakefield’s standing? How is he affected by an Oregon law? What are his scientific credentials to speak knowledgeably about vaccines?

As an aside, has anyone else seen a questionable ad asking “Should children be forced to vaccinate?” from a place called Easy Health Options? Now I don’t know that place from Adam, but it sure sounds susspect. I think Orac needs to look into it and tear it a new one. Anyone else think so?

@Ken–
like a lot of state-level issues, people are using this one to push a national agenda. We went through this even more intensely when we had a GMO labeling initiative on the ballot last November (which failed narrowly). Anti-GMO speakers/debaters from of out of state came on the run for various speaking engagements and debates to support the measure. Even the ‘No on 92’ campaign was run by an out of state org.

Oh, definitely. When right-to-try came to Michigan, many of those who testified were Goldwater Institute flacks flown in from Arizona.

@lucario#28- I’ve been clicking the report as inappropriate option on those.

No way I’d let my kids vaccinate. Well, maybe my daughter-at 6, she can already sew and use scissors so she could probably give a flu shot. But the boy, nope, not on your life.

Next step in Oregon-figure out where this new governor is at on immunizations. The yoga practitioner thing already has me a little nervous.

Mark my words: Mr. Handley will probably spin this as, “the other side suppressed Andrew Wakefield’s testimony; they were afraid to let him be heard.”

“By not having the various anti-vax proponents testify surely there is the danger of these people asserting that their voice wasn’t heard and generally feeding into their persecution complex.”

“Mr. Handley will probably spin this as, “the other side suppressed Andrew Wakefield’s testimony; they were afraid to let him be heard.”

This is pretty much what we can expect.

A better committee response would have been to reject Wakefield’s appearance, while inviting any non-fraudulent antivax proponent with scientific credentials and published research respected in the medical community to testify.
Then, after an embarrassing period of dead silence, they could get on with their bill.

@ Matt #26

The Dwoskins are friends and major supporters of Bill and Hill. Their influence was probably responsible for Hillary’s little nod to the anti-vaxers in ’08. But with the GOP all lining up for ‘parents rights’ ‘medical choice’ and FREEDUMB, and HRC likening anti-vaxers to flat-earthers on Twitter, the Dwoskins aren’t gonna touch Andy Wakefield with a ten-foot pole. I think they’ll have to cut their sizable contributions to Generation Rescue too. Al Dwoskin probably gets an ambassadorship if he and Claire play nice, and they get blackballed from Washington parties if they don’t.

After the election, the Dwoskins might away with sliding a little cash towards whatever new media-voice RFKJ’s dug up, but with Trace Amounts he’s already scraping the bottom of the filmmaking barrel.

Andy could still find some wing-nut bazillionaire whale, I suppose, but if wanted to pimp the ‘parents rights / vaccine freedom’ take a la Rand Paul, I could find scores of better spokespersons than Andy Wakefield.

We’re way past ‘proving vaccines cause autism’. Vaccines cause everything, because the parents say so. And it doesn’t matter if they’re wrong. They’ve got rights, and it’s none of Big Guvment’s business!. Forget the science frauds. It’s all back to parents’ individual stories from here on out. New anti-vax films will all feature reasonable-seeming, sympathetic and media-genic parents. They’ll have fewer negatives in the Q scores than Jenny McCarthy. If I was working anti-vax PR with funds to buy a new movie, I’d go strictly ‘delayed vax is good but it’s your choice’ on the surface with tons of sub-text dog-whistles. I’d try to enlist Dr. Jay as my ‘medical expert’, and get someone like Mayim Bialik from his Hollywood connections as the star.

First, Brian Deer,
Have you written any news story other than “Andy Wakefield” in the last 5 years?
Please post examples, so I can believe it is true.

“The Statesman Journal reported Tuesday that Andrew Wakefield, whose 1998 study was retracted from The Lancet…”

Could you please explain why the Lancet published Wakefield in the first place?
I’ve never heard THAT explanation.

Brian, have you ever considered visiting Denmark?
It is a great opportunity to fill in your “journalism gap”.

“The Dwoskins are friends and major supporters of Bill and Hill. Their influence was probably responsible for Hillary’s little nod to the anti-vaxers in ’08.”

LOL! Nice try Sadmar. #35

Hillary has bigger fish to fry:
“The Daily News on Tuesday reported that Clinton aides have already scoped out office space in BROOKLYN HEIGHTS, just across the river from Manhattan.”
http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/231671-can-cool-brooklyn-rub-off-on-hillary

Isn’t this near the major ANTI-VAX VOTING BLOC I’ve been blogging about?
http://www.timesofisrael.com/measles-vaccine-developer-warns-jewish-anti-vaxxers/#ixzz3Sni3t3qp
http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6236a5.htm
http://www.notfortourists.com/Hood.aspx/NewYork/BoroughPark
http://forward.com/articles/199430/jewish-pro-hillary-clinton-group-is-launched/
Oy vey!

panacea – I don’t think that’s necessarily a bad thing. Reinforce their biases, validate their inner narrative, and they will react in ways that makes them look even crazier and further diminishes their credibility.

I deleted this a couple of times, knowing that some of those folks probably lurk here, but in all honesty, they couldn’t intentionally moderate their message if their lives depended on it. They are unraveling. Our task now is to pursue an endgame strategy for the eradication of bullshit.

@Dorit
“A. Andrew Wakefield can appear reasonable and convincing to those who do not know his record, as long as he doesn’t let himself go, as in the Stalin, Hitler and Pol Pot video. But he has that record, that’s very easy to point to.”

Could you please cite the “record” you refer to?
Some of us do not know what A. Andrew Wakefield’s record is.

Could you please post a link to the “Stalin, Hitler and Pol Pot” video? I can’t imagine what that is!

Also there are several unanswered questions addressed to you over on the earlier “Dog whistle” blog.

Expect a “spin” at AoA…but no one cares…except for us lurkers who derive pleasure from the posts and comments at AoA.

The Dwoskin Family Foundation’s spokesperson opines….

“Is There a Vaccine Debate Occurring? It Doesn’t Seem Like It.”

You bet there’s debates occurring in several State legislatures to tighten up/eliminate vaccination exemptions…and more parents are getting involved to support legislators who propose bills to eliminate those exemptions.

http://dwoskinfamilyfoundationvaccinesupport.com/

P.S. Diane Harper is again cited as one of the developers of the HPV vaccine.

@Deer Brian,

Let me entice you. This could be the news scoop OF THE YEAR. It has drama, treachery, theft, and the health of millions of children at stake, and it is in SCENIC DENMARK. Aren’t you sick of “Wakefield”? The fair city of ATLANTA (remember Scarlet?) Georgia, would fill the streets shouting HOSANNAH! if you aid in the return to them, their not-so-native son and alleged THIEF of over $1 MILLION CDC $$$$$$$$$. He would stand trial, and be brought to justice, and go to a place where he would know if his vaccines actually work.
YOU CAN GET STARTED RIGHT AWAY!
Here are the details:
http://www.rescuepost.com/files/thorsen-indictment.pdf
“OIG Fugitive: Poul Thorsen
Poul Thorsen
From approximately February 2004 until February 2010, Poul Thorsen executed a scheme to steal grant money awarded by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC). CDC had awarded grant money to Denmark for research involving infant disabilities, autism, genetic disorders, and fetal alcohol syndrome. CDC awarded the grant to fund studies of the relationship between autism and the exposure to vaccines, the relationship between cerebral palsy and infection during pregnancy, and the relationship between developmental outcomes and fetal alcohol exposure.
Thorsen worked as a visiting scientist at CDC, Division of Birth Defects and Developmental Disabilities, before the grant was awarded.
The initial grant was awarded to the Danish Medical Research Council. In approximately 2007, a second grant was awarded to the Danish Agency for Science, Technology, and Innovation. Both agencies are governmental agencies in Denmark. The research was done by the Aarhaus University and Odense University Hospital in Denmark.
Thorsen allegedly diverted over $1 MILLION of the CDC grant money to his own personal bank account. Thorsen submitted fraudulent invoices on CDC letterhead to medical facilities assisting in the research for reimbursement of work allegedly covered by the grants. The invoices were addressed to Aarhaus University and Sahlgrenska University Hospital. The fact that the invoices were on CDC letterhead made it appear that CDC was requesting the money from Aarhaus University and Sahlgrenska University Hospital although the bank account listed on the invoices belonged to Thorsen.
In April 2011, Thorsen was indicted on 22 counts of Wire Fraud and Money Laundering.
According to bank account records, Thorsen purchased a home in Atlanta, a Harley Davidson motorcycle, an Audi automobile, and a Honda SUV with funds that he received from the CDC grants.
Thorsen is currently in Denmark and is awaiting extradition to the United States.”
https://oig.hhs.gov/fraud/fugitives/profiles.asp
http://www.naturalnews.com/046644_MMR_vaccine_autism_scientific_fraud.html##ixzz3SoV3Sljs

Good luck! I see FRONT PAGE headlines in your future…….

CALLING ALL OREGON ANTI-VAXXERS:
This is all you need:
Google:
client=safari&rls=en&q=WHO+%22Global+Manual+on+Surveillance+of+Adverse+Events+Following+Immunization%22&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8
Click on the one with PDF file at top.

and this….

“Statement on RISK vs Benefit of Vaccinations by David Satcher, M.D., PH.D.
Assistant Secretary for Health and Surgeon General
U.S. Public Health Service
U.S. Department of Health and Human Services

Before the House Committee on Government Reform
August 3, 1999

…Vaccine approval also REQUIRES the provision of adequate PRODUCT LABELING to allow health care providers to understand the vaccine’s proper use, including its POTENTIAL benefits and RISKS, in order TO COMMUNICATE with patients and PARENTS and to SAFELY deliver the vaccine to the public. Vaccines are also subject to lot release testing and protocol review to further ENSURE their quality.

Although extensive studies are REQUIRED for licensure, post-marketing research and surveillance are necessary to identify SAFETY issues which may only arise or be detected FOLLOWING vaccination of a much larger population. Rare events may not come to light before licensure, or, if noted, the evidence may not be adequate to prove that such events were due to a vaccine. The Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) is a valuable post-marketing tool for just such safety surveillance. I will describe VAERS later in the testimony. In addition, post-marketing STUDIES of a SPECIFIC vaccine are REQUIRED by FDA in order to obtain additional SAFETY or other data. Also, after licensure, MONITORING of the product and of production activities, including periodic facility inspections, MUST CONTINUE as long as the manufacturer holds a LICENSE for the product.

No system is perfect and NO medicine or VACCINE can EVER be GUARANTEED to be 100 percent FREE OF possible side effects or ADVERSE EVENTS, particularly when administered to millions of people. For these reasons, the Department, its constituent agencies (FDA, CDC, NIH, HRSA), the scientific community, and industry strive for continuous improvements in VACCINE SAFETY. Speaking for the Department and its agencies, we WELCOME all constructive input and CRITICISM in this regard….”
http://www.hhs.gov/asl/testify/t990803a.html

NOTE: You can’t have informed consent AND forced vaccination.
ALL VACCINES CARRY RISK.

“In addition, post-marketing STUDIES of a SPECIFIC vaccine are REQUIRED by FDA in order to obtain additional SAFETY or other data.”

Here is what coauthor and WHISTLEBLOWER Dr. William Thompson had to say about one of these studies:

““FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE-AUGUST 27,2014

STATEMENT OF WILLIAM W. THOMPSON, Ph.D., REGARDING THE 2004 ARTICLE EXAMINING THE POSSIBILITY OF A RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN MMR VACCINE AND AUTISM

My name is William Thompson. I am a Senior Scientist with the Centers for Disease Control and
Prevention, where I have worked since 1998.

I regret that my coauthors and I omitted statistically significant information in our 2004 article published in the journal Pediatrics. The omitted data suggested that African American males who received the MMR vaccine before age 36 months were at increased risk for autism. Decisions were made regarding which findings to report after the data were collected, and I believe that the final study protocol was not followed…..

My concern has been the decision to omit relevant findings in a particular study for a particular sub­ group for a particular vaccine. There have always been recognized risks for vaccination and I believe it is the responsibility of the CDC to properly convey the risks associated with receipt of those vaccines.”
http://www.morganverkamp.com/august-27-2014-press-release-statement-of-william-w-thompson-ph-d-regarding-the-2004-article-examining-the-possibility-of-a-relationship-between-mmr-vaccine-and-autism/

NOTE: NOTHING has been done to investigate this. Thompson has not testified. He sent an estimated 100,000 pages of related CDC documents to Congressman Bill Posey on Sept. 8, 2014. No statement has been made to the public regarding this and the documents have not been made available to the public. Call the House Space, Science, and Technology Committee and demand to know what is in them so you can have informed consent regarding any future vaccinations.

#42 CORRECTION. Google the following:
WHO “Global Manual on Surveillance of Adverse Events Following Immunization”
Click on the one with PDF file at top

Oregon anti-vaxxers:

Take a tip from Angelina Jolie :
Tell them you won’t vaccinate until ALL children have “safe” vaccines….
http://www.morganverkamp.com/august-27-2014-press-release-statement-of-william-w-thompson-ph-d-regarding-the-2004-article-examining-the-possibility-of-a-relationship-between-mmr-vaccine-and-autism/

And don’t forget,
NEVER FORGET!
MISSISSIPPI 99.7 % vaccination coverage
http://www.msdh.state.ms.us/msdhsite/_static/23,15969,341.html

MISSISSIPPI 38% African-American population
https://www.census.gov/newsroom/releases/archives/facts_for_features_special_editions/cb12-ff01.html

MISSISSIPPI 1 in 88- AUTISM rate. A 563% RISE in the number of public school children with autism in the past 11 years.
http://www.dmh.ms.gov/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/2013-MAAC-Report-Final_1.13.2014.pdf

@ #34 Dangerous Bacon

“while inviting any non-fraudulent antivax proponent with scientific credentials and published research respected in the medical community to testify.”

As opposed to pro-vax scientists who said things like this IN 1966?

“All of this has now changed. With the isolation of the measles virus
and extensive field testing of several potent and effective vaccines, the tools are at hand to eradicate the infection.With the general application of these tools during the coming months, eradication can be achieved in this country in the year 1967.”
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1919891/pdf/pubhealthreporig00027-0069.pdf

REALLY?

Dear Toto:

Thorsen is working in Denmark. He’s not under arrest, and he won’t be getting extradited to the US anytime soon. Also, charges against him in Denmark were dismissed.

Currently Dr. Thorsen (and he is still a Doctor – unlike Wakefield, his license to practice medicine hasn’t been stripped) is I believe working as a GYN either in Odense or somewhere on Jutland.

@Darwy: I don’t think I knew about Thorsen’s charges being dismissed in Denmark. Do you have a link please?

Thanks,

Becky.

#46 Thanks for the update Darwy!
Mr. Thorsen is still very much WANTED in Atlanta, Georgia.
The Grand Jury charges have NOT been dropped. Thorsen’s DeKalb County house: http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/2657-Briarlake-Rd-NE-Atlanta-GA-30345/14552734_zpid/ (notice that the 2006 sell date matches the itemized Grand Jury count), cars, and motorcycle have not yet been sold to REPAY the CDC and the citizens of Georgia: The U.S. can put DIPLOMATIC pressure on this case. Thorsen’s CDC reports, paid for by U.S. taxpayers, were used to “defend” vaccine safety. http://www.rescuepost.com/files/thorsen-indictment.pdf
His protocols have been formally questioned. Between his unresolved alleged criminal activity and the admitted scientific fraud of CDC senior scientist, William Thompson, and the SUPRESSION of his released estimated 100,000 pages of CDC documents, IT IS NO WONDER THAT CITIZENS QUESTION VACCINE SAFETY!

Brian Deer: We need you do an investigative report on Poul Thorsen.
WE ARE TIRED OF WAKEFIELD! WE ARE TIRED OF CDC CORRUPTION!

@Becky

Apparently they’ve brought new charges against him – forgery.

It’s not double jeopardy (not that that exists in DK anyhow), but I doubt these charges will go any further, it’s been nearly 3 years.

Ah, Toto’s found a new thread to run up and down with his underpants on his head. It is a harmless outlet.

…and I have to mention, should Brian Deer come to Copenhagen, I’d be more than happy to give him the 10dkk tour.

“Here we have Statens Serum Institute, Panum Institute…”

Beer included.

@Darwy
So, is his house just going to sit there until it falls down?
Why would an innocent man FLEE THE COUNTRY?
Is any one living in the Atlanta house?
Regardless, HIS REPUTATION IS RUINED.

@Toto

“Flee the country”

Oh, you mean he WENT HOME. That’s what people do after they’ve been on a trip. THEY GO HOME.

I would agree his reputation as a researcher is ruined. That’s why he pursued other qualifications, and is now employed with them.

Toto,

The argument you are making seems to be:

Wakefield is a fraud. He is anti-vaccine.
Thorson is a crook. He is pro vaccine.

Therefore……….?

What exactly is your argument?

“Statens Serum Institute”
Looks like the Danish version of the CDC. Is the “good old boys” club surrounding the wagons? U.S. citizens take note!

Interestingly, Denmark is now IPV. Doesn’t that conflict with countries using OPV?

Well, NO MORE DANISH COOKIES or Hans Christian Anderson stories for me! And I won’t be visiting the very Little Mermaid until it gets below freezing in a very warm place.

DARWY: “Hey Brian! Here’s D’Beer!”
I AM SURE THAT HE WOULD NEVER SUCCUMB TO SUCH A CHEAP SHOT.

@Darwy

Excuse me? Our Federal government has listed him as a “fugitive” and put him on a MOST WANTED LIST because he unlawfully left the country (fled) in order to avoid facing trial for the GRAND JURY INDICTMENTS. This is serious stuff.
ANTI-VAXXERS, PLEASE TAKE NOT OF THIS PERSON’S CALLOUS DISREGARD FOR OUR LAWS. WOULD YOU ENTRUST THE SAFETY OF YOUR CHILD WITH SOMEONE SUCH AS HIM??????

“The argument you are making seems to be:
Wakefield is a fraud”

Nope. I know nothing of the case. I AM JUST SICK OF HEARING HIS NAME, WHEN IT IS TOTALLY IRRELEVANT.
If you have a scientific reason to invoke the name “Wakefield”, then please follow it with a well reasoned CITED (link) statement.
Your faux “neurolinguistic propaganda” has fallen flat.

THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN
THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN.

Sadmar: We’re way past ‘proving vaccines cause autism’. Vaccines cause everything, because the parents say so. And it doesn’t matter if they’re wrong. They’ve got rights, and it’s none of Big Guvment’s business!.

And this is why no amount of facts will work, even if the parents hadn’t slept through high school biology. Taking vaccines away for a few years in places like Marin or instituting a two or three tier system in the doctor’s office is much more likely to work. Like for instance, if the family doesn’t vaccinate, they have to wait in the waiting room with no toys, or the doctor makes sure to praise other families in their presence.

<killfile>

If you have a scientific reason to invoke the name “Wakefield”, then please follow it with a well reasoned CITED (link) statement.
Your faux “neurolinguistic propaganda” has fallen flat.

THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN
THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN THORSEN.

Heh.

<killfile>

I just love the idea that we have a commenter who has given themselves the nickname of a professional wrestler.

It’s ok, Toto, I smelll what “The Rock” is cooking.

a-non: I hope Dwayne Johnson sues Toto for slander. Actually, from what I hear, he’s intelligent, whereas Toto would lose a game of chess to a mass of algae.

SSI is more or less the Danish counterpart to the CDC, with a few notable distinctions – it does fall directly under the auspices of the Ministry of Health, it is the producer for all the vaccines used on the Danish vaccine schedule, and has an excellent record of research publications and opportunities for PhD scholarships.

As far as Thorsen, he’s practicing medicine. That’s what doctors do. Unless they’ve had their license revoked.

Toto, Wakefield is being discussed because, as per the OP, he was invited by some berks to testify to the Oregon legislature…

By the way, you (and anyone else) do realise how difficult it is to actually get struck off by the GMC over here, don’t you? You really do have to try hard and screw up most royally. And to be removed from (so I am informed by someone in a position to know) from fellowship of a Royal College…

It is not coincidental that Wakefield hightailed it out of here, as his name is now officially “The disgraced former doctor” Wakefield.

http://tinyurl.com/no65ams (w. links to video)
“Freshman congressman Barry Loudermilk, (R – GA) hosted his first town hall meeting last week. On vaccines, he told the crowd:

I believe it’s the parents’ decision whether to immunize or not. – most of our children, we didn’t immunize. They’re healthy. Of course, home schooling, we didn’t have to get the mandatory immunization.

He was responding to a question about whether there’s been a cover-up in certain studies about the link between autism and the MMR vaccine. He continued:

The Committees on Energy and Commerce and Government Oversight are already looking into this issue, and we’ve been assured they will continue to investigate the matter fully. We look forward to hearing the findings of both committees.

Loudermilk was recently named to the Science, Space and Technology Committee.

Toto, Wakefield is being discussed because, as per the OP, he was invited by some berks to testify to the Oregon legislature…

You’re failing to grasp that Tutu doesn’t actually read the posts; all comment threads, by definition, are about Tutu.

I note how Handley miscalculates the number of vaccines given “before” the age of 6 years again, arriving at a total of 37 when some are given only at 6 years (not before) and some can be combined.
He also tells blatant lies about the vaccine schedules for other countries. For example:
Norway is 15 (not 13)
Iceland is 16 (not 11)
Sweden is 15 (not 11)
Denmark is 16 (not 14)
Japan has 21 (not 11)

If he has such a great scientific case against vaccines, why does he need to lie?

Handley also lies about the combination vaccines – he says Merck states that: “Routine administration of DTP and/or oral polio vaccine is not recommended because there is limited data on the simultaneous administration of these vaccines.”

Huh?
Is he trying to kid them that we are still back in the 1980s, when we used to give OPV and DTP vaccines? Neither of these is in current use routinely, so why does he even mention them?

…he says Merck states that: “Routine administration of DTP and/or oral polio vaccine is not recommended because there is limited data on the simultaneous administration of these vaccines.”

Strange that neither Handley nor any of the antivaxers reading this seem to draw the obvious inference: that, contrary to what they repeatedly claim, the effects of giving multiple vaccines together are studied and recommendations are based on the outcomes of those studies. To hear them talk you’d think the pediatric vaccine schedule was decided by throwing darts.

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