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Under the microscope: Antivaxxers find “impurities” in COVID-19 vaccines

Antivaxxers are looking at COVID-19 vaccines under the microscope and finding “horrifying” things. This is an old antivax and quack technique that has long produced hilariously ridiculous results.

Every thing old is new again. I know that my readers probably get tired of my saying this, but it’s true. Since the pandemic began, there is not a single piece of misinformation about COVID-19 vaccines or single technique of portraying them as horrifically dangerous that is new. Be they weaponizing VAERS to blame vaccines for death and destruction, claiming that vaccines are “sterilizing our women,” portraying them as laden with frighteningly awful “toxins,” or many others, the antivax tropes reborn for COVID-19 vaccines that are shocking those previously oblivious to them are simply repackagings, tweaks, and reinventions of old antivax tropes that I’ve been writing about for nearly two decades. There is, however, one that I hadn’t seen yet (or at least hadn’t written about yet), and that’s when antivaxxers start looking at vaccines under the microscope. That changed when I saw this doozy of an article on that center of all quackery, antivaccine nonsense, and conspiracy theories on the Internet, Mike Adam’s website Natural News, in the form of a story entitled, SHOCK: German physicians discover “astonishing” impurities in COVID “vaccine.” Predictably (at least to those of us who’ve been following the antivaccine movement, it involves antivax “scientists” looking at COVID-19 vaccines under a microscope and finding…things, horrifying things…although I will give them credit for going on step beyond what antivaxxers used to do and finding “impurities” in the blood of the vaccinated as well:

A group of German doctors and researchers have become the latest to find substantial impurities in COVID-19 vaccines as well as the blood of vaccinated individuals.

As reported by the RAIR Foundation, the pathologists presented an analysis complete with video and photos of the vaccine during a shocking but little-publicized press conference in September, a clip of which has been translated for the organization.

According to the video and presentation, foreign objects were discovered in the vaccines along with the blood of some people who were given the jabs.

“Some of the foreign objects were described as ‘accurately constructed’ and also — shockingly — worms that were hatched from eggs,” the foundation said in a report.

Unsurprisingly:

The live-streamed press conference was organized by the Stiftung Corona-Ausschuss, which can be loosely described as Germany’s equivalent of America’s Frontline Doctors. As expected, their remarkable presentation was slammed by the German legacy media.

America’s Frontline Doctors, you might recall, is a group of quacks who came to prominence during the summer of 2020 for promoting the use of hydroxychloroquine as a “miracle cure” for COVID-19, moved on to promoting the anthelminthic drug ivermectin as—you guessed it!—a miracle cure for COVID-19, and are now promoting a cocktail of drugs for the “early treatment of COVID-19.” So seeing the German version of America’s Frontline Doctors pull a stunt like this definitely tracks.

I’ll get to the German report in a moment, but first I’d like to take a little time to briefly recount a some history of quacks and antivaxxers misusing microscopes. The first example that really caught my attention wasn’t about vaccines, though. Rather, it occurred in 2013, when Mike Adams decided that he’d take a microscope and look at Chicken McNuggets. Hilarity definitely ensued. Adams posted breathless announcements that I will not link to here—you can find the links in my post about it from back then if you really must see them—and inadvertently provided a treasure trove of unintentional humor for anyone who was the least bit knowledgeable about science or microscopy, although unfortunately the science-challenged thought Adams’ “science” was slam-dunk evidence of how evil McDonalds was. Adams was so very, very alarmed, saying that “microscopic photos reveal an alien-like landscape with weird shapes and fibers.” To me he sounded like someone who’d never looked at common every day objects under a microscope before. After all, pretty much every object, if you magnify it enough, will reveal an “alien-like landscape with weird shapes” and, possibly, depending on what you’re looking at, fibers. When I looked at the images published by Adams, the “hair-like” objects that he found looked like dust to me, while the black dots looked like pepper and the red and green dots that he showed could easily have been seasoning of some sort. Some of the “fibers” looked like nothing more than muscle fibers, given that meat is muscle. At the time, I characterized Adams as Inspector Clouseau with a microscope.

Adams wasn’t alone in such silliness. A physician named Dr. Richard deShazo actually got a study published in the American Journal of Medicine in which he formalin-fixed Chicken McNuggets and then looked at them under the microscope. He was then amazed to find that there was skin, connective tissue, nerves, fat, bone spicules, and blood vessels in the McNuggets. Seriously, everyone knows that McNuggets are made of the “leftover” parts of the chicken. Why was anyone surprised? But Dr. deShazo managed to get a brief flurry of media attention back in the day. As I like to say, though, this technique of misidentifying common things under the microscope has to be a key reason for the whole concept of Morgellon’s disease, in which what are almost certainly common fibers found on almost everything that comes into contact with human clothes and hair are misidentified as “parasites” or “worms” causing the symptoms.

Given that people like Adams like to look at things under the microscope and misidentify what they see as something disgusting and horrible, all to try to frighten people, it shouldn’t be surprising that antivaxxers have done the same thing with vaccines. The most notable example I can recall occurred in 2017, when two Italian antivaccine “scientists,” Antonietta Gatti and Stefano Montanari, looked at various vaccines under an electron microscope and reported finding all sorts of horrible things, like aluminum crystals from the aluminum-containing adjuvant that must have formed under the vacuum necessary to do electron microscopy. The authors included a series of photomicrographs of all sorts of particles that they found after evaporating 44 vaccines from four different countries, touting how they had found 1,821 particles in the vaccines. As I put it at the time (Skeptical Raptor as well), the investigators thought that what they had found was that vaccines were contaminated with all sorts of inorganic metals. What they really found was that the amount of inorganic contamination was so low as to be biologically irrelevant. In fact, what they found was that vaccines were incredibly pure products.

The saga of Antonietta Gatti and Stefano Montanari is a fairly amusing one, too, because after that paper was published, they lashed out at critics. Unsurprisingly, they soon descended deeper and deeper into conspiracy theories after Italian authorities started investigating them for financial chicanery. In any case, they provided yet further evidence of a new quack idea about vaccines and “contaminants,” namely that nanoparticles in vaccines, medicines, food, and water are the “one true cause” of disease. In that context, it shouldn’t be surprising that antivaxxers have been trying to portray the lipid nanoparticles used in the Pfizer and Moderna mRNA-base COVID-19 vaccines as horrific “toxins.”

Gatti and Montanari aren’t along among antivaxxers misusing microscopes. Does anyone remember Christopher Exley? For a while, he was a fairly frequent topic here at the ol’ blog, given his penchant for demonizing aluminum adjuvants in vaccines. I’ll give it to him, though. He went beyond just looking at vaccines under a microscope and fired up his fluorescence microscope to look at the brains of autistic people and produce pretty pictures designed to terrify, by claiming that the aluminum from vaccines was depositing in the brain and causing autism.

Which brings us back to the German group.

First, I must point out here that I had never heard of the RAIR Foundation before; so I had to go to its website and see for myself what the group was:

RAIR Foundation USA (Rise Align Ignite Reclaim) is a grassroots activist organization comprised of everyday Americans leading a movement to reclaim our Republic from the network of individuals and organizations waging war on Americans, our Constitution, our borders and our Judeo-Christian values.

RAIR is an integrated media platform amplifying the voices of the silent majority, while informing the citizenry of the daily assaults on freedom and fostering grassroots leaders and activists in order to combat the threats from Islamic supremacists, radical leftists and their allies. 

Using RAIR’s “Four Pillar” strategy of Education, Community, Action and Coalition; RAIR’s grassroots-based approach empowers citizens to neutralize these attacks on their communities.

RAIR’s bottom-up approach to neutralizing the attacks on our liberties has the potential to shift the power back to the citizens. RAIR will document the activities of key subversive players that currently enjoy little scrutiny in the current media landscape, exposing their activities and creating strategies to counter them. RAIR will unleash unprecedented citizen activism and cultivate community leaders, filling a gaping void in the movement for liberty.

Oddly enough, I didn’t see anything about the RAIR Foundation being a scientific enterprise. I did rapidly find from its news stories about “heroes” that it is virulently anti-(vaccine) mandate, antimask, and anti-anything that requires collective action to slow the spread of COVID-19 and that it is very credulous when it comes to bad science. (For example, it promoted the ridiculous idea that COVID-19 vaccines make you magnetic.) Given that the articles in Natural News and on the RAIR Foundation website were so ridiculous, I went to the source, the actual press conference held in September led by Prof. Dr. Arne Burkhardt, who reportedly served as “head of the Institute of Pathology in Reutlingen for 18 years and then worked as a pathologist in private practice”, Prof. Dr. Walter Lang, who reportedly “worked as a pathologist at the Hannover Medical School from 1968 to 1985” before founding a private institute for pathology in Hanover, and Prof. Dr. Werner Birkholz, a former professor of electrical engineering with a focus on quality and risk management at Jacobs University in Bremen. They were introduced by Dr. Ute Langer, a physician, and a surgeon (because of course there had to be a surgeon in there to embarrass me as a fellow surgeon).

It’s hard not to point out that Burkhardt has recently published a preprint that is being promoted by Steve Kirsch (remember him?) claiming to show that 93% of those who died after COVID-19 vaccination were killed by the vaccine. (So much misinformation, so little of me, but I might have to go over that study at some point, given that it appears to be gaining traction.) Let’s just say that the study is…not good.

But what about the images? There are two that have been commonly shared, starting with this one:

COVID vaccine under the microscope
All I see are bubbles, maybe lipid nanoparticles too, and…something…that could be a salt crystal of some kind.

I’m rather underwhelmed. For one thing, not a lot of detail was given regarding how this study was done. You can, if you want, go to the video at around the 2:01 mark. (Yes, the video is over three hours long, and, no, I didn’t watch the whole thing, as it’s an inefficient use of my time and the video is mind-meltingly dumb.) Here it is, and, if you note the translation below, these doctors were speculating that it could be “chips”:

To me it looks like it’s a tiny crystal or fragment that could easily have come from the slides, the coverslips, or from any of the handling of the “leftover” Pfizer/BioNTech vaccines that were supposedly examined. Personally, as was the case with Gatti and Montanarri, I marveled at how hard these antivaxxers had to search to find even just two examples of these crystal-like contaminants. Here’s the thing. We have the tools to figure out exactly what these things are, external contaminants from the environment or something in the vaccine itself, and exactly what. Why do these “scientists” not use these tools and pursue a line of investigation that could tell us what they are? The reason is simple: It’s easier to scare the rubes this way, and further investigation could easily reveal that these “contaminants” are air bubbles, salt crystals, hair, or textile fibers. Seriously, to the pathologists out there: Look at the video, starting around the 2 hour mark, and tell me what you see in the videos shown! I realize that many of these images are darkfield microscopy, which is known to produce much more dramatic-looking images of things, but geez.

Next up:

COVID-19 vaccine under microscope
This looks like hair or a fiber to me.

Worms? Do even laypeople think these are “worms”? They are not. They are likely fibers from the sorts of cleaning cloths or papers used to wipe slides.

Then there’s this, which they claim to look like a “SIM card” from a phone, the implication being that this is one of the dreaded “chips” being put into the vaccines to track us:

A SIM card in the vaccine under the microscope?
No, this is not a SIM card. It is most likely a salt crystal.

I had to stop here. I couldn’t take the ridiculousness any more.

Unfortunately, this group of German antivaxxers is hardly the only group doing this sort of thing. An anonymous doctor on Twitter who claims to have “published over 100 peer-reviewed papers (e.g. NEJM, The Lancet, PNAS)” but won’t reveal his name. I’m embedding the Tweets so that you can see his photos, or you can look at the thread here as well:

This led to some thoughts that I shared that are applicable to all of these dubious “analyses”:

This is rather what I said about the German photomicrographs. You have the tools to figure out what these things are. Why didn’t use them?

And:

An excellent question!
My reaction exactly whenever these quacks get all huffy about criticism.

Elsewhere, a real pediatric hematologist agreed with what I had thought about a lot of those little round dark spots namely that they are nothing more than air bubbles:

Exactly as I thought, and one reason why more of them are reported near the edges of the slide could be that the bubbles are rising (as bubbles do), which will often lead them to the edge of the coverslip.

Then, of course, there’s Dr. Carrie Madej. She’s the one who claimed that mRNA-based vaccines are “transhumanism” (which, believe it or not, is not a new claim for mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccines. What’s she been up to now? She’s been claiming to see contaminants in COVID-19 vaccines that (she’s claiming) are hydra:

Madej noticed something else quite strange: “There was one particular object or organism, I’m not sure what to call it, that had tentacles coming from it. It was able to lift itself up off of the glass slide. It appeared to be self-aware, or to be able to grow or move in space.”

She found it disturbing but said she thought, “Maybe that was a fluke in a way, maybe that was just that one vial.”

And:

Madej believes the tentacled entity she found in the Moderna jabs has a connection with the organism hydra vulgaris. “It is one of the model organisms that the transhumanists like to study and look at. They feel that this is an amazing organism for humanity,” said Madej, in part because “it’s immortal in the lab setting” and “continuously produces its own stem cells.”

“It never stops. You can chop it up into little bits, put it in a petri dish and it forms itself again and again,” she continued. “They’re thinking, wouldn’t this be great if we could put this inside of a human body’s genome, and then if your hand was chopped off by a trauma, you could grow a new hand.”

The other reason the transhumanists are interested in the hydra, said Madej, is that it “has its own neural network,” that looks like a human nerve, and when [gathered together] “can form a mesh network, they actually can communicate between each other, almost like if you had your own intranet inside your body.” She noted that then “something outward could affect it, like an impulse, a frequency, something from 5G, a light, a magnet. What if something influenced that communication network?”

No. Just no. Seriously, no. Just look for yourself. Here is an actual hydra:

An actual hydra.

This is Madej’s pareidolia:

Not a Hydra
Not a hydra. Not that a hydra would be able to survive the sterilization process for the vaccines, anyway.

And don’t even get me started on the whole “graphene” issue. That very well might have to be its own post.

I’ll just conclude by reemphasizing how everything old is new again. No one should be the least bit surprised that antivaxxers are looking at COVID-19 vaccines under the microscope without telling you how they were stored and handled, finding various fibers, bubbles, and contaminants under the microscope, not bothering to use more advanced methods to figure out just what they are or whether they were extrinsic and introduced during handling, and then showing cherry picked photomicrographs to frighten you. It’s what antivaxxers have been doing for a long, long time for all vaccines.

By Orac

Orac is the nom de blog of a humble surgeon/scientist who has an ego just big enough to delude himself that someone, somewhere might actually give a rodent's posterior about his copious verbal meanderings, but just barely small enough to admit to himself that few probably will. That surgeon is otherwise known as David Gorski.

That this particular surgeon has chosen his nom de blog based on a rather cranky and arrogant computer shaped like a clear box of blinking lights that he originally encountered when he became a fan of a 35 year old British SF television show whose special effects were renowned for their BBC/Doctor Who-style low budget look, but whose stories nonetheless resulted in some of the best, most innovative science fiction ever televised, should tell you nearly all that you need to know about Orac. (That, and the length of the preceding sentence.)

DISCLAIMER:: The various written meanderings here are the opinions of Orac and Orac alone, written on his own time. They should never be construed as representing the opinions of any other person or entity, especially Orac's cancer center, department of surgery, medical school, or university. Also note that Orac is nonpartisan; he is more than willing to criticize the statements of anyone, regardless of of political leanings, if that anyone advocates pseudoscience or quackery. Finally, medical commentary is not to be construed in any way as medical advice.

To contact Orac: [email protected]

70 replies on “Under the microscope: Antivaxxers find “impurities” in COVID-19 vaccines”

You know what’s hilarious? Thinking it’s acceptable not to disclose ingredients in an injectable. Why don’t you enlighten your exhausted readers with a full list of the ingredients, since attempts to figure that out tickle your funny bone so much.

Read the text carefully. It just tells you that what is listed below are ingredients but it doesn’t say the list is exhaustive. However, see:

“Upon licensure of the Pfizer vaccine, the FDA authorized a fact sheet to be given to the public, which includes a list of ingredients in the vaccine. Amazingly, this list doesn’t mention a secret ingredient. What is the secret ingredient? Nobody knows other than Pfizer and the FDA. In the technical documentation that is not intended for general public distribution, the FDA disclosed that this secret ingredient constitutes about 22% of the undiluted vial (0.45 mL of 2 mL) but completely redacted the name of the secret ingredient.”
https://vaccinefreedom.wordpress.com/2021/09/24/hidden-ingredient-in-pfizer-shot/

In fact, since the full list of ingredients has not been disclosed, it is impossible to speak of informed consent and so participation in this experiment is contarry to article 1 of the Nuremburg Code.

@Timothy Drayton
I did read the fact sheet closely – can you please indicate where this ‘secret ingredient’ is listed on the fact sheet? Could it be that they are referring to the ‘Water for Injection (UNII: 059QF0KO0R)’, listed under Sucrose in table 2? Seems to be listed pretty clearly in the link they provided (https://www.fda.gov/media/151733/download), and I know that there’s no way that they are making a mountain out of a mole-hill…

Now that you have this (non-) issue cleared up, I guess that you can finally retire with the Nuremburg Code stuff and go get vaccinated.

It was nice of him to answer your question. Does that help?

I’m not exhausted actually. Were there too many words for you?

Maybe you could use thirty seconds of your own time to find the package insert in pdf at the website of your local equivanent of FDA or EMA? It takes about 30 seconds.
Same for any other injectables.

I feel sad that all these people never had their own microscope when they were growing up. Never took it out of the little wooden cabinet and looked at a hair, or a piece of skin.

It’s also kind of sad that they try to pull the BS they do now.

Let’s see (from the package insert, available at the fda website):
Each 0.3 mL dose of the COMIRNATY supplied in multiple dose vials with purple caps and labels with purple borders also includes the following ingredients: lipids (0.43 mg ((4-hydroxybutyl)azanediyl)bis(hexane-6,1-diyl)bis(2-hexyldecanoate), 0.05 mg 2-(polyethylene glycol 2000)-N,N-ditetradecylacetamide, 0.09 mg 1,2-distearoyl-sn-glycero-3-phosphocholine, and 0.2 mg cholesterol), 0.01 mg potassium chloride, 0.01 mg monobasic potassium phosphate, 0.36 mg sodium chloride, 0.07 mg dibasic sodium phosphate dihydrate, and 6 mg sucrose. The diluent (sterile 0.9% Sodium Chloride
Injection, USP) contributes an additional 2.16 mg sodium chloride per dose.
COMIRNATY does not contain preservative.

Seriously, low magnification microscopes are so much fun! A couple of years ago I discovered that the thing in the lab I thought was an immersible temperature sensor reader was actually a low magnification video microscope.

We had such fun with it that first day, looking at our hands and gloves and the ends of every tool in the lab! It has a serious business use too, and we use it for that, but it’s so much fun to get a really up-close look at ordinary stuff.

(A while back I watched part of a video where some folks had purchased a video-camera-enabled ear cleaning device and it was hilarious how utterly disgusting they found the inside of their own ears. Like, did they not expect there to be hairs and wax up there?)

Yup. I’ll add that I found it interesting to compare lines made from pencils, ballpoint pens, and fountain pens under the one we had. Obviously not medical related, but they were cool to see.

Exploring nature as a child with the microscope in a wood box!!!! One of my childhood pastimes! The microscope was first my older brother’s and I inherited it when he got a better one. There was also a Gilbert chemistry set (not the one with radioactive materials) that we shared, it also had a wood box. I’m betraying my age! We both excelled in the sciences, my PhD brother attained degrees in botany & plant biochemistry. I’m both an RN and Clinical Laboratory Scientist (loads of microscopy experience in a lab) and I did graduate study in public & environmental health and hospital administration. Professionally, I alternated between nursing, lab, blood bank, and healthcare management for about 50 years.

Yet again, reinforcing the kinship among cranks everywhere. No difference among these images, blobsquatch and UFOs.

IKR? With this stuff under the microscope, it’s either pareidolia, misidentifying routine things like dust, or poor sample preparation.

This is hilarious, Orac! ** But why do they always identify “creatures” that look like fibres or hairs?
Unfortunately, the garbage I survey includes advice by poorly educated altie loons who discuss self-treatment ( or quack prescribed) HCQ or ivermecton, supplements and foods that strengthen immunity.

** however even this might be interpreted by the unsophisticated as a reason to avoid vaccination so not so funny.

Using dark field microscopy and polarized light can make very mundane things very dramatic. It doesn’t give them meaning, it just makes them look dramatic. See the images above.

One more thing,

So, RAIS is “…leading a movement to reclaim our Republic from the network of individuals and organizations waging war on Americans, our Constitution, our borders and our Judeo-Christian values…”. So who might that be? Sounds like Donald Trump to me.

Yeah, the whole “our borders” and “Judeo-Christian values” – that dog whistle is so loud and so low anyone can hear it.

Even if the pictures weren’t absurd I’d hardly take anything from white supremacists at face value.

Has anyone who is not a rightwing bigot ever seriously used the phrase “our Judeo-Christian values”? Not to mention, if you ever actually talk to a Jewish person about their religion and values, it’s pretty clear “Judeo-Christian” is mainly a way for Christian supremacists to pretend the Jewish people are somehow no longer a thing.

It seems to me that the only time a Jewish person uses the term “Judeo-Christian”, in when they are being interviewed on right-wing media. Maybe as a way to say, ‘I don’t think you’re anti-Semitic’?

In my bit of Europe, it would mean that we try to be inclusive but we’re still morons because we keep ignoring the massive heritage of Classical Antiquity and all the sources they drew from.

Coincidentally, I spent a few hours with a classical microscope today (actually, with two microscopes) .
My main findings are that the lenses are scratched and dirty. The x40 objective had traces of immersion oil. Careless. I blame the colleagues (I barely touched these microscopes before). Although I may have unwittingly added one scratch.
I can also tell you my lab have some fungus spores in suspension in the air. Also also, I suspect a colleague touched the stack of glass slides with their bare hands. Or my gloves picked-up some dirt. There were fibers and skin fragments.
Also one eyelash. Maybe part of me wanted to reenact that scene from the movie Gattaca.

To think I could have posted pictures of my slides as proof of alien probing or something…
I will work on cleaning my lab benches. Seems more urgent.

I’ve been accustomed to seeing microscopic stray junk in cytology preparations despite “rigorous hygiene standards”. If I’d reported those objects, it would’ve made for some entertaining diagnoses.

On the other hand Dr. John indicates he not only washed his hands but also maintained the cold chain, so that undoubtedly means that when I got the Moderna vaccine and booster shot there were horrifying hydras injected directly into my bloodstream. Looking on the bright side, I’ve now got all the stem cells I’ll ever need.

Re vaccine-induced transhumanism, don’t miss Wayne McRoy’s 2019 book “The Autism Epidemic: Transhumanism’s Dirty Little Secret” to get the lowdown on what our Satanic Pharma Masters have been doing.

Thankfully, I’ve found a source of N95 paper bags to wear over my head to cover the shame of being in the same field as those German RAIR pathologists.*

*one hopes they are emeritus (i.e. retired) types.

I won’t be able to read this post in detail till tonight, but I just had to comment on a couple of those photomicrographs. The first one looks like a tiny submarine. Is this a mashup of Yellow Submarine and Fantastic Voyage? Wow man.
The “SIM card” one is even weirder. That looks like a tiny planet with rings – an ultramicroscopic Saturn if you will. Is it Whoville, by any chance? Is Horton the elephant available to verify this? Takes me back to my childhood (and parenthood).

Am I being silly? Perhaps, but no more silly than the antivaxxers’ interpretations.

In the”SIM card” photo that Orac posted, I thought what was supposed to be the “SIM card” was the bluish-grey rhombus with bright edges slightly to the left of, and below, the “rings of Saturn”. It sort-of looks like an image of a computer chip taken from an oblique angle.

Even if it is a SIM card, I’m not sure what it’s supposed to do, because SIM cards don’t do much on their own.

Me, I’m still waiting for the 5G reception in my COVID vaccines to kick in so that I can ditch my mobile phone. Do I need my booster before that happens? 😉

It’s way too small to be a SIM card. It’s certainly too small to be a radio transmitter, or a RFID.

The antivax Purity of Essence crowd has gotten bad news – a paper published in the journal Viruses that they were using as ammo against Covid-19 vaccines has earned an Expression of Concern. The paper suggested that SARS-CoV-2 might result in DNA damage, which morphed into antivaxers declaring that the vaccines would give you cancer. But not so fast:

https://retractionwatch.com/2022/01/13/covid-19-spike-protein-paper-earns-an-expression-of-concern/?fbclid=IwAR1bkGnl7QH5hjyDRaytjHkF0S5gm6S4rGgnDy1SToxTRZteRa-5rAos9sc

I wouldn’t mind seeing people on both sides going head to head in a live debate. It’s easy writing blogs etc, but can you handle the heat in a one on one?

Wooists and antivaxers who demand live “debates” are acknowledging that they can’t handle the heat of the printed word, and can only hope to obscure their ignorance and dishonesty through a form of theater.

@ Dr Dangerous:

Alties “..can’t handle the heat of the printed word” but they try to find ways to de-fuse or obscure written explication like Orac’s/ sceptics’ with their own writing:
— long discourses upon why SBM is wrong and why their altie path is correct
— long, dense articles about why discerning readers should “walk away from Wikipedia”
— broadcast harangues about the evils of vaccines/ meds/ pharma
— lionistion of other altie frauds and publishing their dreck
— creating films, shows, radio, broadcasts, videos, events, seminars/ webinars and alternate social media to counteract reality/ enlisting followers to do the same
— enlightening us about their own storied histories as healers/ and their persecution
— writing exposes of SBM advocates like Orac, Drs Fauci, Offitt etc illustrating their crimes and vast riches/ suing people

Sites like prn.live/ garynull.com and NN/ Brighteon are loaded with this type of material with new spoken and written BS being added daily. I hear/ read their crap and then see its variants spread in comments at RI.

I see Joe Rogan fans are talking about McCullough and Malone offering cash to debate them on Rogan’s show. Typical jock mentality being displayed: “You don’t want to fight, huh? You chicken or something?” I like Cara Santa Maria’s comment on recent SGU about Rogan: “He’s one of these people who believes the last thing he was told.”

head to head in a live debate.

You are confusing science with politics.

Anyway, let’ see.

Assertion by debater 1 (regardless of side (1) ):
“My janitor’s nephew’s girlfriend was changed into a newt by the vaccine!”

1 – What is debater 2 supposed to say to that?
2 – What would it do, aside proving that debater 2 can keep their poise and not descend into uncontrolled fits of jiggles?
3 – Would anyone in the audience change their mind hearing that answer?

(1) A pro-vax could say that. Frogs are naturally immune to Covid19, so that’s a good thing.

Are you really looking forward to a bullshitting contest?

It’s a shame that to many that scientific debate (via publications etc.) is ‘boring’, much prefer the drama and spectacle. It does explain much about where we are as a society.

Can you yourself make an good argument here ? If argument is made here, everyone could check the facts,. Not so easy when someone is lying during a debate.

Do you really think that posting the cocktail of ingredients in the Pfizer vaccine strengthened the vaccine proponents case.

N-ditetradecylacetamide

Uses advised against:
Food, drug, pesticide or biocidal product use.
Revision Number 5

fishersci.com/store/msds?partNumber=D1601&productDescription=N%2CN-DIMETHYLACETAMIDE+GC+HS+1L&vendorId=VN00033897&countryCode=US&language=en

hydroxybutyl

Hazard and precautionary statements Hazard statements (GHS US)
H302 – Harmful if swallowed
H315 – Causes skin irritation
H317 – May cause an allergic skin reaction H318 – Causes serious eye damage
H335 – May cause respiratory irritation
Precautionary statements (GHS US)
P261 – Avoid breathing mist, vapors
P264 – Wash hands, face, clothing thoroughly after handling P270 – Do not eat, drink or smoke when using this product P271 – Use only outdoors or in a well-ventilated area

parchem.com/siteimages/Attachment/GHS%204-Hydroxybutyl%20Acrylate%20MSDS.pdf

Tromethamine hydrochloride

Adverse effects may include respiratory depression, local irritation, tissue inflammation, injection site infection, febrile response, chemical phlebitis, venospasm, hypervolemia, IV thrombosis, extravasation (with possible necrosis and sloughing of tissues), transient decreases in blood glucose concentrations, hypoglycemia, and hepatocellular necrosis with infusion via low-lying umbilical venous catheters. (See Warnings under Cautions.)
drugs.com/sfx/tromethamine-side-effects.html

I’m curious, do you think the producers of vaccines are deliberately poisoning people and also openly telling people that’s what they’re doing, or is there something a little more subtle than that going on- and if so, what on earth do you think it is? Why would they tell us about these ingredients if they were so horrible?

Two of the three chemicals about which Edward complains aren’t in fact in the vaccines, anyway.

like a large corporation would never lie to the public about their ingredients or their harmful effects…..

nbcnews.com/health/health-news/johnson-johnson-knew-decades-asbestos-lurked-its-baby-powder-n948016

And the experts said…….
“Until recently, the American Cancer Society accepted the industry’s position, saying on its website: “All talcum products used in homes have been asbestos-free since the 1970s.”

That’s not the point that I’m making. Edward posted about two of the ingredients that are actually in the COVID vaccines, but then linked to MSDS sheets about two completely different chemicals.

He never produced any evidence that those two chemicals are in the vaccines.

Perhaps you’d like to. The two chemicals in question are N,N-Dimethylacetamide and
4-Hydroxybutyl Acrylate.

It is FDA that lists vaccine ingredients. This would be lying to regulators, which is not same thing as American Cancer Society’s advice.

DHMO is the leading cause of death in the US for children under 4 (4,000 people in the US died from DHMO) and world wide it causes over 250,000 deaths (according to WHO).

csun.edu/science/ref/humor/dhmo.html

or the petition at the COP16 meeting.

thenewamerican.com/cop16-attendees-sign-petitions-to-ban-water-harm-us/

N-ditetradecylacetamide
Causes skin or eye irritation, if big amount are involved
Hydroxybutyl
same thing (with may)
Tromethanine hydrochloride
Again may. there is another source
https://www.chemsrc.com/en/cas/1185-53-1_895497.html#:~:text=Trometamol%20hydrochloride%20%28Tromethamine%20hydrochloride%29%20is%20a%20biologically%20inert,compound%20for%20pH%20control%20in%20the%20physiological%20range.
Trometamol hydrochloride (Tromethamine hydrochloride) is a biologically inert amino alcohol of low toxicity, which buffers carbon dioxide and acids in vitro and in vivo. Trometamol hydrochloride is an effective amine compound for pH control in the physiological range[1].

The LD50 for tromethamine is 16.5 mM/kg. In other words, you’d need to infuse over 5 liters in a single setting to get a fatality. Dangerous stuff!

N,N-Dimethylacetamide isn’t in the Pfizer vaccine, N-ditetradecylacetamide is.

4-Hydroxybutyl Acrylate isn’t in the Pfizer vaccine, [(4-hydroxybutyl)azanediyl]di(hexane-6,1-diyl) bis(2-hexyldecanoate) is.

Tromethamine hydrochloride at least is actually in the Moderna vaccine and the Pfizer paediatric vaccine, but the side-effects page you linked to doesn’t say anything about how frequent those reactions are.

But in general, if you want to get worked up about the contents of vaccines, you should at least look up the MSDSs for the right chemicals.

I just used the link someone posted to the cdc website . I wasn’t complaining, Said “Do you really think that posting the cocktail of ingredients in the Pfizer vaccine strengthened the vaccine proponents case.” (similar to ALL the ingredients in peanut butter, somethings are things you don’t want to really know know)
Corysays:
January 14, 2022 at 2:14 pm
All the ingredient lists are available.

Pfizer – https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/Pfizer-BioNTech.html

Moderna – https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/Moderna.html

J&J – https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/different-vaccines/Janssen.html

2[(polyethylene glycol (PEG))-2000]-N,N-ditetradecylacetamide
1,2-distearoyl-sn-glycero-3-phosphocholine
Cholesterol (plant derived)
((4-hydroxybutyl)azanediyl)bis(hexane-6,1-diyl)bis(2-hexyldecanoate)

“I just used the link someone posted to the cdc website.”

Ha, you trust the CDC???

I don’t see either N,N-Dimethylacetamide or 4-Hydroxybutyl Acrylate in the lists you just posted, do you?

Why are links that you posted to the MSDS sheets for those chemicals in any way relevant to vaccines that don’t contain them?

I was in a debate whit a antiwaxer yesterday. And he used brownstone as his bullet proff argument. He linked to a article on brownstone ejere the headline is
146 Research Studies Affirm Naturally Acquired Immunity to Covid-19: Documented, Linked, and Quoted
If anyone would like to look it Up, please reply back to me

That’s a very old pseudoscience crank trope: List numbers of studies as though quality doesn’t matter more than sheer numbers. Also, frequently, many of the studies don’t show what the cranks claim they show, but they rely on the number to impress people, knowing that most people don’t have the inclination or knowledge to critically evaluate the studies listed.

hi. has reviewed the first 30 studies in the article. the 20 of them were either preprints or articles from the media. the studies published had no conclusion that natural immunity was preferable to vaccination. have presented this to antiwaxer and asked him if he had read any of the studies and if he had knowledge of brownstone and their agenda. he, of course, rejected my claim. I have encouraged him to be a little more critical of his source references. 🤣

“I had to stop here. I couldn’t take the ridiculousness any more.” Any chance you could explain why it’s ridiculous?

“Madej believes the tentacled entity she found in the Moderna jabs has a connection with the organism hydra vulgaris.” Precisely, she suggested there was a connection and she did not say it was hydra vulgaris. You have created a straw man argument. Anyway, if it wasn’t a hydra vulgaris what was it and what business does it have being in what is touted as a vaccine?

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